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Subject: 2nd edition rules rss

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roger cox
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Does anyone know where a second edition set of rules for KoC can be found? Thank you
 
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jim aranyi
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Tega Cay
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Any idea what the difference is between the editions? It appears they were both made in 1980 (I think). My rule set does not indicate any edition so therefore I will assume it is the first. It does say TSR 1980.
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Daniel U. Thibault
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I happen to have both. The second edition rule book is clearly identified as such. After a quick scan, I see the illustrations are different between the editions; as far as content goes, I'll have to look more closely.

I have PDFs of both rule books now. Ask and you shall receive.
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Daniel U. Thibault
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Urhixidur wrote:
I happen to have both. The second edition rule book is clearly identified as such. After a quick scan, I see the illustrations are different between the editions; as far as content goes, I'll have to look more closely.


There are some minor editorial changes ("stationary" became "non-moving", etc.) and then we hit one major rule change on page 4:

In the first edition, an encounter occurs a flat 50% of the time for each countryside entered in the Basic game. In the second edition, the check is against the number of knights in the moving party.

A little later, in the Attack/Avoid option, the first edition states that a PK who chooses to attack a knightly foe must do so chivalrously. The mention of this restriction is omitted in the second edition, although it does appear in the Attack Option (p. 8) later on ---so the rule still stands.

In the basic game steps to join the Round Table, the first edition had an odd extra Arthur reaction step, now omitted in the second edition (it made little sense in the original).

The two random deployment tables are merged in the second edition (they were redundant anyway), but an error is introduced in the second edition: Ban is king of Benwick and Howell king of Brittany, not the other way around.

Using the cards, page 6: The second edition adds that "King and Lady cards should be returned and reshuffled immediately after their use."

In Revealing Encounters, the second edition adds that the number of Arthurian Knights in a group of knights is known.

In Castle Reactions, the second edition clarifies that a castle friendly to one knight in the group allows that knight to make a request, and remains friendly to that knight once the group departs. The first edition rules indicated that the party as a whole could not make requests, and the friendly knight who "abused" the hospitality lost the friendly status once his friends left.

In the 1st edition, the Knight's Fate suffered by a losing PK is based on the King's VL when there is one among the opponents. In the 2nd edition, this is extended to also use the Lady's VL when the Knights are hers (which can be fun with Enchantresses...).

Poisoned Wounds: “(Note: a PK's Lord or Lady will never refuse to heal the PK; see REQUESTS.)” omitted in 2nd ed. Presumably because that is covered by the friendliness of one's Lord or Lady.

In Making Requests (of friendly castle owners), the first edition required a reaction from the owner (King, Knight, or Lady). In the second edition, the reaction is rolled only in a Lady's case, and even then only if the request is of courtship.

Castle Reaction 8 (Offers Challenge): In the first edition, when the PK loses the joust, the castle reaction is rolled again. In the second edition, the castle simply remains neutral.

The King Arthur section, which in the first edition appears right after the Shrines, is moved in the second edition to after the Requests (p. 15).

Step 2 of the Conditions for Becoming an Arthur Knight drop the redundant King reaction (which is covered in step 3) in the second edition.

In step 4 the "equal to or" is dropped (a correction which was already obvious from the rest of the text).

The reaction of King Arthur to a knight requesting to join before having enough CPs is augmented from "unfriendly" in the first edition to "Exiles" in the second (the second edition also covers the VL 6 or worse case).

Several Arthur reactions are modified in the second edition:

3. Instead of not telling the PK where to find the Monster, Arthur tells him exactly where to find it. The Arthur reaction bonus in case of success is also increased from +1 to +2.
6. The redundant King reaction reference is deleted.
8. The requirement of a friendly King reaction is deleted.

Defeat clarifies that the PK's companions (Dwarf, Mascot, Men-at-Arms) desert him once he is defeated.

Yielding: The second edition adds that a PK defeated by a PK must yield.

Knight's Fate 6: The second edition corrects the King reaction into a Castle reaction.

Knight's Fate 12: The second edition adds that violating an exile costs 12 VP just once.

Combat Awards and Penalties: Losing to a Knight yields 6 VP in the first edition; this is changed to 6 CP in the second.

Sharing an Adventure: The second edition adds that a joining Pk need not roll to find the Adventure leader.

Unusual Adventures: In the second edition, arriving in Faerie yields 12 VP instead of "12 VP or CP". However, Adventures 3:3 and 3:4 still yield respectively 12 VP and 12 CP, and the summary tables still reflect this alternative.

Requests: The second edition clarifies that a neutral reaction (a roll of 7) means the request is denied.

Requests of Castle Owners: In the second edition, it is the Castle's friendliness that matters (e.g. if a requested Adventure is turned down, the Castle becomes unfriendly). In both editions some of the wording is odd: for example, in the case of a Prisoner Release request, it says "if the Castle [Owner] is friendly" ---but both must be friendly for the request to be possible, so the condition is tautological.

