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Glorantha: The Gods War» Forums » General

Subject: POLL: LESS PLACTIC STUFF FOR WAR, MAGIC AND SECRET GODS ? rss

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Bernard Gourion
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As i am a little disappointed that war, magic and secrets gods have been finally dismissed from the KS while a lot of plastic stuff (tokens and markers) is present while not essential to the game, i propose the following poll to see if i am alone to feel that these gods are clearly missing and that is a shame !

Poll
If you could choose, would you trade all plastic stuff stretch goals for all secret, magic and war gods stretch goals that expand each Empire and that were initially scheduled for the KS ?
  Your Answer   Vote Percent Vote Count
YES, i want Babesstergor, Wakboth and all the other magic, war and secret gods for each Empire to enrich the gameplay :)
35.6% 21
NO, i like a bling-bling game with all possible things in plastic ! :)
64.4% 38
Voters 59
This poll is now closed.   59 answers
Poll created by bengougou75
Closes: Wed Sep 14, 2016 6:00 am



Now let's vote !
 
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Sandy Petersen
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I fear you mismanaged the poll, and set it to close too soon, friend.
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Bernard Gourion
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Corrected, Sandy. My enthusiasm for this game makes me do mistakes !
 
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Danny Lamprey
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It just seems like Adding that stuff in now would only push the delivery date further back and may get lost in time and space. What's wrong with just having this game as is and then an OS2 KS of sorts further down the road?

I'm actually pleased to see how far along in development this is and was hoping to get it asap.
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Christopher Dearlove
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I want, I want, I want too. But at least I'm not using all capitals.

All that stuff would be good, but in some other thread, someone who sounded like he knew what he was talking about explained the issues.

For me personally some of the stretch goals matter, some don't. The current one for markers is one that doesn't.

I really don't want an incomplete lunar faction. What does one do with an incomplete lunar faction? (I guess the Crimson Bat could become a monster.) I don't know what difference individualised ziggurats make, but they don't grab me as critical. Missing monsters and elder races, hey. (Though having all dragonnewt stages would be good.)

But I'm hoping things will work out. Up to today, good. Today, dragging a bit but hoping when people reach their evenings that will help. Though the next target is a bigger jump than previous ones. And of course we expect a bathtub curve up at the end.
 
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Bernard Gourion
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because i don't want to wait a second KS to have these units in 2019 while i prefer to have nice plastic stuff useless to the gameplay for units that directly enhance each faction of the game ( i tend to think i have better to not live in Texas where Sandy will finish to wait for me a with a double barrelled Mossberg shotgun )
 
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Graham Robinson
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I've said no, because I want these expansions to be well thought out, with top quality minis. The Petersens have said this wasn't possible for this campaign. Fine, I'll wait for the next one...

Cheers,
Graham
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Ray
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As I understand (from Arthur's comment on it) the bottleneck is time to sculpt all the units. Do you really want to wait another x months before the kickstarter starts for more sculpts? The plastic bling doesn't require more sculpt time so having it doesnt cost us anything in sculpts lost.

Personally I want the gods (over the bling), but done proper as sculpts (in Sandy we trust). So given your two choices on the poll I'm not sure how to answer it. Your poll seems to imply we could sacrifice the plastic bling to get them but that is not true in even the smallest amount.

Arthur's comments here: Re: Where are the War Gods and the Magic Gods in the KS ???
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Chad S.
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therealbuserian wrote:
I've said no, because I want these expansions to be well thought out, with top quality minis. The Petersens have said this wasn't possible for this campaign. Fine, I'll wait for the next one...

Cheers,
Graham

^this
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Danny Lamprey
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I don't see the Petersens giving us an incomplete faction. With almost all of their KS campaigns they have added stuff that was missing just as a thank you or because they don't want to see that either.

CW Wars is my fave. But I was perfectly happy with just the base for a while. Before OS2 was even a thing, I thought it could do with upgrades. So I'm glad they are looking to give the base components some polish before adding content that doesn't seem to be fully developed at the moment and turn this thing into a two and a half year project to turn around.
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Peter Bowie
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I just want all the stuff from this Kickstarter unlocked! I want the new gods certainly, but I'm fine waiting for another Kickstarter down the line.
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Marko Parviainen
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This is kind of a needless poll as doing some plastic counters is not same as doing 24 big figures (3 per faction).

The 24 big figures would cost way more money (sculpting, building the molds) and time than a few plastic counters.

You just cannot exhange "upgrade these counters to plastic" to "add 3 Greater Gods to each faction" at the same cost of money and time.

I voted for more bling as that is the only realistic choise in this poll.
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Bernard Gourion
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ColHammer wrote:
This is kind of a needless poll as doing some plastic counters is not same as doing 24 big figures (3 per faction).

The 24 big figures would cost way more money (sculpting, building the molds) and time than a few plastic counters.

You just cannot exhange "upgrade these counters to plastic" to "add 3 Greater Gods to each faction" at the same cost of money and time.

I voted for more bling as that is the only realistic choise in this poll.


What do you call realistic ? Petersen games can say "These gods will come later because of delays in production". I am fine with that. They already have done that a lot with CW.
And i prefer to have gameplay oriented strech goals than decorative ones. It's all the more valuable that these units affect directly each faction. They aren't just "one more GOO" stretch goals that will end barely used compared to new factions or units for factions.
 
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Danny Lamprey
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bengougou75 wrote:
ColHammer wrote:
This is kind of a needless poll as doing some plastic counters is not same as doing 24 big figures (3 per faction).

The 24 big figures would cost way more money (sculpting, building the molds) and time than a few plastic counters.

You just cannot exhange "upgrade these counters to plastic" to "add 3 Greater Gods to each faction" at the same cost of money and time.

