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Star Trek: Attack Wing» Forums » Rules

Subject: Question re: Regents Flagship and Additional Phaser Arrays rss

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Exactly what it says in the title - how would Additional Phaser Arrays act if placed on the Regent's Flagship?

If you use the Regent's Flagship ability to attack 2 seperate targets at range 1 with 5 attack dice (is this classed as a primary weapons attack?), could you then invoke additional phaser arrays to attack another 2 seperate targets at range 1 with 3 attack dice?

Or, could you only use it to fire at a single target in your front arc?

Someone set my mind at ease! Please!

 
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David Montgomery
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APA is it's own attack that you're using instead of your primary weapon. It just so happens to act as a primary weapon for the purposes of range bonuses and other modifiers.
So short answer, it doesn't combo with Regent's Flagship.
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Brian Johnsen
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Also, to answer your parenthetical question, the ship text on the Regent's Flagship does count as a Primary Weapon attack, so it is actually a 5-die attack at Range 1.

http://win.wizkids.com/bb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=2657&p=6493&h...
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Thanks for the answers, so just to confirm:

Using the Regent's Flagship ability I can fire at two ships within range one.

Additional Phasers can then be used to attack a single ship within the forward arc at -2 attack dice?

Or it is an either or case whereby:

I can either use the ability to attack two ships at range one

OR

I can attack a single ship in my front arc at range 1-3, then use additional phaser array to make a second attack within my front arc at range 1-3 at -2 attack dice?

Sorry for the confusion!
 
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David Montgomery
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it is the second -

"I can either use the ability to attack two ships at range one

OR

I can attack a single ship in my front arc at range 1-3, then use additional phaser array to make a second attack within my front arc at range 1-3 at -2 attack dice?"
 
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Excellent - thanks for that David, if it was the other I think it would be a tad overpowered!
 
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Steven Redfearn
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Voice of opposition:
The 360 attacks from Regents are a primary attack (gets range bonus). APA states 'after you make an attack with your primary'. So Regents should get 3 attacks.

Looks like a WORF ruling may be needed for clarification.
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Trueflight Silverwing
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SMDMadCow wrote:
Voice of opposition:
The 360 attacks from Regents are a primary attack (gets range bonus). APA states 'after you make an attack with your primary'. So Regents should get 3 attacks.

Looks like a WORF ruling may be needed for clarification.


"Treat this attack as if it was your primary weapon" is not the same as attacking with your primary weapon.
 
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Steven Redfearn
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Ender02 wrote:
SMDMadCow wrote:
Voice of opposition:
The 360 attacks from Regents are a primary attack (gets range bonus). APA states 'after you make an attack with your primary'. So Regents should get 3 attacks.

Looks like a WORF ruling may be needed for clarification.


"Treat this attack as if it was your primary weapon" is not the same as attacking with your primary weapon.


And Additional Phaser Array doesn't state that.
 
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Evan
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Yeah I am just way lost here.

Regent's lets you make a split attack with (per Brian's link) your primary weapon.
APA says "After you make an attack with your primary weapon, you may disable this card to make an additional attack with your primary weapon at -2 attack dice"
What about that precludes triggering it with the Regent's special primary?


(To the OP's question, "can you split your attack, APA it, and then split that attack?": you can't, not because of anything involving primary weapons, but because the wording on that pesky optional trigger makes it once-per-turn. But yeah, you should definitely be able to get three attacks out of it.)
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I'm glad people can see why I'm confused.

It'll be nice when there's a consensus on the answer! 3 attacks with the Regent's Flagship would be awesome.

Even two at a decent range would be excellent!
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Trueflight Silverwing
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SMDMadCow wrote:
Ender02 wrote:
SMDMadCow wrote:
Voice of opposition:
The 360 attacks from Regents are a primary attack (gets range bonus). APA states 'after you make an attack with your primary'. So Regents should get 3 attacks.

Looks like a WORF ruling may be needed for clarification.


"Treat this attack as if it was your primary weapon" is not the same as attacking with your primary weapon.


And Additional Phaser Array doesn't state that.


No, but the Flagship's ability does (not in those exact words).

"Instead of making a normal attack with your Primary Weapon, " is still not the same as "Make an attack with your Primary Weapon" for regards to triggering "after you make an attack with your primary" on APA. If they rule it that way, that would open up some interesting possibilities for other upgrade combos, but as far as I know, for now it does not work together.

Even David Montgomery mentioned that and he knows more about the rules and interactions of the game than most of the current people working on the game from WK. Take his word as Official until you hear otherwise is a good rule to go by generally.
 
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I've just submitted a post on the WORF, so will see what they say when they come back to me - thanks for the assistance everyone!
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Steven Redfearn
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Ender02 wrote:
SMDMadCow wrote:
Ender02 wrote:
SMDMadCow wrote:
Voice of opposition:
The 360 attacks from Regents are a primary attack (gets range bonus). APA states 'after you make an attack with your primary'. So Regents should get 3 attacks.

Looks like a WORF ruling may be needed for clarification.


