$20.00
$5.00
$15.00
Recommend
11 
 Thumb up
 Hide
511 Posts
1 , 2 , 3 , 4 , 5  Next »  [21] | 

BoardGameGeek» Forums » Gaming Related » General Gaming

Subject: Bias from Board Game Reviewers rss

Your Tags: Add tags
Popular Tags: [View All]
Josh Walton
United States
Ada
Ohio
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Of course they're biased. All reviews are just opinions. The key for the viewer is to understand a particular reviewer's biases and adjust accordingly.

Now if you're suggesting that Tom is deliberate saying a game is better than he actually thinks it is because of his relationship or interest in the designer then no, I don't think that's happening at all. If you watch enough Dice Tower you can see that the types of games Eric Lang makes are exactly the types of games that Tom loves.
  • [+] Dice rolls
mortego
United States
New Kensington
Pennsylvania
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Tom does smash games every now & again....
Re: Gnip Gnop comes to mind
whistle
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Chapel
United States
Round Rock
Texas
flag msg tools
"32 inches of Plexi....for your pleasure"
mbmbmbmb
I'm biased, you're biased, we are all biased. The trick is not to take others opinion as the gold standard. It's not.
83 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Francisco Gutierrez
United States
Burbank
California
flag msg tools
"A pilot's greatest virtue is to know when to run" -- "What's this, a joke?"
mbmbmbmbmb
What a foolish complaint. Reviews are not meant to be unbiased; I don't watch the Dice Tower to get a "neutral perspective" on the game, I want to see what Tom/ Sam / Zee / whoever thought of the game.

A truely unbiased review would be meaningless, just stating imperial facts.

"Bloodbourne is a dice game, meaning it is a game where you roll dice. it may or may not be fun. The rules may be complicated, but then again they may not be, I cannot speak for everyone"
68 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Charles Boyung
United States
Brookfield
Wisconsin
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Ah, is it that time of month again? How long has it been since the last post complaining that reviewers have opinions?

BGG doesn't seem complete without someone regularly complaining that "they liked a game that I don't like".
37 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
K S
United States
Tonawanda
New York
flag msg tools
mbmbmb
DouglasLondon wrote:
So do you guys think Dice Tower is biased?

Yes, obviously. It is a review.

DouglasLondon wrote:
If so does it matter?

Yes, obviously: reviewers SHOULD be biased. A dispassionate, objective description of a game's theme, mechanics, and components is of limited value to me. I want people who enjoy playing boardgames to tell me how the game makes them feel.

DouglasLondon wrote:
Are there any reviewers you find to be unbiased?

No, but I don't want unbiased reviewers: I want responsible ones. Responsible reviewers are forthright about where their personal biases lie, and I think that Tom and the Dice Tower crew do this admirably (not just in this video, but in general). This review wasn't an unmitigated praise fest: Zee stated that he did not enjoy the game and explained why. Tom and Sam said that they did and they explained why. This is how reviews ought to go. This review was valuable to me. It's up to me as the review watcher to listen to the explanations given and decide whether the game appeals to me based on the biased evidence I have been presented. In this case, the game does not, but I do not fault Tom and Sam for having different tastes from my own.

DouglasLondon wrote:
Lots of people are calling out Tom Vasel for overhyping and blindly loving every Eric Lang game.

Haters gonna hate. Tom clearly states that he was disinclined to enjoy this game due to its theme, but that after playing, its mechanics won him over. Doesn't sound like blind fanboyism to me, regardless of whether you agree with his assessment or not.


DouglasLondon wrote:
For me I began to notice this with Dice Masters. Tom hyped it up as the greatest game in years and most people I know who have played it have thought it was "meh".

I see where you're coming from here. On first blush, I wasn't interested in Dice Masters. However, after seeing its rating on BGG, reviews by Tom and others, and learning more about it (superheroes + deck construction + pool building + dueling + dice rolling!) I decided to pick it up on clearance and give it a go. So far, I am underwhelmed. However, I don't think that Tom's (or anybody else's) review lead me astray: I just think that not every game is for every player.
44 
 Thumb up
0.05
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
K S
United States
Tonawanda
New York
flag msg tools
mbmbmb
joetaco wrote:
"Bloodbourne is a dice game, meaning it is a game where you roll dice. it may or may not be fun. The rules may be complicated, but then again they may not be, I cannot speak for everyone"


"This game uses cards. Here is a card with a sword. This card has a person. Each of these cards fulfills a function in the game."
11 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
lampeter
United States
Pennsylvania
flag msg tools
designer
mbmbmbmbmb
I find Tom's reviews valuable because

A. He has done so many reviews that it is easy to get a handle on how his tastes do and don't align with my own. I find his reviews and top 10s entertaining enough to watch enough of them to get the big picture.