I voted for more bling as that is the only realistic choise in this poll.


What do you call realistic ? Petersen games can say "These gods will come later because of delays in production". I am fine with that. They already have done that a lot with CW.
And i prefer to have gameplay oriented strech goals than decorative ones. It's all the more valuable that these units affect directly each faction. They aren't just "one more GOO" stretch goals that will end barely used compared to new factions or units for factions.


It's clear that you would prefer to have the figures over the upgraded components. The problem with it in terms of chucking out the upgraded components and adding a large amount of huge figures at this point would not only delay the production timeline but probably raise the cost for backers as well as the Petersens. I'm not a game publisher so I have no idea if it is really a feasible thing or not. I'm sure they could give you a better answer. I personally feel that adding them now is only going to prolong a process that is already prone to delays, cost everyone more money and probably raise the already concerning shipping costs for some.

The Petersens always do good by their customers and products. So I'd rather wait for polished, definitive gameplay features and add ons while having the base game with great components. Part of the OS2 campaign's focus was on upgraded components because everyone wanted them. So "realistic" seems like a pretty good term here.
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Bernard Gourion
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Digmecolder wrote:
bengougou75 wrote:
ColHammer wrote:
This is kind of a needless poll as doing some plastic counters is not same as doing 24 big figures (3 per faction).

The 24 big figures would cost way more money (sculpting, building the molds) and time than a few plastic counters.

You just cannot exhange "upgrade these counters to plastic" to "add 3 Greater Gods to each faction" at the same cost of money and time.

I voted for more bling as that is the only realistic choise in this poll.


What do you call realistic ? Petersen games can say "These gods will come later because of delays in production". I am fine with that. They already have done that a lot with CW.
And i prefer to have gameplay oriented strech goals than decorative ones. It's all the more valuable that these units affect directly each faction. They aren't just "one more GOO" stretch goals that will end barely used compared to new factions or units for factions.


It's clear that you would prefer to have the figures over the upgraded components. The problem with it in terms of chucking out the upgraded components and adding a large amount of huge figures at this point would not only delay the production timeline but probably raise the cost for backers as well as the Petersens. I'm not a game publisher so I have no idea if it is really a feasible thing or not. I'm sure they could give you a better answer. I personally feel that adding them now is only going to prolong a process that is already prone to delays, cost everyone more money and probably raise the already concerning shipping costs for some.

The Petersens always do good by their customers and products. So I'd rather wait for polished, definitive gameplay features and add ons while having the base game with great components. Part of the OS2 campaign's focus was on upgraded components because everyone wanted them. So "realistic" seems like a pretty good term here.


Costs are proportional to the amount of stuff. These add-ons were scheduled from the beginning so that isn't really unexpected work for PG.
I wonder if PG expect to send all the boxes in a pledge in one full shipping or if they will separate these as they did it for CW. In the latter case, they can manage to delay the gods addons, giving them time to polish, and so i prefer to have gods stretch goals than to have wedding rings that - while fun - have limited gameplay impact...
My concern is that Gods Expansions isn't an expansion that will be barely used, in my mind they are scheduled to be a fundamental part of the core game.
In CW OS2, apart from the Tcho-tcho faction, most of the stuff were more dedicated to experimented players ( i have run a good bunch of CW games at home and clearly, expansions maps and moreover neutral GOOs and monsters aren't for beginners...

IMHO, the gods expansions aren't a simple expansion. They are more like the HP expansion in CW: try them is to adopt them.
I can force the image: PG is selling a nice car with a marvelous boydwork and a powerful and tiger like purring engine but in the initial blue print, brakes were also scheduled and were finally dismissed in the final product
 
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Danny Lamprey
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You make some valid points. However, my personal stance is just, more stuff, more money... At the $400.00 plus mark already and whatever is yet to come for add-ons, plus the time from KS end to production to delivery, it doesn't seem viable at this point... either financially for my wallet or for the "greater good" of the game. No matter how preliminary these items may have been at one time or another.

Do you firmly believe the game as is will be a little broken? or that you're not getting a complete game?

I understand you want the stuff... I want the stuff as well! But, I'm fine waiting for it. I was disappointed about not having the plastic gates in my CW. I was also not a huge fan of the thinner faction sheets and ritual tracks and stuff. So upgrading the game is fine with me.

Speaking to the delivery, Sandy has said that the intent is to delivery in one fell swoop and not in waves. Hopefully that stands as it gets closer to delivery.
 
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Bernard Gourion
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In fact, i am a little bit disapointed because i find there are more plastic stuff in this KS than in the CW one (but i need to count to check that) while more gameplay elements could have been added like the magic, war and secret gods...
Not that i pledge a hero level so i am happy with this game and KS.
But nte also 1000 USD pledge has been proposed for getting resin minis that are essentially useless to the gameplay...
Delaying the delivery of all the game elements for 6 months is not an issue for me if i can hold all at the end.

For the moment, this means a second KS will come later to have them in 2019 if we are lucky...
 
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Marko Parviainen
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To be clear: I'm not opposed to the idea of War gods, Magic gods or Secret gods. I very much want them in my games.

But they would propably add four to six months (or whatever, I'm not expert in this) to the delivery of the game at this point. And that is not good.

I want the base game as soon as possible, so that I can start playing the game. I can wait for extra add ons (like the war-, magic and secret gods) to come out at later time.

Anyway, the Empires, monsters and allies add ons will already expand the base game greatly.

 
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Chris Lemens
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Further to Graham's point, we have play-tested the eight factions without the additional gods to the point that I think we've tried every combination multiple times. But adding the secret, war, and magic gods really increases the play-testing needed to get them right, on top of the design, sculpting, and so on. I think it is the wiser course to get out a game that has no unexpected kinks in its core game play, and expand it later, if there is interest.
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