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Subject: I feel your despair, Kickstarter backers, but don't go full Hudson on us. rss

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Kasper Scharling
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I have read most of the 250 pages on Dakkadakka.com, but in many sittings, since its hard to stomach so much bile.

I mean, I understand your frustrations, I have read them all.

My plea is, could you please keep this discussion in one thread here or on DakkaDakka. Because I feel you are bringing a bad atmosphere to this forum.

Let us have our fun, that's the reason we indulge in boardgames.

With utmost respect
Skanque


Edit: spelling
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Stuart Holttum
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Re: I feel your dispare, Kickstarter backers, but don't go full Hudson on us.
"frustrations"?

By that, I presume, you mean giving large sums of money to a company that doesn't respond to emails, dispatches to stores before pledges, have still not sent base games to some people, and is on record as lying to their backers?

Yeah - I suppose you could dismiss that as frustration.
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Kasper Scharling
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Re: I feel your dispare, Kickstarter backers, but don't go full Hudson on us.
I am not here to spite anyone, just trying to enjoy the game (:
Its just hard, when so much anger is written in each post.

My only plea is, could we keep this at one thread here or at dakkadakka, or both.
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Steven Noyes
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Re: I feel your dispare, Kickstarter backers, but don't go full Hudson on us.
To be honest i have nothing against Prodos as i didnt dive in heavy on the kickstarter. However i fully understand the outrage at the way backers have been treated, and for them to warn others of the problems they have suffered is totally acceptable. You simply cant separate the game from its marketing woes when people have spent hundreds (i know one who has spent over a thousand GBP) of their hard earned currency on it.
Its going to be a very long time before AvP shakes off its past issues, maybe never. We must endure this and understand those who are angry at their situation.
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Jake Rose
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Re: I feel your dispare, Kickstarter backers, but don't go full Hudson on us.
With utmost respect:

I am perfectly justified in being pissed about being lied to, and pissed about not having gotten everything I paid for.

And I will trash Jarek and Prodos when and where I feel like it.

You want the KS backers to be nicer or confine themselves to someplace you desire? How about instead get you and your buddies to bother Jarek and crew and insist they finish sending out what they owe us and begin to live with integrity.

I guess it is easier to want to silence the victims than to bring heat on the victimizer.

In short, quit being a condescending crap bag.

With utmost respect...
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Shirley T
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Re: I feel your dispare, Kickstarter backers, but don't go full Hudson on us.
Skanque wrote:
I am not here to spite anyone, just trying to enjoy the game (:
Its just hard, when so much anger is written in each post.

My only plea is, could we keep this at one thread here or at dakkadakka, or both.

I hear you. But I also believe, "You reap what you sow". So please, don't blame the Kickstarter backers for their treatment by Prodos. Remember, the backers did not create this toxic fanbase... Unfortunately Prodos did. whistle

Also, you're living in a fantasy land if you believe some backers aren't going to do what they can to steer players away from this game until they feel Prodos has does right by them. Yes, it spiteful and self-destructive, but the only way to change the fanbase is for the Prodos to do right by them.
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Shirley T
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Re: I feel your dispare, Kickstarter backers, but don't go full Hudson on us.
jakecarol wrote:
With utmost respect:

I am perfectly justified in being pissed about being lied to, and pissed about not having gotten everything I paid for.

And I will trash Jarek and Prodos when and where I feel like it.

You want the KS backers to be nicer or confine themselves to someplace you desire? How about instead get you and your buddies to bother Jarek and crew and insist they finish sending out what they owe us and begin to live with integrity.

I guess it is easier to want to silence the victims than to bring heat on the victimizer.

In short, quit being a condescending crap bag.

With utmost respect...

Or what he said... I like the way he put it better than me trying to be nicer. Backers are victims, pure and simple. soblue
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Kasper Scharling
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Re: I feel your dispare, Kickstarter backers, but don't go full Hudson on us.
jakecarol wrote:
With utmost respect:
In short, quit being a condescending crap bag.

With utmost respect...
This is uncalled for.

Prodos have stated that they are out of funds, and not able to ship the remaining kickstater batches, before they get more cash. I have spend about $400 on this game, so hopefully this will get some of your games shipped.

I am not trying to silence anyone, please re-read my plea, I would just like a dedicated thread, for this. Like on Dakkadakka.

Also, the miniatures near perfect, in my opinion. So on that account Prodos delivered.
 
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mark mcleod
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Re: I feel your dispare, Kickstarter backers, but don't go full Hudson on us.
Skanque wrote:
jakecarol wrote:
With utmost respect:
In short, quit being a condescending crap bag.

With utmost respect...
This is uncalled for.

Prodos have stated that they are out of funds, and not able to ship the remaining kickstater batches, before they get more cash. I have spend about $400 on this game, so hopefully this will get some of your games shipped.


I presume you are not a KS backer, and it was us who got you your game.
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Stuart Holttum
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Re: I feel your dispare, Kickstarter backers, but don't go full Hudson on us.
Skanque wrote:
.....I would just like a dedicated thread, for this....


