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Legendary: A Marvel Deck Building Game» Forums » General

Subject: Ranking the sets, post Civil War edition! rss

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Adelin Dumitru
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Use whatever criteria you want, this is supposed to be a fun thread, not necessarily the most informative for potential new players, since my ranking at least will be entirely subjective, and I expect others to be too. I, for one, won't take into account how "user-friendly" the sets are, which basically translates into a low ranking for Dark City.

Without further ado, here it is! My newest ranking of the Legendary sets (both heroic and villains lines included):

1. Civil War. I've played it only a couple of times, but gosh! It is fun! It is unique! It is interesting! It is so complex! The villains are so tough! Some of the schemes might be to a degree just an instance of rehashing old ones, but they are so interesting that this aspect fades away. I love the Divided cards after using them, and Fortifying villains and masterminds are a brilliant idea. The new sidekicks are ok-ish, but the wounds are something that now I feel should have been since the beginning in the game.

2. Secret Wars volume 2. Used to be my favorite, but Civil War, maybe just because it includes more content, took its place. It still remains a very good set as far as I am concerned, as I love the masterminds and the many - many keywords introduced. Still looking forward to seeing again Spectrum, Patrol or Circles of Kung Fu.

3. Captain America 75th edition. I didn't like it at first, but it turned out to be a great, very thematic set. Zola is one of the toughest masterminds out there, and I love that his attack can be reduced if you carefully plan your moves. Cap-Falc and Winter Soldier are some of my favorite heroes.

4. Fantastic Four. Maybe because it is so rare, maybe because of Focus, maybe because of Galactus and his Heralds? I hope they will reprint this someday, so that all players will be able to feel the threat of the world-devouring Galactus!

5. Fear Itself. Uru Enchanted Iron Man is still my favorite mastermind, although he might be superseded by his Civil War counterpart. Thrown Artifacts are an improvement over regular Artifacts and using at least 2 of the playable characters from that set in a setup leads to interesting combos.

6. Secret Wars volume 1. Although the two volumes are better seen as a whole, if one were to treat them as separate entities, this is still a good set, but inferior to the awesomeness of volume 2. Old Man Logan is very cool, and one of the most interesting heroes due to his reliance on strategies that involve little recruiting and eliminating most of your starting cards.

7. Villains. I'd put it above the other remaining sets just because of the beautiful playing mat, but it also brings a new, more competitive twist to the game that provides more interesting decisions to make in games, especially if you play this a lot.

8. Guardians of the Galaxy. Shards might be a bit too fiddly, but Thanos is the toughest mastermind out there to date. The 5 guardians used together are a little too good, but separate they are just the right amount of fun. I also like the schemes!

9. Dark City. This one has aged well, but I just don't feel as excited about using any of its heroes as I used to. I also don't use the masterminds from it that much, besides Apocalypse, so this might also explain its position in the list.

10. Paint the Town Red. My girlfriend is not the biggest fan of the Spider-Friends and of my looong turns when I use a team of Spider-Friends, so I don't use that set that much. However, the masterminds are a good bunch - Mysterio is not tough, but he keeps coming back, and Carnage is a pain in the bottom when he KOs that rare you've waited for all the game and finally managed to get into your deck..

11. Legendary Base Set. The one that started everything, but the one that also has many flaws, from too easy masterminds to reusing the same art on all heroes' cards. I don't use most of the contents from that set anymore, so I cannot justify putting it any higher on my list.

I'm curious to see what your rankings are! Have fun making the lists!


Edit: I might either be a victim of the "cult of the new sets", or it could just be that they keep making better and better expansions!
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Matthew Vantries
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So I just got Secret Wars (both volumes), Cap Am 75, and Civil War all at the same time, so I haven't had a ton of experience with them yet, but I have played at least 8+ times so far, so keep that in mind. Also, it's hard to compare small-box expansions to big-box expansions (obviously it's more fun/exciting to get more stuff and mechanics rather than less).

1- Civil War
Size-Changing actually feels a LOT better than I was expecting. The animal sidekicks tone down the sidekicks so they're useful, but not overpowered. I really like the Divided cards. Grievous Wounds are pretty great too. I haven't had a ton of experience with Fortify or Phasing yet.
Highlights: Stature, Speedball, Maria Hill mastermind, and the schemes.

