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Eldritch Horror» Forums » Rules

Subject: Blunderbuss and Physical Resistance rss

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Michal K
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Hello.

Physical Resistance wrote:
"When resolving a Combat
Encounter against a Monster with the Physical Resistance
ability, an investigator cannot apply any bonus to his die
pool except from Magical possessions or Spells.

Effects that allow the investigator to reroll dice or manipulate
dice results can be used as normal."

Blunderbuss wrote:
When resolving a Combat Encounter, you may gain +2 Strength. If you do, each 6 you roll when resolving a Strength test during a Combat Encounter counts as 2 successes and each 1 negates 1 success."


Can you use the Blunderbuss special 6 and 1 effect when you CANNOT gain the +2 Strength bonus, because of Physical Resistance?
 
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Magister Germanicus
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No. Check out the text again, the "if you do" portion answers your question.
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Krzysiek Domański
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Smichi wrote:
Can you use the Blunderbuss special 6 and 1 effect when you CANNOT gain the +2 Strength bonus, because of Physical Resistance?
You can always gain that bonus, and Blunderbuss's secondary effect with it.
Physical resistance only prevents you from applying the bonus, but the effect remains unaffected.
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Michal K
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That is some next level Lawyerism

Thanks for the replies.
 
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Tim M
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From the official FAQ:

Quote:
Q: What effect are negated by Physical Resistance and Magical Resistance?

A. When resolving a Combat Encounter against a Monster with Physical Resistance or Magical Resistance, an investigator cannot apply bonuses to his dice pool as described in the Mountains of Madness rulesheet.
Bonuses are effect on cards or other components that grant extra dice when testing a skill. Bonuses are always written with the following format: “Gain +X Skill” where X is the number of dice and Skill is the affected skill. For example, the .38 Revolver Asset says, “Gain +2 Strength"


Since bonuses are always written in the "gain +X skill" format, it sounds to you cannot apply the entire "Gain +2 strength" line to a physically resistant monster. Ergo no blunderbuss secondary ability.

User above wrote....
Quote:
Physical resistance only prevents you from applying the bonus, but the effect remains unaffected.


The FAQ text suggests the bonus *is* the effect. The bonus does not grant an effect; the bonus is an actual effect itself. If physical resistance prevents you from applying the bonus, then it prevents "the effect" because they are the same thing.
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Krzysiek Domański
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@iceysnowman I advise you to go to FFG site, and ask Nikki Valens for clarification.
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Scott Dockery
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iceysnowman wrote:
Since bonuses are always written in the "gain +X skill" format, it sounds to you cannot apply the entire "Gain +2 strength" line to a physically resistant monster. Ergo no blunderbuss secondary ability.


Again, though, there's a difference between "gaining" a bonus and "applying" it. You can use any cards that let you gain a bonus to the required skill, but you only apply the highest applicable number. For instance, if you have both a Blunderbuss and a Carbine Rifle, you can use both cards at once: You'd get both the Carbine's +5 bonus and the Blunderbuss's high variance, even though you're not strictly applying the Blunderbuss's +2 bonus.
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Magister Germanicus
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Again, see the Blunderbuss's wording: "if you do". You can only use the secondary feature of the blunderbuss "if you do" apply the bonus.
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Xelto G
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Tell you all what. I've sent off a message to FFG on the question; I'll let you know what the response is some time tomorrow.


Update: the response I got was missing most of the message, including everything that was important. I sent a second request off, but may not be near a computer for the next couple days, so I may not be able to post an answer until then.
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Davy Ashleydale
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So I guess we're talking about a situation where someone is fighting a Monster with Physical Resistance and they want to be able to use their Blunderbuss for its special ability even though they know the +2 Strength part won't give them any additional dice. Like, if they want to make it possible to get more successes than they normally could (even at the risk of rolling 1s to negate successes).

Yeah, I think it hinges on what "if you do" means. It's either "If you do choose to use the Blunderbuss..." or it's "If you are able to benefit from the +2 Strength...".

My guess is that it's the former because I think we would all agree that if you had a Blunderbuss and another Weapon that gave you +4 Strength, you would add 4 to your Strength and your 6s would count double and your 1s would negate. That's how we normally combine Items in Combat.

But if that's the correct interpretation, I wish they had worded Blunderbuss a little differently. Like, "Use of the Blunderbuss is optional. If you use it when resolving a Combat Encounter, gain +2 Strength, but each 6 you roll when resolving a Strength test during a Combat Encounter counts as 2 successes and each 1 negates 1 success."
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Amos Boris
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Was there ever an official response from Nikki on this question?
 
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Le Roux Van Der Vyver
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Ok so, still new to this forum and my I only internet so so.

On this thread:
https://community.fantasyflightgames.com/topic/129443-magic-...