This means, for instance, that when he reviews a party game as the best ever, I know not to bother, even if he makes it sound interesting, because I don't really enjoy party games.

B. Tom is generally very articulate about what he does and does not like about a game, and his descriptions of play are clear and concise. (Plus his format is really straightforward-- if you want to focus on the gameplay section, you can guess which part of the video to skip to, etc.)

Tom and Zee gave The Hobbit: Enchanted Gold a scathing review because the game has a lot of luck and absolutely no connection to the theme. From their review, however, I was able to determine that my kids would enjoy it all the more for its flaws, and they do.

Honestly, I feel little pity for those who are blindly swayed by the opinions of others (and then blame those people for having opinions they don't share?) If you don't like getting your information from reviews, watch something like Watch It Played. Also good videos, but for me they are too long if I am just browsing. For me, watching reviews is a valuable part of researching a game, but it is only a part of the research.
31 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
K S
United States
Tonawanda
New York
flag msg tools
mbmbmb
motoyugota wrote:
Ah, is it that time of month again?

Wait...is this a PMS joke?
6 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Michael Hyland

Waterville
Maine
msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Yeah, they really like Eric Lang so it's hard for them to remove themselves from that and be completely objective. Same thing with coolminiornot games. I think they give CMoN more of a pass on their mediocre stuff. The euro bias is also well known, though I think they consciously try to be more objective about that one.

Also the three of them together tends to be like preaching to the choir. They have the same opinions 99 percent of the time which doesn't really add much to the segment. They tend to just reinforce each other's opinions so it seems like they can glorify a game, or gang up on one in that segment.

Anyway, since I know their bias it's easier to put it in perspective. ie I don't take Tom's opinion of a Euro seriously unless he likes it. I don't pay much attention to their CMoN reviews, and Eric Lang reviews.

What really catches my eye about them quite frankly is when they don't like an ameritrash game - usually a very good sign it's pretty bad - or when they like a Euro game. In the latter case it's probably a solid medium or light Euro. The rest of the opinions I need some other perspectives for sure. I'm glad they are doing what they do and it's still very useful, just like with anything it's one data point. I try not to base too much on one data point.

The general bias for 90 percent of reviews is to give a slightly positive review even if the game isn't that great or there are better examples already in existence out there. That's the main problem I have with most reviews. Serviceable or mediocre games tend to get favorable reviews rather than unfavorable comparisons to better choices already in existence. It's like a lot of reviewers review a game in a vacuum as if there are no other better choices available. In that situation mediocre or not quite as good looks a lot better.
14 
 Thumb up
0.25
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Thom0909
United States
New York
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Macrawn wrote:
Yeah, they really like Eric Lang so it's hard for them to remove themselves from that and be completely objective. Same thing with coolminiornot games. I think they give CMoN more of a pass on their mediocre stuff. The euro bias is also well known, though I think they consciously try to be more objective about that one.


But what does that even mean, though, being objective in a review? How can a review be objective?
6 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Francisco Gutierrez
United States
Burbank
California
flag msg tools
"A pilot's greatest virtue is to know when to run" -- "What's this, a joke?"
mbmbmbmbmb
Macrawn wrote:
Yeah, they really like Eric Lang so it's hard for them to remove themselves from that and be completely objective...
...It's like a lot of reviewers review a game in a vacuum as if there are no other better choices available. In that situation mediocre or not quite as good looks a lot better...


Really? whistle

Not trying to pick on you in particular Michael, but this the "problem" with objective reviewing. You can't have reviewers simultaniously "ignoring their favorite games" while "comparing games to other games."
5 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Francisco Gutierrez
United States
Burbank
California
flag msg tools
"A pilot's greatest virtue is to know when to run" -- "What's this, a joke?"
mbmbmbmbmb
wamsp wrote:
joetaco wrote:
"Bloodbourne is a dice game, meaning it is a game where you roll dice. it may or may not be fun. The rules may be complicated, but then again they may not be, I cannot speak for everyone"


"This game uses cards. Here is a card with a sword. This card has a person. Each of these cards fulfills a function in the game."


Nice. You and me, Wamsp, we'll start our "Neutral Reviews" channel and split the no money, 50/ 50
4 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Charles Boyung
United States
Brookfield
Wisconsin
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
wamsp wrote:
motoyugota wrote:
Ah, is it that time of month again?