2- Secret Wars Volume 1
Multiclass cards, bringing back Teleport, villains that get added to your deck, playable masterminds! Unfortunately the sidekick cards are too powerful (thanks Civil War for fixing that!).
Highlights: Black Bolt, zombies, MODOK

3- Secret Wars Volume 2
Spectrum, continues the goodness from Volume 1. I love having some obscure characters, but I feel like this set went a bit overboard with that.
Highlights: Agent Venom, Beast, schemes.

4- Captain America 75th Anniversary
I love (Wo)Man Out of Time. Savior seems cool in theory, but in execution so far, I'm not won over yet.
Highlights: Cap Am 1941, two new shield characters, Baron Heinrich Zemo, schemes.

5 (tied)- Fear Itself
Thrown Artifacts are a nice evolution of artifacts. I know nothing about the theme, so it's not a highlight for me. And going along with that, the art style is all too much of the same. Also, I like Nul Smash.
Highlights: Nul, getting six heroes in a small-box expansion.

5 (tied)- Guardians of the Galaxy
I love the artifacts although I feel like they haven't explored the design space enough yet (even counting Thrown Artifacts). I also really like the shards.
Highlights: Artifacts, Shards, Thanos

7- Paint the Town Red
Feast (and by extension, Carnage) is brutal.........I LOVE IT! Only one of the characters really gets me excited but this set has two of the best masterminds in the game!
Highlights: Spider-Woman, Carnage, Mysterio

8- Dark City
Teleport (although it almost feels too powerful), Versatile, first introduction of Unique Bystanders. Mechanically the set is actually kinda bland. I mean it was a critical set to get the base game up to snuff (and to add some missing essential characters). It's "meat and potatoes" (which is essential, but not exciting).
Highlights: Domino, Ghost Rider

9- Villains
Technically there's nothing wrong with this, but for being such a big set, there's not much that excites me. I do like Dodge and, umm, that one card of Loki's. In the broader sense, I do like that this set is more "take-that" than the other sets.
Highlights: Enchantress, Kingpin, Magneto

10- Fantastic Four
TOO MUCH FOCUS! It's an ok ability, but c'mon, all five characters have it. Oh, the artwork is terrible in this set. The only good point is Galactus.
Highlights: Galactus

I don't think it's fair to rate the base set. I do think if the cards had unique art and the base set were more difficult, it could have won over a ton more fans than it already has.
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David A
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I'm almost the opposite of Adelin, my list is predominantly older sets at the top. I feel that UDE, in an effort to "stay fresh" is trying too hard and almost ignoring the tried-and-true equation that got them to this point and earned the game's popularity.

Rather than specify why my list ranks things they way they are here, I'll just say my ranking is this way for my own reasons, many of which are known from other threads anyway.

1. Base Set
2. Fantastic Four
3. Dark City
4. Guardians of the Galaxy
5. Paint the Town Red
6. Secret Wars, Volume 1
7. Secret Wars, Volume 2
8. Civil War
9. Captain America 75th Anniversary
10. Fear Itself
11. Villains

To be honest, depending on what day you catch me, my #2 and #3 choices can easily flip-flop -- they're on pretty much the same level for me.
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Matthew Vantries
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Thud105 wrote:
I feel that UDE, in an effort to "stay fresh" is trying too hard and almost ignoring the tried-and-true equation that got them to this point and earned the game's popularity.

What exactly is the "tried-and-true equation that got them to this point" that they're almost ignoring?
Cuz I would have thought that it was two-fold (neither aspect of which they've abandoned or strayed from):
1- Make a game based on the Marvel license featuring everybody's favorite characters.
2- Keep it fresh by coming out with new mechanics/features and ways to play.
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David A
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Burnham wrote:
What exactly is the "tried-and-true equation that got them to this point" that they're almost ignoring?
Cuz I would have thought that it was two-fold (neither aspect of which they've abandoned or strayed from):
1- Make a game based on the Marvel license featuring everybody's favorite characters.
2- Keep it fresh by coming out with new mechanics/features and ways to play.

