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Subject: Spriggan, Archer, Hunter, Skald rss

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David Griffin
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Just played out a tile with these 4 heroes just to try to familiarize myself with them a little. Not near there yet of course but it was interesting to say the least.

The Skald is an interesting support character with some ability to do damage on his or her own. But he or she seems to be one of those who isn't a good fit for team membership on a team without some other heavy hitters. Lots of interesting ways to enhance others though.

The Spriggan is also interesting. Some damaging abilities but not enough attack cards. And not near enough hit points. The conjuring equipment thing is interesting but even having acorns to throw needs attack cards to use right? Again, can't be a heavy hitter, but seems more like a secondary character.

Playing the Archer and the Hunter on the same team was weird too because the Hunger is sort of a variant of the Archer. I couldn't make the dual wield work well in this game because I couldn't get enough interrupt cards. Also it wasn't clear if you could attack ONLY with the secondary weapon -- crossbow main hand and pointy stick in the second hand. Could you use ONLY the secondary weapon with attacks? It wasn't quite clear.

Both were getting ammo but the Hunter gets fewer shots. The Archer seems to have stronger attacks and the Hunter has presumably MORE attacks with dual wielding, especially with good weapons. The poor starting equipment hurt both of them.

I don't have them down well yet but none of these guys are really who you want for your main team members. Seems like you really want the Soldier (or maybe the Brigand) and the Acolyte for your first 2 members. THEN maybe branch out into these guys for further characters, though I'd pick the Brigand and the Apprentice (or the Archer I guess) to fill out the team. The other classes seem to be interesting though. Played well, the Spriggan or the Skald may be the best support characters?

Not sure what I think of these guys, but they are all cool.
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Tobias Loeffler
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IMHO there went some bad design choices into those heroes. They all look and sound cool, but when you sit down to play them, they more often than not fall apart.

Spriggan: He's my favorite of "The Odd Ones". Going through an entire session with only saying "I'm Groot" and just being a f****** walking tree is priceless.

Skald: In a group of 4 or 5 he's well at home and if you have someone acutally roleplaying him / her it's pretty fun. Having no move cards though he / she is slow as hell and at some point the Skald player will get frustrated that his / her hero gets no frontline action.

Trickster: While - with the right gear - his / her potential is pretty great, it's just not so much fun to collect parts. The mechanic my seem
sound on paper, but actually doing it is pretty boring. The trickster also has the potential for worst player experience. You can literally sit there for 1 deck rotation and have nothing to contribute.

Hunter: This hero is a total waste of a party slot (at least atm). Not a single AoE attack. And his hunt cards are only really useful if you choose to play your entire session with the same monster type. If you don't, by the time the hunter is "ready" the useful heroes will have cleared most tiles. His attacks are an utter waste of AP and most of the time it is a better choice to spend his AP with another hero.
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Thorsten Schröder
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While I haven't played these a lot my impressions are quite similar to nimmzwei's.
I have to add that while I liked the spriggan his non-use of loot kinda takes the fun out of the treasure hunt. But that's mitigated by the use of the community item-expansion.
 
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Kevin Erskine
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Haven't tried the hunter yet, but I agree with most of what you said. I found the Spriggan was close to indestructible but yeah didn't do much damage. I play often with 3 characters so having the Skald as one of them wasn't very good. He needs 4-5 as mentioned.

The trickster that was mentioned on the other hand, I love. If you can find either of his green items, he's a force. If you get both, he's bordering on overpowered. But it's his little things like the spring trap that I loved.

"Hey guys, I have an idea for getting over the river and getting behind the lair. Just hear me out. You step on this thing here that I made and it will launch you behind the enemy. What do you think?"

Or when you get a scenario where you can't hustle, but you really want to get to that trap now. Well spring trap is your friend. Yeah, he's one of my favorites.
 
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David Griffin
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I've watched one or two videos using these "alternate" heroes. In at least one of those, they deliberately didn't take the "heavy hitters" in the party.

There was a lot of deck cycling followed by a hit doing some damage followed by some more deck cycling. They did clear the tile eventually (as did I in my group) but it was a slog. There are some big attacks in there but it doesn't seem like enough. It occurred to me to wonder if these heroes are useful for those of you who are so good you can blitz through the monsters. These guys will make you think and keep you from winning as quickly? It looked as though the players in the video I watched should have been taking loitering penalties but they seemed to ignore that.
 
