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Old School Tactical» Forums » Rules

Subject: op fire at unit moving in open rss

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David Schubert
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Is there any bonus for firing at a unit moving in the open during op fire? I can't find any. It seems there should be. What am i missing?
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Max Jansson
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The target unit does not have any terrain modifiers, is that not bonus enough?
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David Schubert
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Not in my opinion. You don't run in the open. If you do, you die.
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Kevin L. Kitchens
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deschubert wrote:
Not in my opinion. You don't run in the open. If you do, you die.


You have to remember it's already baked into the results. Clear terrain is the baseline and the other terrain bonuses are factored off that. So if you wanted open terrain to get a -1 penalty for example you'd have to adjust all other terrain modifiers by -1 as well to keep it balanced.
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David Schubert
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How is it factored in? Units move in open and are likely to survive.
 
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Kevin L. Kitchens
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deschubert wrote:
How is it factored in? Units move in open and are likely to survive.


I just told you.

The CRT is designed with that in mind.

If you don't like it, house rule for yourself. But it's clearly ok as is.
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David Schubert
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No, you didn't tell me how it does so, just that it does. The CRT is not deadly enough for units moving in the open. It just isn't. I move guys in the open w/o worries. Only tactical level game that I do so.

There is NO modifier for moving in the open, zip. Please explain how the CRT is designed to show moving in the open is deadly.

I don't like house rules so I won't use them.

There are plenty of other tactical games I can use in OST's stead: Band of Brothers (HUGE negative for moving in open), CoH (optional but recommended rule for moving in open) are just two examples.
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Kevin L. Kitchens
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deschubert wrote:
No, you didn't tell me how it does so, just that it does. The CRT is not deadly enough for units moving in the open. It just isn't. I move guys in the open w/o worries. Only tactical level game that I do so.

There is NO modifier for moving in the open, zip. Please explain how the CRT is designed to show moving in the open is deadly.

I don't like house rules so I won't use them.

There are plenty of other tactical games I can use in OST's stead: Band of Brothers (HUGE negative for moving in open), CoH (optional but recommended rule for moving in open) are just two examples.


There is a penalty for moving is there not?

As for terrain the baseline for the table is clear terrain. So moving is clear is already addressed in the CRT. The other games you're talking about are excellent but don't use a CRT for combat just die rolls so they have to add a modifier. That modifier already has been applied in probabilities of the CRT so they don't need another one.
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David Schubert
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No. There is no penalty for the moving unit. Only for the firing unit. If the unit that is firing has a move marker on it there is a modifier (it moved in its 1st of 2 activations) there is a penalty. NOT FOR the unit actually moving.
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Shayne Logan
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Yes, Kevin is correct in that open terrain would be considered the baseline.

With most tactical maps, open terrain will comprise at least 50% of the terrain, so putting in negative modifier for so many hexes seems a stretch. In OST the negative for moving in the open is no positive modifiers to the units Defense from beneficial terrain.
Basically the same thing just applied in a different way.
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Andrew Franke
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deschubert wrote:
No, you didn't tell me how it does so, just that it does. The CRT is not deadly enough for units moving in the open. It just isn't. I move guys in the open w/o worries. Only tactical level game that I do so.

There is NO modifier for moving in the open, zip. Please explain how the CRT is designed to show moving in the open is deadly.

I don't like house rules so I won't use them.

There are plenty of other tactical games I can use in OST's stead: Band of Brothers (HUGE negative for moving in open), CoH (optional but recommended rule for moving in open) are just two examples.


Then the real gist of it is the CRT is not deadly enough for you n matter what kind of terrain they are in? COH is an optional rule because? My guess would be if you hit the results are pretty deadly in COH. 2 hits in a row and you are dead unless you rally it off.

Crossing open terrain in the games you mention do not use CRT's so the modifiers make sense. In OST the WORST thing you can do from a safety standpoint is stand in the open or God forbid Move in the open Each hex you enter creates a new Op-fire opportunity. Now if the CRT is not deadly enough for you then fair do's but how many games have you played?

I think you are hung up on a modifier and not playing through 10 or so games to see if the system and scenarios work. Just saying before you list it for sale play it more than once. Reading a set of rules and seeing it doesn't have a familiar way of dealing with a situation doesn't mean the system is wrong. The designer just said how they thought about it. Test it and decide.
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Pete Gerardy
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No system will ever simulate all aspects of tactical warfare. That said, I have found the rules as written work very well. I'm not seeing the problem the op is having in my games.
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Juan Pardo
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Not deadly enough? Have you seen the IFT? Rolling on the -2 the chances of doing casualties its high (that is firing with a lmg at long range) rolling on the 0 table its deadly. Maybe you roll very badly but from my experience firing at inf on the ground is devastating add that the -1 to the rally rolls and open ground is not where you want to be caught with inf.
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