1- Fair enough. I wasn't thinking of that aspect, though now that you mention it, there have been some very popular/favorite characters that people have been clamoring for and instead we get obscure ones or ones that aren't affiliated properly or something else. It can't be because of licensing or ignorance, because those characters exist in UDE's other Marvel Deck game.
2- This is the one I was thinking of when I made that statement. Again, they've already created a lot of great mechanics that they have introduced and then completely abandoned in favor of trying to constantly find all new mechanics despite the fact that the fans have been begging for more applications of those (apparently) now orphaned ones.

But this is getting off the topic of the rankings of the sets
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Itai Rosenbaum
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Ok, this is a tough one, and there's many fluctuations in the list. But as it stands right now:

1. Base Set - I know it might be cheesy, but without this - none of us would be here. So respect where respect is due. It's also a testament to the base set that it established such a wonderful design space that it can be jigged and rejigged constantly without breaking or even splitting at the seams.

2. Dark City - still the best expansion to date. Other expansions may have better singular aspects - cool mechanics, exciting schemes, etc, but as a complete package - none stand up to Dark City. I'd even go as far as saying that not only is Dark City the best Legendary expansion - it's also the best board game expansion, period.

3. Secret Wars, Volume 2 - This set introduces some of my favorite mechanics in the game - Specturm, Patrol and Charge. While neither is my absolute favorite, it's the fact that there's so many of them in the set that give it the leg up over the next entry. Plus, its schemes and Masterminds were absolutely fantastic.

4. Fantastic Four - In a word "Focus". What remains, to this day, the best keyword in the entire damned game. The true tragedy of FF is not the lack of availability - it's that Focus was never reused. Add to that 5 of the most iconic Marvel characters and a kick-ass Mastermind, and this set earns the top spot of the small expansions.

5. Spidey - My favorite Marvel character got a set that was just ok, but I can't in good conscience put this set any lower on the list. Plus, I absolutely love Mysterio - proof that a Mastermind doesn't have to have double-digit fight value to be difficult.

6. Civil War - I've only played two matches with this set, and so far, it's seems like this is the place for it. It's got some interesting things about it (I love Fortify and the Divided cards), some great heroes, but also a bunch of things in the negative column. The rehashed schemes for one, plus the strange decision to make it so unilateral hurts it.

7. Secret Wars, Volume 1 - It gets major points for introducing Ascending Masterminds, but the rest of the set is just "alright" in my book. Its main problem is that Secret Wars V2 simply improved on it and every way, taking the concepts introduced in this set - and adding another layer of polish.

8. Guardians - The main problem the Guardians set has is that it works fantastically by itself, but then starts falling apart once you mix it in with the rest. If everyone has shards, it's great - but if you need to pull them out just because one of the Heroes or villain groups uses them, it's a fiddly pain.

9. Villains - This set loses a lot of points due to being released as its own base set. If this was a regular "play as the villains" expansion, it would probably be a lot higher. As it stands, I have a whole bunch of useless cards I'm never going to use, I had to pay a whole lot more for these cards I'm never going to use, and finally - if I want to mix it in with the base, I have to retrain my brain to accept the different terminology. Annoying.

10. I get that it's Cap's 75th Anniversary, but I honestly don't think it warranted a full expansion. It's not like Cap's corner of the Marvel Universe is as rich and diverse like Spidey. It doesn't help that the set boasts the hero with the worst art in the entire game (I'm looking at you Steve Rogers, Director of SHIELD!). Add to that several missed opportunities (Why X-13 instead of Peggy? Why not give us a new Red Skull, worthy of the name?), makes this the worst set currently available.