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carbon_dragon wrote:
I don't have them down well yet but none of these guys are really who you want for your main team members. Seems like you really want the Soldier (or maybe the Brigand) and the Acolyte for your first 2 members. THEN maybe branch out into these guys for further characters, though I'd pick the Brigand and the Apprentice (or the Archer I guess) to fill out the team.


Most of my play time is two player, and any time we've tried different combinations of the base-box characters, the only two that seem to work out are the Soldier and Acolyte. I've played the Archer as a third person to the Solider and Acolyte and it went really well, so I'd agree with your general feeling that the Archer is not a character you should select in a game with only two people. I actually like the feel of Archer character quite a bit, but it's also a character type I wouldn't give to the a person new to the game.

No experience with the Skald, Spriggan or Hunter.
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David Griffin
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Hey, how many of you play 2 or more characters per person? Or do you only play 1 character per person?
 
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I can only play one character at a time. It's not specific to Myth, it's my preference for any game. I'm sure there's a badge for it.
 
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Judy Krauss
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Quote:
Also it wasn't clear if you could attack ONLY with the secondary weapon -- crossbow main hand and pointy stick in the second hand. Could you use ONLY the secondary weapon with attacks? It wasn't quite clear.


I asked that question in the MCG forums and the official answer is yes, if the keyword matches the weapon (weapon, melee, or ranged, for example) then you can choose to use the secondary weapon. The Soldier already does this with a shield keyword, as does the Acolyte and Apprentice with their respective secondary items.

And, "Dual wield just enables you to use the Rush ability if you happen to have an interrupt that you don't see yourself using."

Here's the link:
http://megacongames.vanillaforums.com/discussion/comment/160...



BTW, in answer to your later question:
I usually play solo using 3 heroes, but sometimes I play with 2 or 4. Four is the most I can fit on my table, but I think that I might find playing with 5 a bit unwieldy, anyway. For me, playing with 2 or 3 is optimal.
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David Griffin
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Jude wrote:
Quote:
Also it wasn't clear if you could attack ONLY with the secondary weapon -- crossbow main hand and pointy stick in the second hand. Could you use ONLY the secondary weapon with attacks? It wasn't quite clear.


I asked that question in the MCG forums and the official answer is yes, if the keyword matches the weapon (weapon, melee, or ranged, for example) then you can choose to use the secondary weapon. The Soldier already does this with a shield keyword, as does the Acolyte and Apprentice with their respective secondary items.

And, "Dual wield just enables you to use the Rush ability if you happen to have an interrupt that you don't see yourself using."

Here's the link:
http://megacongames.vanillaforums.com/discussion/comment/160...



BTW, in answer to your later question:
I usually play solo using 3 heroes, but sometimes I play with 2 or 4. Four is the most I can fit on my table, but I think that I might find playing with 5 a bit unwieldy, anyway. For me, playing with 2 or 3 is optimal.


Good, thanks! So I'm still trying to wrestle with the way to employ the hunter and the distinction from the Archer. The archer MUST use the arrows (either hand held or more often fired from his or her bow). The hunter holds two weapons, a small crossbow usually and a dual wield weapon. The Hunter may attack with the bow with a normal attack card (if he doesn't have an interrupt to discard) or he may attack with the hand weapon in his second hand with a normal attack card, or if he has a bow attack card and an interrupt he attacks twice in a round once with each hand (or even again if he has reaction cards).

So typically the Hunter will probably charge in rather than hang back in order to fight with the off hand. One might presume that if the hunter had say a longsword and a dual wield dagger they might just fight two handed melee though the ammo cards would be superfluous. Not really the right class to do this.

Meanwhile the Archer is hanging back and firing at range, using all his or her capability to reload, retrieve, and otherwise ready arrows as rapidly as humanly possible.

I kind of find the Hunter a weird class. Generally each character wants to either be close or far away from the enemy. The Hunter I guess wants to be close but the bow is then an odd main weapon. I wonder if this attempt to make a jack of all trades instead makes a master of none?
 
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Judy Krauss
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I like to think of the Hunter as Buffy. (or Faith )

http://boardgamegeek.com/thread/1584777/hunter-starting-item...
 
