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Mansions of Madness: Second Edition» Forums » Rules

Subject: Mythos Darkness events rss

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Olivier Prevot
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Hello fellow investigators !
There are a few mythos events that places darkness tokens in a place then impact the investigators in that space. However those events often have to do with the fact that you are in a darkness space (thematically speaking).
Example :
The light dies slowly. Place Darkness in each space in the X. This mythos event affects each investigator in the X.
In the dark, you hear a strained sound, as if someone is being strangled. You fear you will soon feel cold hands around your own neck. Suffer 2 facedown Horror ([WIL] negates).

But that does not take into account the fact that you can have a light source for example.
What do you think ?
 
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Reverend Uncle Bastard
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grouik wrote:
Hello fellow investigators !
There are a few mythos events that places darkness tokens in a place then impact the investigators in that space. However those events often have to do with the fact that you are in a darkness space (thematically speaking).
Example :
The light dies slowly. Place Darkness in each space in the X. This mythos event affects each investigator in the X.
In the dark, you hear a strained sound, as if someone is being strangled. You fear you will soon feel cold hands around your own neck. Suffer 2 facedown Horror ([WIL] negates).

But that does not take into account the fact that you can have a light source for example.
What do you think ?


That is why the rules state that if you are in a room with a light source then darkness effects have no effect.

Rules Reference, Page 7:

"Investigators ignore Darkness in a space containing a Light Source or Fire or a space adjacent to a space containing a Light Source or Fire."
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Johan Anglemark
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reverendunclebastard wrote:
grouik wrote:
Hello fellow investigators !
There are a few mythos events that places darkness tokens in a place then impact the investigators in that space. However those events often have to do with the fact that you are in a darkness space (thematically speaking).
Example :
The light dies slowly. Place Darkness in each space in the X. This mythos event affects each investigator in the X.
In the dark, you hear a strained sound, as if someone is being strangled. You fear you will soon feel cold hands around your own neck. Suffer 2 facedown Horror ([WIL] negates).

But that does not take into account the fact that you can have a light source for example.
What do you think ?


That is why the rules state that if you are in a room with a light source then darkness effects have no effect.

Rules Reference, Page 7:

"Investigators ignore Darkness in a space containing a Light Source or Fire or a space adjacent to a space containing a Light Source or Fire."

But the Mythos effect doesn't say "Place Darkness. Because there is Darkness there now, therefore..." It says "Place Darkness. Then, suffer 2 horror."

It's not "A, therefore B", but "A and B".

So I don't know.
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Anthony Harlan

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jophan wrote:
reverendunclebastard wrote:
grouik wrote:
Hello fellow investigators !
There are a few mythos events that places darkness tokens in a place then impact the investigators in that space. However those events often have to do with the fact that you are in a darkness space (thematically speaking).
Example :
The light dies slowly. Place Darkness in each space in the X. This mythos event affects each investigator in the X.
In the dark, you hear a strained sound, as if someone is being strangled. You fear you will soon feel cold hands around your own neck. Suffer 2 facedown Horror ([WIL] negates).

But that does not take into account the fact that you can have a light source for example.
What do you think ?


That is why the rules state that if you are in a room with a light source then darkness effects have no effect.

Rules Reference, Page 7:

"Investigators ignore Darkness in a space containing a Light Source or Fire or a space adjacent to a space containing a Light Source or Fire."

But the Mythos effect doesn't say "Place Darkness. Because there is Darkness there now, therefore..." It says "Place Darkness. Then, suffer 2 horror."

It's not "A, therefore B", but "A and B".

So I don't know.

Reading your example, the rules would say you're affected. If they wanted it as you're interpreting logically, "This mythos event affects each investigator in the darkness in X," would be clearer. I suspect it's brevity versus clarity, but even if you're holding a flashlight, the power suddenly going out is ominous and terrifying (in a world with star spawns).
 
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jophan wrote:
reverendunclebastard wrote:
grouik wrote:
Hello fellow investigators !
There are a few mythos events that places darkness tokens in a place then impact the investigators in that space. However those events often have to do with the fact that you are in a darkness space (thematically speaking).
Example :
The light dies slowly. Place Darkness in each space in the X. This mythos event affects each investigator in the X.
In the dark, you hear a strained sound, as if someone is being strangled. You fear you will soon feel cold hands around your own neck. Suffer 2 facedown Horror ([WIL] negates).

But that does not take into account the fact that you can have a light source for example.
What do you think ?


That is why the rules state that if you are in a room with a light source then darkness effects have no effect.

Rules Reference, Page 7:

"Investigators ignore Darkness in a space containing a Light Source or Fire or a space adjacent to a space containing a Light Source or Fire."

But the Mythos effect doesn't say "Place Darkness. Because there is Darkness there now, therefore..." It says "Place Darkness. Then, suffer 2 horror."

It's not "A, therefore B", but "A and B".

So I don't know.


I think Johan is right on this one. A Light Source does not mean you discard the Darkness token. The Darkness token still exists and so if a Mythos effect applies to any player in a space containing Darkness, it wouldn't matter if they had a light source or not.