* I own Fear Itself, but never actually played it. So I'm not sure where it fits in the list.
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Matthew Vantries
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So I just finished ranking every single playable character in the game (took a couple weeks). Based on a few criteria, I gave each character a number score. Then I averaged the scores of all the characters from each expansion. Obviously there's more to an expansion than just the new characters (masterminds, villains, schemes, new features, etc.) but based solely on the quality of the characters, here's my rankings (the numbers on the right are the average score of the characters in that set)

1- Captain America 75th Anniversary (2.1)
2- Secret Wars volume 1 (1.78)
3- Guardians of the Galaxy (1.65)
4- Civil War (1.46)
5- Dark City (1.32)
6- Secret Wars volume 2 (1.27)
7- Fantastic Four (1.2)
8- Villains (1.13)
9- Paint the Town Red (1.1)
10- Base set (.96)
11- Fear Itself (.83)


In regards to my initial rankings:
- I still hate Focus and the only thing that I really care about in F4 is Galactus.
- Fear Itself is way worse than I realized.
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David A
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IronSyndicate wrote:
1. Base Set - I know it might be cheesy, but without this - none of us would be here. So respect where respect is due. It's also a testament to the base set that it established such a wonderful design space that it can be jigged and rejigged constantly without breaking or even splitting at the seams.

This is EXACTLY why I placed the Base Set in the #1 slot as well!
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Matthew Vantries
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Thud105 wrote:
Burnham wrote:
What exactly is the "tried-and-true equation that got them to this point" that they're almost ignoring?
Cuz I would have thought that it was two-fold (neither aspect of which they've abandoned or strayed from):
1- Make a game based on the Marvel license featuring everybody's favorite characters.
2- Keep it fresh by coming out with new mechanics/features and ways to play.

1- Fair enough. I wasn't thinking of that aspect, though now that you mention it, there have been some very popular/favorite characters that people have been clamoring for and instead we get obscure ones or ones that aren't affiliated properly or something else. It can't be because of licensing or ignorance, because those characters exist in UDE's other Marvel Deck game.
2- This is the one I was thinking of when I made that statement. Again, they've already created a lot of great mechanics that they have introduced and then completely abandoned in favor of trying to constantly find all new mechanics despite the fact that the fans have been begging for more applications of those (apparently) now orphaned ones.

But this is getting off the topic of the rankings of the sets

1- While it pains me that there isn't a playable Psylocke yet, a lot (not all, but a lot) of players would be less likely to buy new expansions if they already have "regular" versions of every single character that they want.

2- So far they've brought back:
Wall Crawl
Artifacts
Demolish
"Critical Hit"
Teleport
Bribe
Sidekicks

Also, I'm pretty sure UDE is playing the long game. Maybe they're planning to bring back Focus (or preferably literally any other mechanic) but they want to pair it up with Fortify or somesuch. I want to see a bunch of old mechanics too, but not if they're not done in a new way. I want to see a new character(s) with Spectrum, but not if it feels really similar to the five characters in the game that already have that.

Anyway, I didn't mean to sound like I'm attacking you. It's just that UDE has already brought back some old mechanics and I trust them to bring back more too if it results in fun new gameplay, but not bringing it back just for the sake of bringing it back.
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Fully agree. There is no lack of old mechanics. I guess people just want to throw cap's shield... Personally I like new mechanics as they make each game feel special, but revisiting old favorites (such as focus <3) is also neat. Balance is key, and I think UDE so far has managed this pretty well.
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Max Laager
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AdelinDumitru wrote:

1. Civil War.

2. Secret Wars volume 2

3. Captain America 75th edition



what wait the new ones are in the top 3 !!! OMG OMG, summon credit card !!!
 
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Jeff Knutson
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1 - Base set - Started it all and has a lot of my favorite heroes included. Yeah, the same art on all the hero cards really sucked, but overall this game had me hooked after the first couple times I played it.

2 - Dark City - Best expansion hands down for me. Added a lot of new content that really helps make the base set shine and also included a lot of great heroes and Masterminds that I really enjoy.

3 - Fantastic Four - Great heroes, good Masterminds, and includes one of the best keywords in the game (Focus).

4 - Captain America 75th Anniversary - Has some good heroes. I like the 1941 version of Cap and Winter Soldier a lot, but really detest Agent X-13 (whom I refuse to play) and Steve Rogers Director of Shield. What really puts this set from ok, to good IMO though is the great schemes in the set.

5 - Paint the Town Red - No one thing makes this set great, but it's solid all around.

6 - Guardians of the Galaxy - Just not my thing. I really dislike the use of shards. Sure they are thematic, but too damn fiddly.