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Tobias Loeffler
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Jude wrote:
I like to think of the Hunter as Buffy. (or Faith )

http://boardgamegeek.com/thread/1584777/hunter-starting-item...


Only that Buffy and Faith kick a**! The Hunter on the other hand...
 
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Judy Krauss
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nimmzwei wrote:
Jude wrote:
I like to think of the Hunter as Buffy. (or Faith )

http://boardgamegeek.com/thread/1584777/hunter-starting-item...


Only that Buffy and Faith kick a**! The Hunter on the other hand...


She did all right when I played with her and the Acolyte -- until I got carried away and set up an almost impossible combined tile :

http://boardgamegeek.com/geeklist/200075/item/4296216#item42...

Check out entry d10-8 (June 10 - June 12) near the bottom of my Myth session reports. (Sorry, I haven't finished writing up my sessions yet, but there is some text and some pics.) Also, here are some of my opinions after playing the first few tiles:

http://boardgamegeek.com/article/22935010#22935010

...and then check out these final pics of the adventure:


(And the final catastrophic combined tile! Click on the pic and then read the comments below it if you are curious about how badly it turned out. )


But, to be fair, not many heroes, especially a party of two, could have taken on that last combined tile set up.

I think the Hunter and Acolyte did well together.

===

I also like playing the Archer. IMHO, she is the perfect complement to a party with the Soldier and Acolyte, and is especially useful for shooting over enemies to take out lairs to keep them from spawning early, which is a huge help.
The Hunter cannot shoot over enemies, yet it would seem that a party would not need both the Hunter and the Archer in it. But I am still curious to see how such a party would work out (it probably would need at least the Acolyte, and maybe another hero in it).


I haven't yet played the Skald, so I have no opinion, and the Spriggan, I have only played a bit during a Slaughterfield game, but I plan to play her again.
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David Griffin
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Having done another tile, still haven't really gotten the Hunter to work well but the third tile will have slightly better gear.

The thing is that neither of these four characters is really able to generate much treasure. Most of their attacks are in 1's and 2's. They do have decent big ticket attacks against captains/minibosses/bosses but they can't really mow down seas of minions.

The Spriggan/Druid really is tough to kill. He can just generate armor way too quickly to be easily overcome. And he has some decent attacks with his summons (though not usually treasure generating except for the bees). So he's a perfectly viable and fun character. The Skald/Bard is solely a support character. She does have the big attack but it's not enough to really make her viable if there isn't a pretty full team working beside her. If there is such a team, she can make them better.

The Archer does have damage dealing potential, but not that often, it needs a recharge to regenerate the ammo. He does the ability to regenerate that relatively quickly but besides Orion's Tears, she doesn't drop much treasure either. Good character, but as others have said, she should be supporting a core team.

Lastly the Hunter still isn't living up to its potential. The problem is that you need to charge up your arrows, have an interrupt to sacrifice, and then get some attack cards. That is hard to arrange all at once. It's quite possible I'm still not "getting it" and if I did I might see it blossom. But I suspect the class just has too many hard to coordinate circumstances to be really viable. I am seeing the class contribute to my clearing of the board but no more and maybe less than the others. I'll keep working to see if I can get that attack twice experience going.

In the back of my mind I'm trying to work out guidelines on how to select your group (other than take the Soldier and the Acolyte and maybe the Brigand). I think we have to measure each group against their ability to heal (Acolyte, Spriggan), their ability to generate treasure (killing minions in 3+ lots), their ability to deliver lots of damage to a single creature such as a boss (Skald's big no dice attack, Spriggan's big attacks along with summoning the Elder tree with a deck swap and the other normal characters' massive attacks), the ability to deal with traps (Brigand and maybe Trickster) etc. I just seems to me that most of the time, you get a better game with Soldier,Acolyte,Brigand, and Apprentice and any other pick represents your desire for a greater challenge.
 
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Our big issue with the hunter is his lack of aoe attacks. Every current hero has them but him.
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whiskemuscles wrote:
Our big issue with the hunter is his lack of aoe attacks. Every current hero has them but him.


It's worse than that. The Archer is dependent on arrows, BUT has a lot of ways to get them ready. The Hunter is dependent on arrows for his primary weapon but doesn't have those ways and is way way over limited. And he has some attack cards but not as many since some of them are taken up with ammo cards. Versatile in the sense that he can fire ranged and up close but really it's kind of a jack of trades, master of none.

