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Subject: The future of 5-6 players expansion. rss

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Shirley Sheak
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Hi, would the designer consider to release 5-6 players expansion like AtS in the future? This is important as most of the time I have 5 players in the group.
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Malahias Zumakalis
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I adore your nickname - 'cause I love "takoyaki"!!!
(Sorry for the off-topic, but I couldn't resist!!!)
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Shirley Sheak
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Lol thanks for the compliment! I went and did some digging on the KS page and found the answer I needed on one of their update, instead of deleting post, I think I should just share this information to those who didn't see it.

Quote:
The first one is about the number of players. A lot of you would like the game to be able to be played with more than 4 players, preferably up to 6. The problem is that at the moment the game has been tested and developed to work with 2-4 players. While we believe it can easily scale up to more players, it hasn't been tested yet so we can't suggest it based on belief alone and, most importantly, it would require a significant increase to the game's components. First of all more locations would be needed. Since there are 4 different piles to draw from (and each one serves a different use in the game) it is important to be able to cover cases where players may draw more from a specific pile. Increasing the number of players would lead to piles running out very quickly and players would be left out without cards needed to complete their Engine or cover the needs of their farm. Besides that, there would also have to be more Water Towers in the game (it is not unusual for a player to build 4-5 of them), more Silos as well as more money tokens. If we were to add all this to the main game it would significantly increase its cost. If we were to add it to the Stretch Rewards it would have to take the place of many other stretch rewards while at the same time it would not be of use to everyone - people already backed if knowing it plays 2-4 players. Some of them wouldn't play it with more players either way so for them it would be a "useless" goal, at the expense of other, more useful stuff.

So, for these reasons it is difficult to change the number of players at the moment but we keep your interest noted and we will see if we can do something about it in the near future.


I do wish that 5-6 players expansion would become real, I'm on the fence of backing this but knowing that it's 50/50 for the more players expansion I'm not sure if I want another possible dust collector for now. I love this game in every way however...
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Francois L-C
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takoyakioc wrote:
Hi, would the designer consider to release 5-6 players expansion like AtS in the future? This is important as most of the time I have 5 players in the group.


From their last update they let know that they will consider people that would like to have a game supporting more players, thus maybe they will do like AtS and release a 5-6 players expansion in the future. But nothing has been said to confirm this. I guess that if Fields of Green is a success, they will release expansion in the future and probably follow what they have done for AtS, thus a 5-6 players expansion is really probable.

But as I mentioned here in another thread and in the KS comments, it is really easy to turn the current game from a 2-4 players count to a 5 (maybe even 6 players count but it will be tighter games), by sharing the content of another copies with two other people and splitting its content in a third in order to have 4 copies of every cards (instead of 3), and more silos and water towers (although these doesn't split perfectly but with 22 of each you should be fine) and more tokens of every type in order not to miss any. The designer of the game comment on this, and said that he doesn't see any balance issue doing this, so it is the only way to make this game a 2-5 or 2-6 players game for te moment.

You can also try just to play it straight of the box with 5 players as it should work fine IMO, as with the current kickstarter copy you will have enough cards to do so, but in order not to lack any card types, maybe it could be wise to lower the number of card played per year to 5, so this would use up pretty much exactly the same number as 4 player playing 6 cards. With the advanced water towers from the KS promo pack water shouldn't be an issue but maybe the number of silos would limit a bit frantic growth, but IMO this i s a good thing as it raise the tension of getting the right cards you need when they are available. As for the tokens, you can improvise using anything else available.

So this is pretty it. You can split a 4th copy with 2 other friend to get 3 2-6 players games (confirmed by the designer that it should work just fine without any balance issue), or you can probably stretch the content of a normal KS copy to 5 players (6 is maybe a bit too much of a stretch though). These are the current solution to up the player count a bit higher. I hope it help!
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Tobias Lunte
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Cerberus777 wrote:
takoyakioc wrote:
Hi, would the designer consider to release 5-6 players expansion like AtS in the future? This is important as most of the time I have 5 players in the group.


From their last update they let know that they will consider people that would like to have a game supporting more players, thus maybe they will do like AtS and release a 5-6 players expansion in the future. But nothing has been said to confirm this. I guess that if Fields of Green is a success, they will release expansion in the future and probably follow what they have done for AtS, thus a 5-6 players expansion is really probable.

But as I mentioned here in another thread and in the KS comments, it is really easy to turn the current game from a 2-4 players count to a 5 (maybe even 6 players count but it will be tighter games), by sharing the content of another copies with two other people and splitting its content in a third in order to have 4 copies of every cards (instead of 3), and more silos and water towers (although these doesn't split perfectly but with 22 of each you should be fine) and more tokens of every type in order not to miss any. The designer of the game comment on this, and said that he doesn't see any balance issue doing this, so it is the only way to make this game a 2-5 or 2-6 players game for te moment.

You can also try just to play it straight of the box with 5 players as it should work fine IMO, as with the current kickstarter copy you will have enough cards to do so, but in order not to lack any card types, maybe it could be wise to lower the number of card played per year to 5, so this would use up pretty much exactly the same number as 4 player playing 6 cards. With the advanced water towers from the KS promo pack water shouldn't be an issue but maybe the number of silos would limit a bit frantic growth, but IMO this i s a good thing as it raise the tension of getting the right cards you need when they are available. As for the tokens, you can improvise using anything else available.

