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Subject: September Update -- Where you hoping for good news? rss

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Scott Heenan
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Hopefully not, cause you won't find it here:

Well, you might not find it in the update from OSS/Ares, but you'll certainly find it below from Phil.

Quote:
From the print bureau/manufacturing from August 26 :
"The production team is working on creating [updated box dimensions], but are running into a few issues. The main issue is that the contract they have on hand (the one from October) no longer appears to be correct with the components uploaded.

Sorry for the inconvenience of the delays, and we are nearing the end of the prepress checks, i promise you."

Our project manager has sent 3 replies in the interim and as of now there has been no update. This is not what I was hoping to share at this point, but unhappily it's where the process stands.

We are still waiting.

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Tyson W.
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Thank you for the update. I have a preorder with CSI after I missed out on the KS.
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darksurtur
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What a disaster. I find it most concerning that they are making these updates backers only, which is to limit circulation, I assume. But they have also taken non-Kickstarter pre-orders, and those people will be in the dark.
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Phil Miller
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I kissed my pledge goodbye months ago. I suggest you all do the same. These updates are nothing more than stall tactics to try and cover money that has doubtless been swindled away.

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ArrBeeDee Dial
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'News' is better than 'no news' so I won't throw stones.

Never invest what you can't afford to lose is in every prospective. Though the other common quote: "Past performance is not indicitive of future value" actually sounds hopeful.
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David E
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PhilFromIT wrote:
I kissed my pledge goodbye months ago. I suggest you all do the same. These updates are nothing more than stall tactics to try and cover money that has doubtless been swindled away.



I'm genuinely curious - what do you think is the scenario here? That OSS simply took the money, never started production on High Frontier, and is just releasing periodic purely fictitious updates because... why?
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Roger BW
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I'm assuming incompetence rather than malice. (I find it a good principle in life in general.)
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Mark Nicosia
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PhilFromIT wrote:
I kissed my pledge goodbye months ago. I suggest you all do the same.

Oh come on... a little melodramatic, don'tchathink? Yes, it's disappointing it's delayed a bit more... but, there is zero chance that Phil doesn't deliver at all and our pledges are just lost.
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Roger BW
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zenpunk wrote:
Oh come on... a little melodramatic, don'tchathink? Yes, it's disappointing it's delayed a bit more... but, there is zero chance that Phil doesn't deliver at all and our pledges are just lost.
My mental model gives the highest-probability outcome as "sorry, guys, we don't have enough money left to do this, boo hoo, buy our other games". That's what other KS projects with this kind of excuse pattern tend to do.
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Will H.
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zenpunk wrote:
PhilFromIT wrote:
I kissed my pledge goodbye months ago. I suggest you all do the same.

Oh come on... a little melodramatic, don'tchathink? Yes, it's disappointing it's delayed a bit more... but, there is zero chance that Phil doesn't deliver at all and our pledges are just lost.


Phil's company is Sierra Madre Games. They are not publishing High Frontier 3rd ed.--Ares/OSS is. So while your faith and trust in Phil Eklund may be well deserved, it has nothing to do with the third edition of High Frontier unfortunately.
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Brian Burnley
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Firedrake wrote:
I'm assuming incompetence rather than malice. (I find it a good principle in life in general.)


Hanlon's Razor, if you ever want some dude's name to attach to that cognitive method. I find it difficult to default to (my impulse is to feel slighted whenever something goes awry blush), and I don't know how well it maps to reality, but it certainly improves one's ability to interact/negotiate with those responsible for the malice/incompetence.
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Scott Heenan
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Perhaps I'm an optimist, but I'm still certain that I will eventually get my copy of this game. I'm not sure when... but I'm in my early 40s, so, absent any unforeseen events, I think I'll live to see it. I mean, so far, I've backed a number of projects, some with delays, and I've only had one not make it (and I honestly wasn't surprised on that one).

Still, on the off chance that anyone actually involved in the project is reading this, despite the numerous delays, lack of photos of anything, etc., etc., etc., all of which are really inexcusable. I do still expect to get this someday.
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Robert Fox
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I expect the game will be printed someday, although their updates seem to be intentionally twiddling their thumbs. Most of those "major" issues seem to be something that could have been solved with a few e-mails over the course of a day.

That being said, if I ever hear the term print bureau again it'll be too soon.
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Arthur Dougherty
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Sometimes the things that pop up in the high frontier updates remind me of what used to pop up int the Total War = Total Wait thread in the wargamers section of bgg.
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Jonas Åkerblom
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I have written with Phil and he is as much in the dark as all of us. He personally cannot give more then his hopes that the game will be published. I am pretty sure Ares have been tricked by the Chinese printing company and all the money is lost. Our chance is that Ares switches printing company and covers all the expenses for that.
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What does this mean for High Frontier?
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Carsten Bohne
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awdougherty wrote:
Sometimes the things that pop up in the high frontier updates remind me of what used to pop up int the Total War = Total Wait thread in the wargamers section of bgg.

Must be something with the porosity of the minis...
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Paul Agapow
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Firedrake wrote:
I'm assuming incompetence rather than malice. (I find it a good principle in life in general.)