He could concievably arrange to attack with Hunter's doom having already marked a minion of the same type as a mini boss or boss such that he delivers 4 damage with the main attack, and 1 attack with secondary weapon, doing 5 total damage. Awfully hard to set up though. There is just not enough there. Now I can see a dual wielding double sword or sword and dagger swashbuckler doing well in the game but I just don't think the Hunter functions well enough to pull his weight. Wish I could see the Megacon guys play him though.
 
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Jude wrote:
nimmzwei wrote:
Jude wrote:
I like to think of the Hunter as Buffy. (or Faith )

http://boardgamegeek.com/thread/1584777/hunter-starting-item...


Only that Buffy and Faith kick a**! The Hunter on the other hand...


She did all right when I played with her and the Acolyte -- until I got carried away and set up an almost impossible combined tile :

http://boardgamegeek.com/geeklist/200075/item/4296216#item42...

Check out entry d10-8 (June 10 - June 12) near the bottom of my Myth session reports. (Sorry, I haven't finished writing up my sessions yet, but there is some text and some pics.) Also, here are some of my opinions after playing the first few tiles:

http://boardgamegeek.com/article/22935010#22935010

...and then check out these final pics of the adventure:


(And the final catastrophic combined tile! Click on the pic and then read the comments below it if you are curious about how badly it turned out. )


But, to be fair, not many heroes, especially a party of two, could have taken on that last combined tile set up.

I think the Hunter and Acolyte did well together.

===

I also like playing the Archer. IMHO, she is the perfect complement to a party with the Soldier and Acolyte, and is especially useful for shooting over enemies to take out lairs to keep them from spawning early, which is a huge help.
The Hunter cannot shoot over enemies, yet it would seem that a party would not need both the Hunter and the Archer in it. But I am still curious to see how such a party would work out (it probably would need at least the Acolyte, and maybe another hero in it).


I haven't yet played the Skald, so I have no opinion, and the Spriggan, I have only played a bit during a Slaughterfield game, but I plan to play her again.


Wow, two lairs, two captains, Conner the wonder hound, and what is that thing in the middle? And the size of the tiles makes things so much harder. I guess I would have tried 4 very carefully chosen characters with lots and lots of good gear and maybe a few advanced cards and/or titles. How long did it take them to cut you to pieces?
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Judy Krauss
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carbon_dragon wrote:


Wow, two lairs, two captains, Conner the wonder hound, and what is that thing in the middle? And the size of the tiles makes things so much harder. I guess I would have tried 4 very carefully chosen characters with lots and lots of good gear and maybe a few advanced cards and/or titles. How long did it take them to cut you to pieces?


It was more a matter of not being able to reach the lairs to take them out (the Archer would have come in handy!) so that I was overwhelmed with minions (and some Captains) after a few cycles. Since I have added a lot of extra miniatures to my Myth game, the lairs generated swarms...

http://boardgamegeek.com/image/3067142/myth?commentid=641485...


About the Hunter: Yes, she cannot take 3+ minions at a time, but you all may be forgetting that Captains (and other tougher ranks of monster) drop a treasure when each one is defeated.

Also, heroes can freely give each other items when they are adjacent (although the items, other than potions, still cannot be equipped until the Refresh Phase, as normal) or after a tile has been cleared.

I found that the Hunter can do quite a bit of damage at once, even without using an additional dual wield "Rush" with her attack. And remember that she can attack either with her main weapon (a mini-crossbow in my example) or her offhand weapon, depending of which hero card you play to match the weapon ("ranged" for the crossbow, "melee" for the pointy stick, "weapon" for either).


BTW, about the pic I posted above: the figure in the middle was a non-MCG miniature I was using to represent the Torchbearer follower. Before I started playing, I also added a figure to represent Lady Katherine. See the details, here:
http://boardgamegeek.com/image/3067142/myth?commentid=641425...
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David Griffin
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Jude wrote:
carbon_dragon wrote:


Wow, two lairs, two captains, Conner the wonder hound, and what is that thing in the middle? And the size of the tiles makes things so much harder. I guess I would have tried 4 very carefully chosen characters with lots and lots of good gear and maybe a few advanced cards and/or titles. How long did it take them to cut you to pieces?