Nikki seems to have said the following:

"An investigator can use each component action no more than once per round. That is to say, he can use the “Action:” effect of each card once per round. If an investigator has two copies of the same component action, he may perform each of those actions once per round.

In your example, the investigator may use the action of both of his Dog Sled Unique Assets and/or both of his Old Journal Unique Assets in the same round.

Likewise, if your investigator and another investigator have the Detained Condition and are in the same space, you could perform the action of your own Detained Condition, and if successful, you could also perform the action of the other investigator’s Detained Condition in the same round.


The Storm of Spirits Spell allows an investigator to test Lore in place of Strength during Combat Encounters. This is not a bonus, and as such, it is unaffected by Magical Resistance or Physical Resistance.

Bonuses are effects on cards or other components that grant extra dice when testing a skill. Bonuses are always written with the following format: “Gain +X [Skill]” where X is the number of dice and [Skill] is the affected skill. For example, the .38 Revolver Asset says, “Gain +2 [Strength] …”

Bonuses are negated by Physical Resistance and Magical Resistance as described in the Mountains of Madness Rulesheet.

Any other effects that allow rerolls (such as the Lucky Rabbit’s Foot), dice manipulation (such as the Lucky Cigarette Case), or “additional dice” (such as Jim and Agnes’s passive abilities) still apply.

If the investigator uses the Storm of Spirits Spell to test Lore in place of Strength, his bonuses to Strength no longer apply, but his bonuses to Lore will. These bonuses may be negated by resistance following the same rules. If the component granting the bonus is a Spell or has the MAGICAL trait, it is negated by Magical Resistance. If it is not a Spell and does not have the MAGICAL trait, it is negated by Physical Resistance.

Ultimately, these Monsters are only resistant, not completely immune."

Sorry not sure about the /q, if anyone can fix somehow please do!

Anyhoo, I put the whole thing there for clarity, but the logic at the bottom seems to indicate that immunity (both physical and magical) provides a monster protection from a bonus during the "Strength" test of a combat encounter. (Possibly more aptly named the "Monster/Investigator could potentially lose health from this" test).

Based on that, I would say that the blunderbuss would provide all of its other effects. There is that little "...gain +2 Strength. If you do..." which could lead to additional questions. I would say then that in order:

- "you may gain +2 Strength"
- Wooohoo I gain 2 Strength!
- If you do, each 6 you roll when resolving...
- Woohoo more cool stuff!
- Determine my dice pool to fight this nasty thing.
- My dice pool is based off my Strength... but wait! It has physical resistance. Better only use my base Strength for dice pool here.
- Rolls 6 6 3. Yay I scored 4 Successes due to special effect!


Thematically I would say that the Bonus a Weapon or item gives you increases your likelihood in succeeding in a task which requires that skill. So a tome helps me cast magic, a gun to kill things etc, an ally with physical tasks (Combat encounters vs Gain +X Strength). Since the world is weird and wonderful, there are lots of ways things can help us, whiskey won't help me cast a spell, but it might help me deal with the effects of it! So I would say some monsters have physical resistance, so anything that I was going to use that would help me overcome it in a purely physical confrontation is now of little use. However, anything that was going to aid me in the task of fighting the monster, not making me physically stronger, but more equipped to fight (represented by rerolls, add to dice result etc) would still help. And the Blunderbuss would still apply.

If anyone else has heard otherwise please shout! Still waiting on my expansion, but really amped!

This last part is so off topic, but I realised it whilst thinking about the thematics of this so ill put it here. Maybe someone can move it to where it needs to be (I realise that sentence invites removal hehehe).

Thematic Justification for Single Bonus on Skill Test in Eldritch Horror:

Investigators have different values assigned to their attributes to indicate the likelihood of success when attempting a task that requires this attribute. If you are strong you are more likely to succeed at moving a heavy boulder, but you could still fail and someone weaker succeed. This is represented by dice, just like a single die can result in a success and four dice failing to succeed. When items/effects give you a bonus to an attribute they increase your likelihood of success, a gun will help you to kill something you were going to fight with your fists. A bodyguard will help you kill something in a fight as well as other physical tasks. If you faced a monster and you had a gun and a bodyguard, you might give the bodyguard the gun or you might take it yourself. You, your bodyguard and your gun still need to kill a monstrosity. If you had an arsenal with you, you could still only use two hands and two feet along with one brain. Your chances of killing a monster using a rifle will likely be low, just because there is a pistol in your pocket you are not more likely to succeed. If you had a base statistic of Speed that indicated how fast you could walk, it could be increased by a bicycle and it could be increased by a motorcycle. However, if a person who had a motorcycle received a bicycle they would not be able to get around even faster than before they had the bicycle.

Felt like popping that out on the keyboard, feels good man. Single bonus thing bugged me for a while, in case it does anyone else hope that doesn't seem too crazy!
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