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Kodama: The Tree Spirits» Forums » Rules

Subject: Score X as if they were Y... rss

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David Jones
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There are several rule cards that read similar to "You may score Mushrooms as though they are Flowers." There has been some discussion in our group as to whether this is two way equivalency or not. For example if I play a card with a Mushroom on top of a card with a Flower, then then it would score both cards because I can score the Mushroom like it is a Flower. However, if I put a Flower on top of a Mushroom, the Flower is scoring symbol. Some of us are saying that this would not count because the card is "scoring Flowers" and not Mushrooms while some of us say that the scoring applies to the whole branch, not just the card being played.

So the question is: when one of these rule cards is in play, do we treat both symbols as though they are equivalent to each other, or is there actually a difference between Scoring Flowers and Scoring Mushrooms?
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Daniel Solis
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It sounds like there are two questions here and I wish to answer them separately:

1) You're right in a sense. It's only a one-way conversion. X is considered X and Y, but Y is only considered Y. That is perhaps not the clearest wording we could have chosen. Sorry for any confusion there.


2) In your example, if you may score mushrooms as if they're flowers, then played a flower card, you'd score any connected flowers and/or mushrooms on the contiguous path down the branch. The intent of the rule is that you have an easier time scoring flowers because they've not become temporarily more common.

As for the latter example, if you played a mushroom card, it would also score any contiguous flowers and/or mushrooms down the branch.


tl;dr: The more permissive interpretation is the correct one. Does that clear things up?


Sorry, my mistake here. See below.
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David Jones
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It does. Thank you.
 
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Daniel Solis
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Oh dear.... I'm sorry, I think I responded too soon without looking at the final printing of the card. It seems I had a few too many previous drafts floating in my head. The wording on the card is as follows:

"During the Growing Phase, score mushrooms as though they were flowers, instead of as mushrooms."

The scoring is NOT as permissive as I had originally thought. My apologies for any further confusion I may have caused. It's the curse of game designers to lose track of the most current version of their rules.

So, Mushrooms are flowers and only flowers in this case.

In the future I should double-check the printed version of the game before making off the cuff rulings.
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David Jones
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I was actually hoping this wasn't the case. The reason I dislike the less permissive scoring interpretation is that there are only three of the "treat X as Y" cards in the Spring deck. This means that three of the starting trunks have a potential first season scoring advantage that the other three trunks do not. In our example, the player starting with the flower trunk can score off of mushroom cards on the first turn, but the player with the mushroom trunk cannot score from flower cards. Knowing this, there is now a strategy to choosing a starting trunk. With permissive scoring, it didn't really matter since all starting trunks were equal.
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Nick Little
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davypi wrote:
I was actually hoping this wasn't the case. The reason I dislike the less permissive scoring interpretation is that there are only three of the "treat X as Y" cards in the Spring deck. This means that three of the starting trunks have a potential first season scoring advantage that the other three trunks do not. In our example, the player starting with the flower trunk can score off of mushroom cards on the first turn, but the player with the mushroom trunk cannot score from flower cards. Knowing this, there is now a strategy to choosing a starting trunk. With permissive scoring, it didn't really matter since all starting trunks were equal.


This is not the case.

The card in question says "During the Growing Phase, score mushrooms as though they were flowers, instead of as mushrooms." This does not refer solely to the card you play. All occurrences of mushrooms should be treated as flowers. When this card is out, the mushroom trunk and the flower trunk function identically.

This card went through several wording changes throughout development. We may not have found a perfect one, but this was the best that we could find.
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James R. Gracen
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nicklittle wrote:
The card in question says "During the Growing Phase, score mushrooms as though they were flowers, instead of as mushrooms." This does not refer solely to the card you play. All occurrences of mushrooms should be treated as flowers. When this card is out, the mushroom trunk and the flower trunk function identically.

This card went through several wording changes throughout development. We may not have found a perfect one, but this was the best that we could find.

Just picked up this wonderful game and played it for the first time with my wife last night. I decided to browse the forums here to make sure my interpretation of the rules was correct. From what I've read, I was spot on (we have the 2nd edition of the game).

I just wanted to be crystal clear on this subject however. When you have a Decree card with the text: "During the Growing Phase, score [Feature X] as though they were [Feature Y], instead of as [Feature X]," that simply means to treat every instance of [Feature X] as if it were [Feature Y], on newly placed branches, on existing branches, and on tree trunks, for this entire growing season, correct?

Also, certain Kodama cards which grant you points for matching features on certain branches to the feature on your tree trunk would not be affected, since Kodama cards are played in the Kodama Phase, not the Growing Phase, and the Decree card specifies it is active only during the Growing Phase.

In other words, in the above example, if you had [Feature Y] on your tree trunk, you would not score for each instance of [Feature X] or [Feature Y] which matched the criteria of the Kodama card during that season's Kodama Phase, correct?
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Nick Little
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You are correct on all fronts.
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