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Jorgen Peddersen
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Zoe's Flaw pushes the leftmost card in the Verse into the Combat Zone. I just played a game where Zoe, if she had a Flaw, would have pushed face-up Medical Supplies into the Combat Zone.

Now, Stationary cards can be moved by such effects according to the definition of Stationary. But what would happen now? Medical Supplies only makes sense while it is in the Verse and the only way it has to get out of the Combat Zone is when it is reveled there.

I suppose the: "If it was revealed in the Combat Zone..." part of the text could trigger, but this is reading it more as: "If it is revealed and in the Combat Zone..."

It seems the only logical way to play the card, though. Am I potentially missing another solution?
 
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Jay Johnson
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rulebook pg 18:
Quote:
A card with Stationary doesn’t move normally in the ‘Verse. If another card would push it, instead that card moves to the next space, leaving the Stationary card where it was.

Stationary cards can still be moved by other effects, and an Inevitable card will still push a Stationary card normally. (It’s Inevitable, after all).


I would say that Zoe's flaw is considered an "other effect", so it would move even Stationary cards
 
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Jorgen Peddersen
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Yes, I mentioned that too. But if the Medical Supplies are in the Combat Zone, how would you steal them to complete the Objective? You need to spend Recruit Points equal to (or double) the Scan Value of the space the Medical Supplies are in, and there is no value in the Combat Zone.
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Jay Johnson
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oops, I misread your post, my bad.
Normally I'd say that Zoe's flaw would pull even Stationary cards into the CZ, but since the Ongoing effect on Med Supplies only mentions getting pushed into the CZ by the Inevitable card, I would play it as Zoe's flaw would skip over the Med Supplies and pull the leftmost non-MedSupply card into the CZ. Though I suppose you could instead treat it as though the Med Supplies were revealed in the CZ and put it in the rightmost Verse slot (like you said).

Putting the Med Supplies to the right does increase the cost to Skyhook them, but it doesn't add anything to the CZ (which is the point of Zoe's flaw). Though I suppose in that instance you could do both (move the Med Supplies to the right-most slot, and then pull the then-leftmost card to the CZ).

In any case, if Zoe's flaw was able to pull the Med Supplies into the CZ, it would automatically fail that objective (and since it is a mandatory obj, you would then auto-fail that episode). And that seems a bit harsh
 
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Jorgen Peddersen
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In my case, the next card would be the Inevitable card, so it would be horrible to either skip over Medical Supplies or try to repeat the effect after hitting Medical Supplies. In fact, provided you treat the Medical Supplies as going to the rightmost slot, repeating would hit the Medical Supplies again, causing an infinite loop!

I think the badness of the Flaw is still there. Moving the Supplies to the rightmost space does have another negative effect in addition to increasing the cost. It pushes any other non-Inevitable, non-Stationary cards one space further through the Verse.

So yeah, it seems this might be the only real way to handle the situation fairly. Treat Medical Supplies' effect as always triggering when it is face-up in the Combat Zone instead of only when it was revealed there; unless it was pushed by the Inevitable card of course.
 
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Jay Johnson
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Sounds like you were pretty close to losing that episode regardless.
In that instance, with nothing else for Zoe's Flaw to target, you had three options:
- treat the Flaw as having no effect (similar to Simon's Flaw coming up when no Crew Strikes are out)
- determine that the Flaw would pull the Med Supplies to the CZ and keep them there (automatically losing that game)
- substitute the Flaw effect into something like moving the Inevitable card one space, or randomly pick one of the non-player Main Character's flaws to trigger

of course, none of those are "official" rules (that we know of), but sometimes you have to improvise
 
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Jorgen Peddersen
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We had two turns left before the Supplies would be pushed in, and Zoe's player had the Wash card in hand that would send the Inevitable back to the deck, so we had plenty of time, really... But it was just an interesting thought of what would happen in this unique scenario if she did have a Flaw.

It really does not make sense if Zoe's Flaw can pull all Stationary cards except Medical Supplies, so transferring the effect to another card makes no sense.

Making it auto-loss is insane. Consider that you could reveal the Supplies in the final Verse space on the first turn. It would be silly if any Flaw drawn by Zoe could end the game that early.

I think the only thing that keeps the game fair while also being consistent with other cards is to simply treat the Medical Supplies as if they had been revealed in the Combat Zone.
 
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Daniel Mandel
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Hi everyone,

If Zoe's Flaw moves the Medical Supplies to the Combat Zone, it now costs 0 RP to use the Skyhook on it. (It actually helps you. Good old Zoe making the best of the situation.)

A similar situation is true with Kessler's Goods. If Zoe's flaw moves it to the Combat Zone, you now only need to make sure the leftmost space of the 'Verse is clear to pay 3 RP to secure them.

Thank you,
Danny
 
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Jorgen Peddersen
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Cool, thanks for the rulings!

Giving the Combat Zone an effective Scan cost of 0 does solve the problem nicely without needing to stretch the wording of the card.
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Jay Johnson
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That seems to go against the idea of Flaws, and it becomes the only scenario I can think of where a Flaw actively helps you. Simon's Flaw can potentially ease a particular situation (if another crew member is heavily wounded and Simon is not), but in general it can be problematic as Simon will tend to accrue Crew Strikes faster than others due to those Flaws.

But it does resolve the confusion without contradicting or overriding any of the card text (or trigging an auto-fail)
 
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Ben Noel
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From what I've played, Zoe's flaw is often helpful. Especially if you have the ship upgrade that makes enemies in the combat zone easier to kill.
 
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Jay Johnson
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xamn wrote:
From what I've played, Zoe's flaw is often helpful. Especially if you have the ship upgrade that makes enemies in the combat zone easier to kill.

If you've been able to keep up with scanning/defeating the episode cards, Zoe's flaw could possibly be helpful, but you've been able to keep up, then waiting a couple extra turns for things to come out normally shouldn't hurt either (plus it gives you more chances to complete side jobs and/or recruit).

But much of the time (especially if you're playing at a higher difficulty level), if the Combat Zone already has an enemy or two in it, Zoe's flaw can put extra strain on you.

And I don't have the Ship Upgrade cards in front of me right now, but does the one you're referring to limit the Combat Zone bonus to once per turn?
 
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Ben Noel
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JayJ79 wrote:
[q="xamn"]From what I've played, Zoe's flaw is often helpful.

And I don't have the Ship Upgrade cards in front of me right now, but does the one you're referring to limit the Combat Zone bonus to once per turn?


It is indeed once per turn.
 
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