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Subject: Fighting with the dice-variant rss

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Captain Twietie
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Tiny Epic Kingdoms was our favourite holiday-game. We played it several times and found out that it really needs the expansion "Hero's Call" to block the secure winning strategy of building the tower. That's job well done by the producers.

But there is another issue...

One thing never could satisfy me in TEK: the way war is handled. From the very moment I read the rulebook I was dissapointed. And a first try out convinced me. Even in such a way the game was broken for me. So I developped this variant. It has been playtested by several groups and everybody found it a great improvement. It even delivered some of the most exited moments of in the game. So I post them here.



Tiny Epic Kingdoms Fighting dice variant


This variant replaces the first paragraph “War” on p. 8 of the rulebook.

War

If your Meeple enters a Region with another Meeple, a war is started. You and an opponent each take a War Die and secretly set it face up to your number of War Die rolls (maximum 11). You must be able to pay for your War Die-rolls. Mana is worth 2 and each ore is worth 1. Add to this number any bonus from your faction warring. Keep in mind that your final number of war die rolls cannot surpass 11. A flag means you offer peace and you pay nothing. Now both players reveal their War Die roll-number simultaneously.
If both players showed a number on the war die, they both pay their war effort with their markers. Then the attacker starts the War Die duel. His number of War Die rolls offers him now that number of opportunities to roll the war die. After each roll he decides to keep that specific number as his warpower or to roll again. If he used up all of his War Die rolls, he has to keep the last number. A flag reads zero. Now his opponent can uses his war die rolls to get a higher total war power, applying the same procedure. The highest total war power wins. In case of a tie the defender wins.
If only 1 player showed a number and his opponent a flag, then the first wins automatically after paying his war effort. Of course, the flag-shower pays nothing.
If both players showed a flag, then the alliance procedure starts, as described in the normal rules.


meeple

[i]Reading this forums, I know that lots of people like the way TEK as it is. They are right and I respect their point of view. I just want to share this variant with whoever wants to try it. Reactions are welcome. I respect the work of the author(s) and publisher, but this houserule take this game for me from "meeuh..." to "Yippie!".
Way better then resale it.
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Aernout Casier
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TEK is not a war game.
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Wolfram Troeder
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AernoutMJC wrote:
TEK is not a war game.

Irrelevant.
Missing the point.
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Emils E
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I think it would make sense that if one player shows a flag and the other number, then a player who showed a flag gets 1 roll (and maybe the result is divided by 2 rounded down).
 
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Aernout Casier
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Wolfram wrote:
AernoutMJC wrote:
TEK is not a war game.

Irrelevant.
Missing the point.

Glad that you think so. On both occasions.
Since the focus in this post (and in most proposed "fixes" for TEK) seems to be on war, I do think that pointing out that TEK was never intended to be a war game ís relevant. Especially since the fix moves the game towards a war game (using die rolls to solve a battle).
But hey, what do I know.
 
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Captain Twietie
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If you read the rulebook carefully, you will notice the title "war" for that paragraph. Tiny Epic Kingdoms has elements of conflict, hence the actions "patrol" and "quest". TEK has the aspect of "war" covered although it does not focus on that aspect as in other more conlict orientated games.
Even during playtesting our war-die-house-rule we learned that war
a) is costly
b) can help
c) but is no guarantee for a win; On the contrary, even with our house-rule, if you have only war on your mind, you surely will loose the game.
The main reason for adding the house rule is
d) more fun!





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Aernout Casier
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I understand that. As you yourself say, TEK is not the most war-oriented game. Some players seem to be disappointed in that aspect. I quite like how finally war is not solved by chucking dice but by simply spending resources. It both feels elegant and fair + it saves time. It is also adds an element of risk (how weak do you want to leave yourself) and makes the timing of other actions pretty crucial.

In your variant, do (both) players have to announce the number of resources they are committing to war prior to rolling the die?
 
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Captain Twietie
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to Aernout Casier:

Yes, they show their dice and pay at once.

to Paul:
Downtime was never a problem with our playtesting groups (4 to 5 players)
War-dice-rolls occured only between 3 to 7 times during a game.
It took only 1 to 2 minutes to resolve a battle.
Even with the war-dice-roll you have to be smart on the resource-aspect.
You not only have to think about the current battle, but also with the following possible attack. In the original version it always happenend that whoever was involved in a war, surely was the next victim because the spent most of the times al their resource. With the war-dice-roll, as a defender you can hope to survive with 3 rolls. As an attacker 4 rolls is a starter, 5 better. Don't waste all possible rolls, because this turn your are the attacker, but next turn you can be the defender.
But you are right on 1 point: the war-dice-rolls are a handicap for the gamer who wants to calculate everything upfront in a safe way. Personaly, I don't fancy that way. The reason I stopped playing chess.
All respect for chess and go-players. I'm just no smart enough to match up with them. I adore a bit of luck, because that reflects real life.
Unless your name is Jack Reacher, you don't know what's gonna happen when you punch a face of a rather strong bloke accompanied by his thug-friends.

arrrh

So Aernhout and Paul, you respect the way the game is intended. Good point. I only wanted to offer a suggestion for an optional way of play, for whoever wants it.

And I 'm always interessed in reactions. After all that's what BGG-forums are all about: exploring & discussing.
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