7 - Civil War - Where to even start here....some things about this set I really love (Grievous Wounds, Fortify, Phasing, Zemo Mastermind, & Falcon and Vision Heroes). Then there are some things I really dislike (Divided cards, Pet Avengers, Size Change, one sidedness of the Civil War "theme"). Despite all the hype, I think this set fell far short of expectations.

8 & 9 - Secret Wars 1 & 2 - I think there are a lot of good mechanics in this set, but I felt almost no connection to any of the Heroes included. Too obscure and weird for my tastes (Dr. Punisher, Captain and the Devil, and Soulsword Colossus anyone?)

10 & 11 - Villains & Fear Itself - The game itself is fine, but I prefer not to intermix the two sets with the Marvel Legendary sets. These are two separate games IMO and I don't particularly like combining the good and bad guys. I would totally play this as a stand alone game though.
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1. Secret Wars Vol. 1
2. Secret Wars Vol. 2
3. Fear Itself
4. Paint the Town Red
5. Civil War
6. Guardians
7. Core
8. Dark City
9. Villains
10. Captain America
11. Fantastic Four

Love Secret Wars for a variety of reasons. Mechanics are great, having the play-as-Mastermind option is great (even if I don't use it much), Sidekicks and, most of all, giving us out-of-the-box (no pun intended) content. Love actually using a big comic story and love getting super-obscure characters and concepts. Makes the game feel like it's really tied into Marvel as it continues and grows, not just someone's imagined version of what Marvel was like 20 years ago.

Fear Itself is criminally underrated for the great art, fun mechanics, and some of the best PvP stuff in the game. I think people don't give it a chance, either because it was from a stinker of a story or the ever-present complaint about playing as villains.

So it kills me to put the Villains base set so low. But the early gripes were true -- it's simply not different enough from the core set, and the differences present are really just cosmetic and ultimately meaningless. Too difficult for the increased PvP elements, of which there honestly aren't enough. Maybe one day I'll do a custom Villains set the way it should be done. Any potential collaborators interested?

Guardians might be higher, as it is very fun and building up Attack over time is useful, but sometimes the chits annoy me. I'm always worried I'll lose some.

I know people like Dark City because it's "more of the same," but to me that's synonymous with "skippable." I want something different.

Man Out of Time is too fiddly. Despite my love of obscure characters, I think 20% of a small box should be devoted to someone other than Agent X-13.

Don't see the big deal about Fantastic Four. Focus is a great idea in concept, but it never seems to work well in practice for me. Hate the art. Rarely play against Galactus. All that said, I'm still not selling it. devil

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Josh Worley
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xLVNx wrote:
Fully agree. There is no lack of old mechanics. I guess people just want to throw cap's shield... Personally I like new mechanics as they make each game feel special, but revisiting old favorites (such as focus <3) is also neat. Balance is key, and I think UDE so far has managed this pretty well.


I, along with a lot of people on here, wanted a Cap with Thrown Artifact. Now that we have about 390 different official versions of Captain America, if another one comes out WITH Thrown Artifact, people may riot. whistle
 
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Matthew Vantries
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swirlsaepi wrote:
xLVNx wrote:
Fully agree. There is no lack of old mechanics. I guess people just want to throw cap's shield... Personally I like new mechanics as they make each game feel special, but revisiting old favorites (such as focus <3) is also neat. Balance is key, and I think UDE so far has managed this pretty well.


I, along with a lot of people on here, wanted a Cap with Thrown Artifact. Now that we have about 390 different official versions of Captain America, if another one comes out WITH Thrown Artifact, people may riot. whistle

Those riots wouldn't be near as bad as if they come out with another Cap WITHOUT Thrown Artifact.
 
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swirlsaepi wrote:
xLVNx wrote:
Fully agree. There is no lack of old mechanics. I guess people just want to throw cap's shield... Personally I like new mechanics as they make each game feel special, but revisiting old favorites (such as focus <3) is also neat. Balance is key, and I think UDE so far has managed this pretty well.