And as has been said, sorry, but no - we are NOT going to let the company that lied to us, took our money, and are doing their best not to communicate, off the hook. I'm sure Prodos would love it if all the negativity was tucked away quietly in one thread that they can ignore.

Frankly, I feel the opposite. I'd like to see everyone pulling together - backers and non-backers alike - and putting pressure on Prodos, rather than saying "well they made nice figures so let's not talk about how they have lied and screwed people over".

Because sweeping it all under the carpet sends the message that they can treat backers like crap and nobody cares, and that there will be no negative consequences for them. Sorry, but no. No, no, no.

You spent about the same on this game as I did, apparently. Difference is, you've got everything you paid for, probably within a couple weeks of paying for it. I gave them MY money years ago, and still haven't got most of my stuff, and no idea when it might appear.

You say you really understand the level of unhappiness most backers feel. You don't. You really don't. Because if you did, you'd never have felt able to make such a blasé suggestion.
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gary gee
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Re: I feel your dispare, Kickstarter backers, but don't go full Hudson on us.
Skanque wrote:
jakecarol wrote:
With utmost respect:
In short, quit being a condescending crap bag.

With utmost respect...
This is uncalled for.

Prodos have stated that they are out of funds, and not able to ship the remaining kickstater batches, before they get more cash. I have spend about $400 on this game, so hopefully this will get some of your games shipped.

I am not trying to silence anyone, please re-read my plea, I would just like a dedicated thread, for this. Like on Dakkadakka.

Also, the miniatures near perfect, in my opinion. So on that account Prodos delivered.
Hi,Kasper.ive had this bile off some of these guys myself when trying to praise anything at all to do with the game..so your not the first! and probably not the last..i did say to these guys maybe if they stopped bitching at everyone who had done ok out of it and maybe took some action or directed their bile rudeness at prodos etc..maybe they would get somewhere. but no,they would rather just be rude to people with a different view and experience to theirs!.
Kasper just try to ignore their rude attitude to people who don't feel the same way as they do.just try not to trip over the dummies they are throwing out of the pram

from another "condescending crap bag"
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Stuart Holttum
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Re: I feel your dispare, Kickstarter backers, but don't go full Hudson on us.
tootz wrote:
......if they stopped bitching at everyone who had done ok out of it and maybe took some action or directed their bile rudeness at prodos etc..maybe they would get somewhere. but no,they would rather just be rude to people with a different view and experience to theirs!


You got your toys.
You got them before I did.
You got some that I still haven't got, and don't know when I will get them.
You got them cheaper than I did.

And you got them, and that fast, and that cheap, because I and the other backers dropped a load of cash that we've yet to see the full (or in some cases any) return on. You're welcome.

It's a pleasure to be told to shut up and stop moaning about it. After all, YOU'RE all right Jack.


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Kasper Scharling
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Re: I feel your dispare, Kickstarter backers, but don't go full Hudson on us.
Quote:

I have to point out the extreme irony of the fact that you're spending time on multiple forums reading negative posts about this game (instead of playing it) and are now complaining abut the negativity of the posts that you chose to spend time reading.


Well first I read the thread because people seemed excited, then because I wanted to see all the exclusive items, so I knew what to hunt down. Then I got mesmerized by reading stories and Prodos explanations. But really, it was hard to read, so in the end I just skipped alone between photos and the posts from Prodos.


Quote:

You spent about the same on this game as I did, apparently. Difference is, you've got everything you paid for, probably within a couple weeks of paying for it. I gave them MY money years ago, and still haven't got most of my stuff, and no idea when it might appear.


Well I do have a complete copy of Sedition Wars, with ALL the extras.. so if you feel this Kickstarter went wrong...

And I have backed multiple Kickstarters, so I know how it is to wait.
Point being, if you want your miniatures here and now, go to a FLGS, if you want to take a chance. Back a game that seems promising and hope for the best, its not a guaranteed thing, its more like a lottery, imho.

 
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Shirley T
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Re: I feel your dispare, Kickstarter backers, but don't go full Hudson on us.
[q="Skanque"]
Quote:

Point being, if you want your miniatures here and now, go to a FLGS, if you want to take a chance. Back a game that seems promising and hope for the best, its not a guaranteed thing, its more like a lottery, imho.


Your opinion is invalid the instant the game becomes commercially available and the company producing it doesn't collapse. The risk you are taking is suppose to be the risk that the COMPANY GOES BUST, not that the company has decided to abuse you. Your inability to see Prodos as the victimizer here is what is causing your frustration. If you can't see the backers as victims, then you are part of the problem, hombre. whistle
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Kasper Scharling
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Re: I feel your dispare, Kickstarter backers, but don't go full Hudson on us.
Quote:
If you can't see the backers as victims, then you are part of the problem, hombre


Victims, first world problems here..

Well I gave it a try and a plea, no hard feeling on my part.

Hope your stuff shows up soon and that you will have a good time with your game by then.
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Steven Noyes
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Re: I feel your dispare, Kickstarter backers, but don't go full Hudson on us.
To be fair to those who are angry, your OP smacked of trolling.
The first things that crossed my mind when i read it were:

1) why the heck has he typed this?
2) maybe he works for prodos!
3) probably just a troll trolling...