Light sources just allow you to ignore the gameplay effect that Darkness has (not being able to spend clues on tests or puzzles).

But maybe that's something FFG can clarify in an FAQ.
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Alexander Steinbach
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The ruling is quite clear on this one.

If it says:

Place a darkness token in the library, this mythos event affects each investigator in the library

Then each investigator in the library is targeted, whether they have a light source or not. Thematically, you don't have your flashlight on when the light is still on in the room, so the sudden darkness will still startle you.

But if it would say:

Place a darkness token in the library, this mythos event affects each investigator in a room in darkness

Then your light source would make a difference and the event would not affect you (or anyone else within range)
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Reverend Uncle Bastard
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BreadRising wrote:
The Darkness token still exists and so if a Mythos effect applies to any player in a space containing Darkness, it wouldn't matter if they had a light source or not.


I don't believe that is true. A mythos event triggered by being in a space with a darkness token is still a "darkness" effect. You don't discard the darkness token when in a space with a light source, but you can ignore its presence.
 
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Reverend Uncle Bastard
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Vardaine wrote:
The ruling is quite clear on this one.

If it says:

Place a darkness token in the library, this mythos event affects each investigator in the library

Then each investigator in the library is targeted, whether they have a light source or not. Thematically, you don't have your flashlight on when the light is still on in the room, so the sudden darkness will still startle you.

But if it would say:

Place a darkness token in the library, this mythos event affects each investigator in a room in darkness

Then your light source would make a difference and the event would not affect you (or anyone else within range)


This, to me, is also the correct reading of the rules. I do not believe there actually are any mythos effects that add darkness and then state a specific location. All of the ones I have encountered have added a darkness token and then affected investigators where there is darkness, although there is a chance they exist and I haven't seen them yet.
 
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Olivier Prevot
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reverendunclebastard wrote:
Vardaine wrote:
The ruling is quite clear on this one.

If it says:

Place a darkness token in the library, this mythos event affects each investigator in the library

Then each investigator in the library is targeted, whether they have a light source or not. Thematically, you don't have your flashlight on when the light is still on in the room, so the sudden darkness will still startle you.

But if it would say:

Place a darkness token in the library, this mythos event affects each investigator in a room in darkness

Then your light source would make a difference and the event would not affect you (or anyone else within range)


This, to me, is also the correct reading of the rules. I do not believe there actually are any mythos effects that add darkness and then state a specific location. All of the ones I have encountered have added a darkness token and then affected investigators where there is darkness, although there is a chance they exist and I haven't seen them yet.

The example I have stated is a real one. Add darkness to location and mythos event affect all investigators in location. By the rules we play we are affected by the event but since hte game is very thematic I was wondering...
 
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Nigel Harris
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This came up in a game we played last night. Just looking at the message log:
Quote:
This mythos event affects each investigator in a space containing darkness.


Goes on to talk about objects being transformed into otherworldly spectres and when the shadows move this effect being magnified. Suffer 2 facedown horror.

We played it so that an investigator with a light source was affected. Possibly incorrectly!
 
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Chris Rogalski
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Ditto here. I had a light source which I figured negated the darkness. Something like Two red piercing eyes stare out from the darkness ....and scare the f------- s--- out of you, effects all investigators in a room with darkness. Not sure I played that right.

Thematically, light source or not, a room with unnatural darkness might have dark shadows that might harbour red piercing eyes. Probably I should have taken the horror.
 
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Reverend Uncle Bastard
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rman wrote:
Ditto here. I had a light source which I figured negated the darkness. Something like Two red piercing eyes stare out from the darkness ....and scare the f------- s--- out of you, effects all investigators in a room with darkness. Not sure I played that right.

Thematically, light source or not, a room with unnatural darkness might have dark shadows that might harbour red piercing eyes. Probably I should have taken the horror.


I am pretty sure when the rules tell you that a light source allows you to "ignore darkness" they are also referring to mythos effects triggered by darkness, so I think you played this correctly.
 
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Johan Anglemark
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reverendunclebastard wrote:
rman wrote:
Ditto here. I had a light source which I figured negated the darkness. Something like Two red piercing eyes stare out from the darkness ....and scare the f------- s--- out of you, effects all investigators in a room with darkness. Not sure I played that right.

Thematically, light source or not, a room with unnatural darkness might have dark shadows that might harbour red piercing eyes. Probably I should have taken the horror.


I am pretty sure when the rules tell you that a light source allows you to "ignore darkness" they are also referring to mythos effects triggered by darkness, so I think you played this correctly.

As I wrote, I'm not sure I agree that's the RAW, but I would houserule it that way, just like I houserule that a barricaded door works against a spawn that is thematically a monster breaking through that door. Theme is important.
 
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Jorgen Peddersen
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jophan wrote:
As I wrote, I'm not sure I agree that's the RAW, but I would houserule it that way, just like I houserule that a barricaded door works against a spawn that is thematically a monster breaking through that door. Theme is important.

The app was updated and has replaced its command in that situation. It now says "If there was a barricade blocking the door, discard the barricade." So your previous house rule isn't needed any more. The situation no longer exists!
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