I, along with a lot of people on here, wanted a Cap with Thrown Artifact. Now that we have about 390 different official versions of Captain America, if another one comes out WITH Thrown Artifact, people may riot. whistle
maybe they'll release cap with thrown artifact in a future Hydra themed villains expandsion... devil
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Justin H

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DiggetyDog46 wrote:
Don't see the big deal about Fantastic Four. Focus is a great idea in concept, but it never seems to work well in practice for me. Hate the art. Rarely play against Galactus. All that said, I'm still not selling it. devil


Haha! Totally agree on all aspects of this statement. Maybe FF is just popular because of it's out of print status? I love the idea of focus, but it doesn't really pay off the way it's implemented.
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Davy Ashleydale
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jhochges wrote:
DiggetyDog46 wrote:
Don't see the big deal about Fantastic Four. Focus is a great idea in concept, but it never seems to work well in practice for me. Hate the art. Rarely play against Galactus. All that said, I'm still not selling it. devil


Haha! Totally agree on all aspects of this statement. Maybe FF is just popular because of it's out of print status? I love the idea of focus, but it doesn't really pay off the way it's implemented.


Wow, I totally use Focus all the time! There are many times when there's nothing in the HQ that will help my deck, so I just Focus the Recruit points into something useful, like KOing starter cards, rescuing Bystanders, or drawing more cards for my next turn.
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Adelin Dumitru
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Yeah, Focus is the best keyword out there and it works pefectly fine. Rescuing people, hunting things...Marvel's first family's business
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randomlife wrote:
jhochges wrote:
DiggetyDog46 wrote:
Don't see the big deal about Fantastic Four. Focus is a great idea in concept, but it never seems to work well in practice for me. Hate the art. Rarely play against Galactus. All that said, I'm still not selling it. devil


Haha! Totally agree on all aspects of this statement. Maybe FF is just popular because of it's out of print status? I love the idea of focus, but it doesn't really pay off the way it's implemented.


Wow, I totally use Focus all the time! There are many times when there's nothing in the HQ that will help my deck, so I just Focus the Recruit points into something useful, like KOing starter cards, rescuing Bystanders, or drawing more cards for my next turn.

And if all (or just some) of that Recruit were Attack, you could be earning more points by defeating Villains or even taking out the Mastermind.
 
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Josh Worley
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DiggetyDog46 wrote:
randomlife wrote:
jhochges wrote:
DiggetyDog46 wrote:
Don't see the big deal about Fantastic Four. Focus is a great idea in concept, but it never seems to work well in practice for me. Hate the art. Rarely play against Galactus. All that said, I'm still not selling it. devil


Haha! Totally agree on all aspects of this statement. Maybe FF is just popular because of it's out of print status? I love the idea of focus, but it doesn't really pay off the way it's implemented.


Wow, I totally use Focus all the time! There are many times when there's nothing in the HQ that will help my deck, so I just Focus the Recruit points into something useful, like KOing starter cards, rescuing Bystanders, or drawing more cards for my next turn.

And if all (or just some) of that Recruit were Attack, you could be earning more points by defeating Villains or even taking out the Mastermind.


Exactly. Focus is a brilliant keyword - one of my absolute favorites for all the reasons listed above.
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Justin H

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randomlife wrote:
jhochges wrote:
DiggetyDog46 wrote:
Don't see the big deal about Fantastic Four. Focus is a great idea in concept, but it never seems to work well in practice for me. Hate the art. Rarely play against Galactus. All that said, I'm still not selling it. devil


Haha! Totally agree on all aspects of this statement. Maybe FF is just popular because of it's out of print status? I love the idea of focus, but it doesn't really pay off the way it's implemented.


Wow, I totally use Focus all the time! There are many times when there's nothing in the HQ that will help my deck, so I just Focus the Recruit points into something useful, like KOing starter cards, rescuing Bystanders, or drawing more cards for my next turn.


And those are about the only useful three of them. I guess the ultimate nullifier as well.

I'm going to maintain that focus is a great idea, but not entirely that useful in practice. My theory is if you're running a bunch of extra recruit with nothing to do with it, maybe you should have recruited different cards.

I guess I see I'm in the minority here, so I'll just sit around and play with my Artifacts, the BEST keyword:

http://upperdeckblog.com/2016/06/legendary-civil-war-preview...

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