"Treat this attack as if it was your primary weapon" is not the same as attacking with your primary weapon.


And Additional Phaser Array doesn't state that.


No, but the Flagship's ability does (not in those exact words).

"Instead of making a normal attack with your Primary Weapon, " is still not the same as "Make an attack with your Primary Weapon" for regards to triggering "after you make an attack with your primary" on APA. If they rule it that way, that would open up some interesting possibilities for other upgrade combos, but as far as I know, for now it does not work together.

Even David Montgomery mentioned that and he knows more about the rules and interactions of the game than most of the current people working on the game from WK. Take his word as Official until you hear otherwise is a good rule to go by generally.


FAQ:
http://win.wizkids.com/bb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=2772&sid=2526...
Wave 0 –Starter –Enterprise D
When the Enterprise-D or Voyager uses its special ability it is considered to be using its Primary Weapon and it gains +1
attack die at Range 1.

WORF ruling:
http://win.wizkids.com/bb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=2657&p=6493&h...

Therefore: Regent's ship ability to 360 is a primary attack.

APA: https://www.boardgamegeek.com/image/3107420/maskedthespian

Clearly APA only cares that you make a primary attack, so yes the Regent's ability will trigger it.

Pretty sure David is confused as to what he is replying to in this thread as APA does not make its own attack.
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David Montgomery
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To address an initial statement, I was looking at Improved Phasers, since I was working on my review of the Enterprise B. That has a whole other can of works that we won't get into here. By the way, this is why card text of everything in question is very useful when you post rules questions.

Regent's Flagship is a special ability that uses a set dice count and gets a range 1 bonus. That doesn't necessarily make it an attack with your primary weapon. I understand what the links say here, but there's a wording disagreement between "attack with your primary weapon" and "using your primary weapon." The attack is still being made with a special ability.
For the sake of argument, let's say APA works on Regent's named ability; what dice count do you use to determine how many attack dice to roll for the APA followup attack? Is it your PWV - 2 or is it 3 (5 you shot at them -2)?

I ask because the APA says to use Primary Weapon -2, but that's not what you used to make your initial attack, so that seems off to me. It's not an additional shot if you're using a different calculation.


 
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Thomas Plummer
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Isn't the regent's PMV 5 anyway? I'd assume the answer would be 3 dice. (single attack =5-2 =3/ Double attack at 5, -2 =3)

tl;DR: 6 of one, half a dozen of the other
 
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David Montgomery
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Dracomax wrote:
Isn't the regent's PMV 5 anyway? I'd assume the answer would be 3 dice. (single attack =5-2 =3/ Double attack at 5, -2 =3)

tl;DR: 6 of one, half a dozen of the other

Not if you make the attack at range 1. Then primary would be 6 due to range bonus.
 
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Michael Pantner
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mathguy6189 wrote:
Dracomax wrote:
Isn't the regent's PMV 5 anyway? I'd assume the answer would be 3 dice. (single attack =5-2 =3/ Double attack at 5, -2 =3)

tl;DR: 6 of one, half a dozen of the other

Not if you make the attack at range 1. Then primary would be 6 due to range bonus.


PWV doesn't get changed by range, or by other upgrades. ie, Type-8 Phaser

When you attack, you add the extra one.

The same as the range bonus doesn't give your ship extra agility, you just gain an extra defence die.

By my interpritation (obviously, waiting on hearing from Worf), you could trigger APA from using the Regent's flagships special ability.
You could make the 2xsplit attacks and then make the 3rd attack with 5-2=3 Dice only being able to target a ship in your forward arc.
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Evan
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mathguy6189 wrote:
Regent's Flagship is a special ability that uses a set dice count and gets a range 1 bonus. That doesn't necessarily make it an attack with your primary weapon.


It absolutely does. Andrew ruled that the Enteprise-D's "Instead of making a normal attack with your primary weapon, you may fire in any direction" etc should be read as describing a different kind of attack with your primary weapon.

As has already been established, this was codified in the FAQ and WORF even bothered to explicitly tell us "yes, this card works the same way as those others with identical language." One couldn't hope for a more open-and-shut case than this.

As for the number of dice, I'd also read it as causing a "normal" primary attack (of 3 dice total from one's forward arc, 4 if at range 1), but there probably is room for disagreement on that one.
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Typheron Joyzxqk
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One thing, is that Andrews post is from 2013 so may have been superseded by WORF at this point.
 
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Steven Redfearn
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Typheron wrote:
One thing, is that Andrews post is from 2013 so may have been superseded by WORF at this point.


Its in the current FAQ I quoted and linked above.
 
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Evan Burris
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With specific call outs to both Enterprise and Voyager which have very similar text to the Regent's flagship.
 
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Steven Redfearn
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PicardX wrote:
With specific call outs to both Enterprise and Voyager which have very similar text to the Regent's flagship.


Which is why I also linked the WORF ruling about Regents.
Did no one follow those links?
 
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Evan Burris
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Actually I was trying to qualify your statement. I looked at the link to the specific wording and read the call out.
 
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