It was more a matter of not being able to reach the lairs to take them out (the Archer would have come in handy!) so that I was overwhelmed with minions (and some Captains) after a few cycles. Since I have added a lot of extra miniatures to my Myth game, the lairs generated swarms...


About the Hunter: Yes, she cannot take 3+ minions at a time, but you may be forgetting that Captains (and other tougher ranks of monster) drop a treasure when each one is defeated.

Also, heroes can freely give each other items when they are adjacent (although the items, other than potions, still cannot be equipped until the Refresh Phase, as normal) or after a tile has been cleared.

I found that the Hunter can do quite a bit of damage at once, even without using an additional dual wield "Rush" with her attack.




Yes but I typically do my best to see that captains don't appear if at all possible (sometimes it isn't). But yes the Archer (as well as the Spriggan) are pretty good re captains and even the Skald has a big attack.

Yes, playing solitaire, I always distribute treasure as appropriate -- it's just me playing after all.

I'm interested in your Hunter experience. Aside from the one massive attack, how are you playing the Hunter? The rush attack seems to be the Hunter's mechanic. If that isn't true I'd like to kno the trick.
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Judy Krauss
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David, please re-read my post above your last post. I edited it to add more information and links.


As for your question, I used the Acolyte for the AoE attacks and some DoT, and the Hunter for massive attacks after having her take out a minion for each of her Mark cards. Hunter's Flag, Scent of the Hunter, and Hunter's Doom worked great, especially if there were two Mark Cards with a minion on them. (Although, remember that "cleared" Mark cards are discarded during the Hero Deck Phase).


They did very well through several tiles (until I way overdid setting up this final tile).
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Did a third tile with a nasty quest that put a soulless and a lair on the tile with 3 defense tokens I had to NCA out before I could actually kill it. This time though I had a little better equipment and I had given the Spriggan the Eldar Tree card. I managed to do the NCAs, cook down the soulless, and then used the Tree and the rest of the team to kill the lair and then the shamblers. This time I was doing better getting treasure though I'm not sure I can do it on every time. Much harder than the traditional team.

I may do another tile because all that treasure gave me the Boots of Speed and a really good bow (not crossbow). I'm guessing the Hunter may shine with good equipment. It's worth a try. I'm supposing that the Hunter can use regular bows. I have to admit it's been an interesting game so far.

Read your description of your grand battle. You don't you do things by halves! Your own Kobayashi Maru scenario.
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After doing a LOT of tiles with some variation on equipment and a swapped advanced card or two I can say I learned a lot about the new characters (well 3 new plus the Archer).

First, even if you have the community card pack (which are not official cards) there are way too few items for these characters and you probably are going to have a lot of trouble finding them in treasure. For the Skald and Hunter, perhaps you should pick a green of your choice so you start out with some decent equipment (which they need). Presumably that is an instrument for the skald and a decent crossbow (which you need because the Hunter wants to have a second weapon in the shield slot rather than a quiver. Plus perhaps those characters should be able to trade 2 cards of a particular color for one that works for his class.

For the Spriggan/Druid, it doesn't use equipment really, but even so, you might start with a card swap to give yourself the ability to summon the Elder Tree. The Spriggan has some abilities to do damage but having the tree I think elevates him to more on a par with the other characters.

The Skald is strictly a support character for an already strong team, but he can exercise a little board control if he has a good group to work on. Cool but don't consider it unless it's buffing a big group.

The Hunter never really quite meets it's potential, but it's not a bad character if you start him with a good crossbow and a dual wield weapon in the second slot. You still rarely pull off multiple attacks the way the Archer can with Orion's tears, but you can still be a good contributor. You still kind of come off as a junior grade Archer though.

By the time I was on the last tile, the team was powerful enough to massacre large numbers of minions along with their lairs in efficient fashion, so even when your team isn't optimal, you can still perform well (as long as you're not boss hunting).

I did take on Bones but I kind of cheated by forcing him to inhabit a tile where he couldn't get to me often because of chokepoint and his own minions which I kept healthy in front of him. Even so it took about 3 hours and involved an endless supply of soulless and shamblers which took my big attacks most of the time. Only rarely could I afford to shoot at bones. Not really that much fun to watch Bones spawn new monsters on 80% of the turns such that the game seemed like was never going to end. On a regular tile, he would have obliterated me. I just didn't quite have the firepower I needed. For some of those bosses, I'd want 8 characters!
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