So this is pretty it. You can split a 4th copy with 2 other friend to get 3 2-6 players games (confirmed by the designer that it should work just fine without any balance issue), or you can probably stretch the content of a normal KS copy to 5 players (6 is maybe a bit too much of a stretch though). These are the current solution to up the player count a bit higher. I hope it help!


> confirmed by the designer that it should work just fine without any balance issue

He said that he thinks it should work, and I don't see why there should be any problems; but he didn't have time to playtest this (he answered within hours of me proposing this), so I don't think we should hold him to it.

> split a 4th copy in three

I'll wait and see if we get any more announcements regarding 5-6 players, but if not (or if decide they can't support it atm), I already planned to open a group-buy thread for splitting extra copies in the last week of the campaign.
 
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Shirley Sheak
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Francois thank you so much for the details with different variants! It's more likely that the 1 copy for 5 players works better in my favor.

1 more thing I'd like to know is, are the custom tokens KS exclusive? They've mentioned that the stretch rewards will be made available to purchase separately later but I can see the custom tokens are also on the normal component list. I'm still waiting to read their rulebook to get more clear idea of the game.
 
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Francois L-C
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takoyakioc wrote:
Francois thank you so much for the details with different variants! It's more likely that the 1 copy for 5 players works better in my favor.

1 more thing I'd like to know is, are the custom tokens KS exclusive? They've mentioned that the stretch rewards will be made available to purchase separately later but I can see the custom tokens are also on the normal component list. I'm still waiting to read their rulebook to get more clear idea of the game.


No the wooden component are not KS exclusive and will be in any future retail version. This has been confirmed by Artipia.

The easy way to see it is check what is in the Component section of the KS, if it's there it will be in the retail version, if it's not, it won't.

Also check the icons in the lower right corner of the cards. The little tractor is for the base game, and also what will be in the retail version afterward. The cow icons is for the current Kickstarter promo pack, that is not KS exclusive as it will be available for purchase from Artipia Games website after the Kickstarter, but a a significant price from what I know of other game that Artipia did this (the KS promo pack for The Pursuit Of Happiness is 12 euro, so for me 17$). Again as I said in so many place, for me, it is way cheaper to get the Kickstarter right now because shipping is included (which is rare for us Canadian!) because my calculation is that if I wait for retail it will cost me something like 10$ more to get everything from different places. And I'm glad to be part of this Kickstarter!
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Francois L-C
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Tobl wrote:
> confirmed by the designer that it should work just fine without any balance issue

He said that he thinks it should work, and I don't see why there should be any problems; but he didn't have time to playtest this (he answered within hours of me proposing this), so I don't think we should hold him to it.


From the hands-on experience he as with the game and also on other such type of game, having design Among the Stars which use similar mechanisms, I trust his instinct that if he says it should be fine, it will be fine.

Looking at it, having 3 copies of each card for 2-4 players is pretty much the same distribution than having 4 copies of each cards for 3-5 players. So the only problem I see with adding cards, is the 2 players games, in which we might see less variety so we might need to sort cards out, and this is my main concern as I hate to do such thing prior starting a game.

So I might myself stick to, at 2-4 player count, play 4 years of 6 cards (24 cards per player per year) as usual, but as a 5 player variant, play 4 years of 5 cards (25 card per player per year) which should be fine (as we will probably have 156 total location cards at the end of the KS) and this doesn't need to sort the decks of card at all, which for me is a big plus.

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Shirley Sheak
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I'm kinda worry that they're making the expansions similar to AtS, in which they'll be using the promo pack as the 5-6 players expansion, so if I back this one and got all the promos already, but then when they release promo pack separately with some extra components enough to play 6, then it'd make me pay for something I already have to get access to the other half of the content I want.

*I was also annoyed that in AtS I needed 2 other expansions to have everything for 6 players, instead of just 1, otherwise the components won't be enough from 1. I wish they would be more clear and specific in delivery the players expansion in the future.
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Francois L-C
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takoyakioc wrote:
I'm kinda worry that they're making the expansions similar to AtS, in which they'll be using the promo pack as the 5-6 players expansion, so if I back this one and got all the promos already, but then when they release promo pack separately with some extra components enough to play 6, then it'd make me pay for something I already have to get access to the other half of the content I want.

*I was also annoyed that in AtS I needed 2 other expansions to have everything for 6 players, instead of just 1, otherwise the components won't be enough from 1. I wish they would be more clear and specific in delivery the players expansion in the future.


I didn't follow the Among The Stars KS campaign at the time and expansions that followed for AtS and cannot comment on this issue, but I guess that whatever they did, if this made people angry or disappointed in some way, they have learned from it and won't do the same mistake again. Also, AtS was Vangelis first big title, and I guess he too have learn a great deal since and thus I trust that they will great in the future.
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Shirley Sheak
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I hope they do, I only got the game (AtS) recently but it took me a huge amount of research to finally found out a forum post to instruct what do I need and what should I do to play with 6, but if the expansion is properly made, it'd be clear to the players right away.
 
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A J
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I'd really like to be able to play up to 6. It's a drafting game, anyways, so they tend to scale pretty well.
 
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