Goodly Hermit Man reaction chart: The second edition corrects the first edition misnumbering of the explanations of reactions 8 and 9 (they were swapped).

Kings: In the first edition, encountered kings are accompanied by d6-1 Knights. In the second edition, they are accompanied by as many Knights as there are in the player's party.

Visiting Kings in their Castles: In the first edition, the King's reaction is distinct from the Castle's; it is possible, for instance, to be admitted to the castle and then attacked by Knights of the King's guard. In the second edition, a friendly castle reaction means the King is friendly: no reaction is rolled.

Knight Reactions:

The second edition adds a paragraph reminding that the Knight cards encountered are revealed only after the player's decision (to flee, attack, or wait) has been made.

3 and 7 slight wording changes. The joust becomes a combat, which is just a reminder that lance replacements are not available.

(to be continued)
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Daniel U. Thibault
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Lady Reactions:

The second edition adds a paragraph reminding that the Lady cards encountered are revealed only after the player's decision (to flee, attack, or wait) has been made.

Lady reaction 8: Asks for Escort: in the first edition, she's headed for a Sanctuary; in the second, she's headed for a Town or Port.

One case that is not clearly explained in either edition is when an Enchantress is being distressed by an NPK. The player won't know she's an Enchantress before committing to combat with the NPK. At that point the PK will have no good outcome option: Fleeing or yielding remain undesirable, and an eventual victory will still lead to an enchantment attempt.

Mad Knight Reactions:

In the second edition, a cured Mad Knight joins the PK as a Man-at-Arms instead of as an NPK.

Aid:

In the second edition, cases 2 and 3 are swapped. Rescue from Prison adds that the person rescued is also friendly. Further, in 5 the +1 Lady reaction bonus is deleted.

Avoiding Enchantments: The second edition merely adds a reminder that Morgan's adjustment is +5.

For case 12, the second edition adds that the helping PK must first find the enchanted PK.

Imprisonment: In the second edition, making an appeal to passerby can now always be done (no need to encounter a human, which could be quite difficult when the castle was in a forest, for example).

Messages:

In the second edition, in case 2 the PK may no longer do an Appeal to Jailor: storming the castle is the only option.

In the second edition, case 3 no longer awards 6 VP for the Aid. (Which is a mistake, in my mind.)

In the second edition, case 4 instructions to resolve the case where the PK has just the one friendly castle (his Lord's) are given (roll again for a different message).

Oaths:

2 changes from "The PK must never give up in combat. If an opponent offers to call off an encounter, the PK must refuse; when injured, the PK must not Yield before being defeated." to "The PK must never give up once combat has begun. If the PK is defeated, he must be killed or lose 12 VP for Yielding and breaking this Oath. The PK may, however, agree to stop a combat in progress due to a Combat Event, since this is not Yielding."

Tricks:

2 adds a reminder that abandoning a Lord while a Summons is in effect increases the penalty from 6 to 12 VP.

4 switches from "and the PK has no chance to request chivalrous combat" to "but the PK has a chance to request chivalrous combat".

Adventures:

1:6 In the second edition, the 6 VP are awarded regardless of Arthur's friendliness.

2:1, 2:2 In the second edition, the Lady/King is automatically friendly.

3:1 The second edition makes "poisoned wound" plural, which is puzzling because their number is not otherwise specified.

Advanced Games

Encounter Morgan Le Fay: The second edition adds that her seduction adjustment is +5.

Sea Encounters: Sea Monster: The second edition adds an escape clause for the PK in case of defeat (Luck Roll leading to a Shipwrecked outcome).

Optional Rules: Town Encounters: The encounter probability is here too based on the PK's party's size.

Town Watchmen: The second edition adds a 3 VP penalty for fighting with the local authorities.

Terrain: The second edition maintains the first edition's rule of encounter in forest and river on a 1 only, which is somewhat at odds with the rule of PK party size used elsewhere. I would suggest encounters occur in forest and river based on the same PK party size check, but that a second die roll be made: on a 1-2, the encounter occurs, on a 3-6 it does not.

The second edition's Forest Encounters table introduces a typo in its first line, erroneously changing "2-5" into "2-7".

Flooded River: The second edition adds that the river returns to its normal level if the PK waits for two turns.

Superior Knights: The second edition changes the "takes an additional wound" into "opponent's lance breaks".

Tricks: The second edition changes the minimum VL that allows tricking from 12 to 13.

The example scenario and strategy section are deleted from the second edition.

Glossary: In the second edition the Player Knight and Non-player Knight entries are merged into a single Knight entry, and the Lady and Prayer entries are deleted (oddly).
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