Indeed. Delivery is next year at this point, plausibly mid-next year. There's been a stream of possible delivery dates and "nearly there" statements, starting with Essen of last year. Now, if they've missed their printer slot, they'll need to schedule a new one, ship the result, maybe (re)pack it, and distribute it. Insert a few more problems based on past performance. All that takes time.

And Phil has nothing to do with it and is powerless. Don't hassle the man.

In the interim, you can jury-rig your own copy from available components. The rules are there as are most of the parts. Probably cheaper too.
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Paweł Bedz
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Bracca wrote:
Our chance is that Ares switches printing company and covers all the expenses for that.

I doubt it. Ares is small company... Very small. You believe that they have almost 200k$?
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Kristabelle Du Bast
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Are the High Frontier cards available for download somewhere?
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Marty Sample
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Bracca wrote:
I am pretty sure Ares have been tricked by the Chinese printing company and all the money is lost. Our chance is that Ares switches printing company and covers all the expenses for that.


If Ares paid before getting any sort of final production quality product, they're idiots.
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Phil Eklund
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Bracca wrote:
I have written with Phil and he is as much in the dark as all of us. He personally cannot give more then his hopes that the game will be published. I am pretty sure Ares have been tricked by the Chinese printing company and all the money is lost. Our chance is that Ares switches printing company and covers all the expenses for that.


High Frontier 3rd edition is my most expansive game, and one I believe will assume an important role in educating the next generation on the accessibility of space. I personally promise if it is not published by OSS/Ares by Oct 2017 (one year and one month from now), I will publish it myself.

I sent all HF3 files to OSS except for the rules illustrations, and I should be able to get those done in a couple of weeks. I have received as royalties 10% of Kickstarter funds, and because I've had a good year I should be able to afford all the fancy plastic parts. I will also make good on all Kickstarter promises (except of course the ones concerning delivery dates). I expect to put the game up for preorder on my website in October, hopefully purchased from OSS but if necessary published myself.

I heard a rumor that OSS is going to Panda Games to produce HF3. If so, I can vouch for them as they have produced most of my games and have never failed me. I know the owners (the Lee brothers) and the chances they have tricked Ares out of their money is zero.

My reputation is everything to me. Without it, I can no longer make games, and making games is both my profession and my life. Therefore, I am giving Ares/OSS one more year to produce, then I will publish on my own in a timely fashion regardless how much of a loss I will take.
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Yani
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phileklund wrote:
Bracca wrote:
I have written with Phil and he is as much in the dark as all of us. He personally cannot give more then his hopes that the game will be published. I am pretty sure Ares have been tricked by the Chinese printing company and all the money is lost. Our chance is that Ares switches printing company and covers all the expenses for that.


High Frontier 3rd edition is my most expansive game, and one I believe will assume an important role in educating the next generation on the accessibility of space. I personally promise if it is not published by OSS/Ares by Oct 2017 (one year and one month from now), I will publish it myself.

I sent all HF3 files to OSS except for the rules illustrations, and I should be able to get those done in a couple of weeks. I have received as royalties 10% of Kickstarter funds, and because I've had a good year I should be able to afford all the fancy plastic parts. I will also make good on all Kickstarter promises (except of course the ones concerning delivery dates). I expect to put the game up for preorder on my website in October, hopefully purchased from OSS but if necessary published myself.

I heard a rumor that OSS is going to Panda Games to produce HF3. If so, I can vouch for them as they have produced most of my games and have never failed me. I know the owners (the Lee brothers) and the chances they have tricked Ares out of their money is zero.

My reputation is everything to me. Without it, I can no longer make games, and making games is both my profession and my life. Therefore, I am giving Ares/OSS one more year to produce, then I will publish on my own in a timely fashion regardless how much of a loss I will take.


What an awesome, heartwarming post, Phil. Thanks for making this hobby a better place.
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Morten K
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That is a very large gesture of you, Phil. Thank you but let's hope it won't come to that! If it should I would gladly pay something for my game to minimise your loss.
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phileklund wrote:
Bracca wrote:
I have written with Phil and he is as much in the dark as all of us. He personally cannot give more then his hopes that the game will be published. I am pretty sure Ares have been tricked by the Chinese printing company and all the money is lost. Our chance is that Ares switches printing company and covers all the expenses for that.


High Frontier 3rd edition is my most expansive game, and one I believe will assume an important role in educating the next generation on the accessibility of space. I personally promise if it is not published by OSS/Ares by Oct 2017 (one year and one month from now), I will publish it myself.

I sent all HF3 files to OSS except for the rules illustrations, and I should be able to get those done in a couple of weeks. I have received as royalties 10% of Kickstarter funds, and because I've had a good year I should be able to afford all the fancy plastic parts. I will also make good on all Kickstarter promises (except of course the ones concerning delivery dates). I expect to put the game up for preorder on my website in October, hopefully purchased from OSS but if necessary published myself.

I heard a rumor that OSS is going to Panda Games to produce HF3. If so, I can vouch for them as they have produced most of my games and have never failed me. I know the owners (the Lee brothers) and the chances they have tricked Ares out of their money is zero.

My reputation is everything to me. Without it, I can no longer make games, and making games is both my profession and my life. Therefore, I am giving Ares/OSS one more year to produce, then I will publish on my own in a timely fashion regardless how much of a loss I will take.

I take my hat off to you, sir.
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