None of the above maybe true. But for those to be my first thought on reading it (and im not even angry at prodos), your not going to make any friends with those who are quite rightly ( in their opinion) furious with prodos!

If you cant see that then there's not much hope.
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Mark Bigney
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Re: I feel your dispare, Kickstarter backers, but don't go full Hudson on us.
Skanque wrote:
Victims, first world problems here..


Oh, bloody hell. That's the last straw, for me.

First of all, you came here complaining of having to see negative posts on message boards because you felt it was harshing your buzz about your plastic dollies. That is perhaps the epitome of a first world problem.

Second, these fine people have been fleeced, manipulated, and lied to. Their complaints cannot and ought not be invalidated on the basis of a flip stock phrase that implies anything short of utter impoverishment is not worth airing. Just because it's a luxury item does not alter the wrong. If I key your Porsche, I'm still a vandal, and you have a right to complain.
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Kasper Scharling
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Re: I feel your dispare, Kickstarter backers, but don't go full Hudson on us.
Gyges wrote:
[q="Skanque"] Victims, first world problems here..

Quote:

Oh, bloody hell. That's the last straw, for me.

First of all, you came here complaining of having to see negative posts on message boards because you felt it was harshing your buzz about your plastic dollies. That is perhaps the epitome of a first world problem.

Second, these fine people have been fleeced, manipulated, and lied to. Their complaints cannot and ought not be invalidated on the basis of a flip stock phrase that implies anything short of utter impoverishment is not worth airing. Just because it's a luxury item does not alter the wrong. If I key your Porsche, I'm still a vandal, and you have a right to complain.


I totally agree, you have every right to be mad. Though I feel the word victim, is a bit harsh, compared to what other people in that category, have endured.

I am not trying to take anything away or silence anyone, suggested a dedicated thread, so that people who want to be warned/investigate the story, would go there and not having it scattered all over the place.

You may call me a hypocrit, and you may be right. But again, I am not here to argue.

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Steven Noyes
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Re: I feel your dispare, Kickstarter backers, but don't go full Hudson on us.
Rather than blame the angry posters for being angry and posting it, try blaming the root cause of their anger? You arent going to win this one anytime soon, just like the KS backers arent likely to win soon either it would seem.
Yes we would like a toxic free community for our hobby, good luck finding it. GW havent succeeded in generating one yet, and what have they REALLY done wrong?
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Kasper Scharling
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Re: I feel your dispare, Kickstarter backers, but don't go full Hudson on us.
popsical wrote:
Rather than blame the angry posters for being angry and posting it, try blaming the root cause of their anger? You arent going to win this one anytime soon, just like the KS backers arent likely to win soon either it would seem.
Yes we would like a toxic free community for our hobby, good luck finding it. GW havent succeeded in generating one yet, and what have they REALLY done wrong?


You're right. Well spoken
 
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Brent Lloyd
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Re: I feel your dispare, Kickstarter backers, but don't go full Hudson on us.
1) Haters are gonna hate.
2) Crowdfunding platform are risky ways to buy games.

Mix 1:1 and pour into the internet forums. Voila!

Peace
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Mark Bigney
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Re: I feel your dispare, Kickstarter backers, but don't go full Hudson on us.
Skanque wrote:


I totally agree, you have every right to be mad. Though I feel the word victim, is a bit harsh, compared to what other people in that category, have endured.


They were fleeced, manipulated, and lied to. They are thus the victims of fleecing, manipulation, and lying.
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Brent Lloyd
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Re: I feel your dispare, Kickstarter backers, but don't go full Hudson on us.
Gyges wrote:
Skanque wrote:


I totally agree, you have every right to be mad. Though I feel the word victim, is a bit harsh, compared to what other people in that category, have endured.


They were fleeced, manipulated, and lied to. They are thus the victims of fleecing, manipulation, and lying.


...or they backed a Kickstarter that is not turning out like they wanted it to....

There are always different ways of looking at any anything. Don't like the view? Try changing the perspective. Constant ranting and nerd rage rarely gets anything positive done.

I would bet that Prodos did not start that Kickstarter project with the intentions of "fleecing, manipulating and lying" to anybody. Everything I have seen so far is a sincere attempt to fulfill their Kickstarter obligations.

Sure, mistakes have been made, but the majority of folks have gotten at least the base game and much of their extras. That folks are still slowly getting packages is a sign to me that they are making progress.

Haters are Gonna Hate.

Peace
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Stuart Holttum
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Re: I feel your dispare, Kickstarter backers, but don't go full Hudson on us.
Thunder wrote:
Haters are Gonna Hate.

Peace


People who haven't experienced anger and unhappiness themselves, and can't be bothered to empathise with the people who have, are gonna trot out a tired cliche that dismisses and trivialises their legitimate concerns.

Thanks for the sympathy. I hope when you have an experience that angers and frustrates you, you get a more empathic response than you have given us.
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Dan Manning
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Re: I feel your dispare, Kickstarter backers, but don't go full Hudson on us.
You lost me at "dispare" and I have my kickstarter.
 
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