Wait...is this a PMS joke?


Actually, no. I was just playing off "is it that time of year already" but was going for something more frequent since the topic has been beaten to death about ten times already this year alone.
11 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Liam
Scotland
flag msg tools
admin
I am BGG's official honey trap
mbmbmbmbmb
Tom and the Dice Tower team are always right about what they like...

They're often wrong about what I like.

+1 We're all bias but more importantly; all reviews are subjective.
52 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
France
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Tom stated up front who his favourite designer is so no secrets there, these shows are edited before release so Zee's dislike could of been removed or done again. All reviewers show some bias even if its only in the games they select to review, I see no problems here nothing has been hidden so you have all the facts to form your own opinion.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jacob Schoberg
United States
Elkhorn
Wisconsin
flag msg tools
when i get home, i'm so tired
badge
just roll over, please. i'm so tired. just roll over, please. i'm so tired.
mbmbmbmbmb
Shocking development: people like different stuff. Full story on page 10 of this thread.
37 
 Thumb up
0.25
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
K S
United States
Tonawanda
New York
flag msg tools
mbmbmb
joetaco wrote:
Nice. You and me, Wamsp, we'll start our "Neutral Reviews" channel and split the no money, 50/ 50

"Neutral Reviews by Franciso & K: Completely objective, depending on how you look at it."
14 
 Thumb up
6.00
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Mark Smith

Colchester
essex
msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
The dice tower reviews a prolific amount of games compared to others which is good for our hobby anyway, regardless of any possible bias or point of views.
If you watch these reviews a lot you will notice that the main mix of Tom ,Sam and Zee bring different angles and preferences so in actual fact it is possibly one of the few online reviews sources that is actually non bias in most respects.
Of the three guys I lean towards Zees point of view more often personally.
Sams gaming views rub off on you and I admit to being a fan of most Zombie games too.
At the same time if I like the look of a family/group game Tom seems to nail the bare bones of it better in really tight neat video reviews.

For the record I really liked Harbour, Aquasphere ,Kingdom Builder and March of the ants and still love watching the reviews.
There are other very good reviewers out there that lean toward different types of games (euros,solitaire,miniatures etc.)but this makes them an awesome resource for us as game buyers and players.
At the end of the day it probably does not matter to some. but gaming in general would be a lot less informed or entertaining without them , bias or not.
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Dennis Engilis
United States
Elk Grove
California
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Dice Tower's "Final Thoughts" or the review portion of the games are far less important and valuable to me regardless of who is doing them than the portion where they show how a game is played which I do find valuable in deciding if it's a game I want to get and play. If all the videos did was review/critique them then I probably wouldn't watch them.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Look on my works ye mighty and despair
United Kingdom
Huddersfield
West Yorkshire
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
DouglasLondon wrote:

Are there any reviewers you find to be unbiased?


The ones that just list components and summarise the rules.
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Pete
United States
Northbrook
Illinois
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
DouglasLondon wrote:
for a mediocre game
How did you come up with this assessment?

Pete (wonders if your assessment is unbiased)
40 
 Thumb up
1.25
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Charles Boyung
United States
Brookfield
Wisconsin
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Macrawn wrote:

Also the three of them together tends to be like preaching to the choir. They have the same opinions 99 percent of the time which doesn't really add much to the segment. They tend to just reinforce each other's opinions so it seems like they can glorify a game, or gang up on one in that segment.


What in the world are you talking about? They all have VERY different tastes in games. Yes, there are some games where they will all agree, but those tend to be the best of the best games, not just every game.
7 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Kyle
Canada
Toronto
flag msg tools
Show me something that beats a natural 20 and I'll show you hateful lies.
badge
mbmbmbmbmb
The us no way to objectively review a game as they are hard on our experiences and preferences.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Chris Kohlman
Canada
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
All reviewers have some bias---it is human nature. When you get to know a reviewer, you can sort through some of it to see their tendencies.

My issue with some reviewers is reviewing games that their sponsor publishes. In that case, I would either choose not to review it or call it something else, such as a feature. I listen to one podcast where they pump their sponsors games fairly regularly and occasionally review them. As soon as they start into a review and identify the publisher, I skip over the review because I don't think I'll get the objectivity from them that I am used to getting.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
1 , 2 , 3 , 4 , 5  Next »  [21] | 
Front Page | Welcome | Contact | Privacy Policy | Terms of Service | Advertise | Support BGG | Feeds RSS
Geekdo, BoardGameGeek, the Geekdo logo, and the BoardGameGeek logo are trademarks of BoardGameGeek, LLC.