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Kingdom Death: Monster» Forums » General

Subject: KS price guessings... rss

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Alberto Guerrero
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I just keep reading that everyone who already own the game don't want to see a big discount on the KS. I can't see the point to KS the game then (wouldn't it be a pre-order then?). So what are your guessings about it? Or how much would you be willing to pay?

I'd instantly back it if i see a 200$ (plus shipping) price tag, but 250$ is what i hope. 350$ and i'll definitely wait for retail (if some day i want such an expensive game).

Maybe it's because i'm not a mini fan and i'm just here for the game itself (i love minis, but i hate painting them, so...).
 
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alberto_gm87 wrote:
I just keep reading that everyone who already own the game don't want to see a big discount on the KS.

I haven't seen that, speaking as an owner of the game.

What I have seen is people pointing out that a huge discount is unlikely, considering the production cost of the game and the fact that the first Kickstarter -- in retrospect -- underpriced everything dramatically. I doubt that Poots & Co. want to spend yet another three years making up for massive Kickstarter-fueled debt.

A small discount would be expected for Kickstarter, but I'd be quite surprised if the pledge gave more than a 25% discount for the reprint (i.e., 300 USD).
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scott Murray
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I could see this being like the Millennium Blades reprint kick starter

Small discount but focus on expansion. Small funding goals to add to base game which original backers will get for pledging a special option.
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Nathan Ehlers
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I think MB is a good example. The discount on the core set was slightly under MSRP, but still higher than if you just bought the game at an OLGS. The value really came in with the promos added on.

I really hope it doesn't balloon and there's another crazy amount of expansions thrown in to account for the enthusiasm of the backers. There's really no reason they can't push out 1 to 2 expansions a year at this point instead of waiting 3 years to push out 10 expansions.

I'd be very surprised to see it priced under $300. At that point, it's worth buying just to flip on ebay and that's profit loss that KD could be seeing. People will buy it at $400 plus some promos. They'd be ecstatic to buy it at $350 plus some promos.
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Kain
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It's supply and demand scenario really. People spend $400 on kick starting Minature games all the time. Also considering KDM base set kept selling out at $400. Business sense wise. Where's the benefit from short selling your own profit when demand is there.

He's not selling lifeblood, it's a premium something something dark side hobby as such pricing is probably gonna be like $350.
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Hugh Jorgan
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I remember reading Poots saying that KD Monster barely broke even, financially. I'm guessing he's referring to the units sold for the Kickstarter campaign, at $250 a pop as well as the retail units at $400, which I bought.

Poots, or at least the folks manufacturing the cards, have already had to cut costs, if you look at the Hunt Event cards and questionable quality of a few other cards. I'd like there to be fewer quality issues in this next run and the standard for the components, already of high quality to stay the same and I think that's what Poots is adamant about too.

So, I'm hoping for nothing near the $250 KS price. I'd be satisfied if it stayed at $400, perhaps $350. The demand is there, there's no need to cut the price and quality for the sake of more customers.
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Jason Hofstedt
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I must agree with Hugh - I'm quite willing to pay $400+ on the KS campaign if I think that it will allow for higher quality across the entire list of components, like cards, etc. I just hope that enough people share my enthusiasm if that happens to be the price point - I don't know how successful the KS will be if it's more.

If you have any reservations about spending that much, you should consider that, in addition to being a game, and also in addition to being a great pastime for a hobbyist, KD:M is also...gotta say it...a work of art, and its collectible value will likely always reflect that. It's not a game you're going to lose money on if it's personal value to you someday wanes and you put it up for sale.

The absolute WORST thing that could happen is sacrifice of quality for a lower price tag. I'm hoping for a nice, general upgrade of some kind, and I'm perfectly willing to pay for it.
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Alberto Guerrero
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I don't think the game costs 400$ to create it. The molds are already done, the art is there, now it's just 'the components price'. I'm sure he could 'sell' it at 250$ and still make a big profit.

For me it's not the same a KS than buying it in their web. You buy and just have to wait the delivery guy. You support a KS and have to wait for them to create it, with all the issues that could happen.

It's the first time i see consumers hoping for a higher price tag I assume all of you already have the game? whistle
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No one here is suggesting that we don't WANT the game to be cheaper. We are saying that we do not EXPECT it to be close to the 1st KS pricetags for all the reasons stated above.

What I assume that we all want is that the numbers be made properly this time. This will mean that he will deliver on a more timely fashion, and that there will be no more financial struggles which at the end of the day might turn against everyone. If this means higher prices (to a reasonable extent), so be it.

My personal bet would be that the core game be between $275 and $350. Just a hunch.





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Adrien Boyeldieu
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alberto_gm87 wrote:
I don't think the game costs 400$ to create it. The molds are already done, the art is there, now it's just 'the components price'.


Components price, rental of an office in New York, rental of warehousing for the game before it ships out, shipping the game from China to the various hubs, wages for all the staff currently employed, Adam and his family's living expenses, and maybe a little profit to put back in the company.

So no, not just components price.
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theweefrenchman wrote:
alberto_gm87 wrote:
I don't think the game costs 400$ to create it. The molds are already done, the art is there, now it's just 'the components price'.


Components price, rental of an office in New York, rental of warehousing for the game before it ships out, shipping the game from China to the various hubs, wages for all the staff currently employed, Adam and his family's living expenses, and maybe a little profit to put back in the company.

So no, not just components price.


So, just about every other company.
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scott Murray
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theweefrenchman wrote:
alberto_gm87 wrote:
I don't think the game costs 400$ to create it. The molds are already done, the art is there, now it's just 'the components price'.


Components price, rental of an office in New York, rental of warehousing for the game before it ships out, shipping the game from China to the various hubs, wages for all the staff currently employed, Adam and his family's living expenses, and maybe a little profit to put back in the company.

So no, not just components price.


And remember he had to pay to get those molds created during the campaign. The dragon cost $25,000 alone. So he has a a lot of up front costs to cover before he can sit back and press the auto switch
 
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Jason Hofstedt
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alberto_gm87 wrote:

It's the first time i see consumers hoping for a higher price tag I assume all of you already have the game? whistle


I don't own it yet, and I'm certainly not hoping for a higher price, but having followed it for a while and having a good idea of what I'll be getting, I'm more that willing to pay for the best quality I can have. An option for all resin would be awesome, for example. The concern here is that a low price tag could require sacrifice in quality.

Regardless, it'll be fantastic getting to finally play this game without having to pay inflated prices to scalpers. Even if the price ends up being high, at least I'm supporting the company instead. That's the only reason I don't have it now.
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Alberto Guerrero
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Jasonhofstedt wrote:

Regardless, it'll be fantastic getting to finally play this game without having to pay inflated prices to scalpers. Even if the price ends up being high, at least I'm supporting the company instead. That's the only reason I don't have it now.


I agree here, those ebay scalpers will have to eat their games.

But i still think with a lower price tag he'll make a big profit (and KS shouldn't be for making a ton of money, he should raise money to keep selling the game, and there's where he should be making his money).
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Henry Akeley
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I already own the game (and many expansions and promos) and will gladly pledge $400+ on this kickstarter. I've seen Poots does deliver and he delivers well. He has earned my whole hearted support in giving him close to carte blanche from me.
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alberto_gm87 wrote:
Jasonhofstedt wrote:

Regardless, it'll be fantastic getting to finally play this game without having to pay inflated prices to scalpers. Even if the price ends up being high, at least I'm supporting the company instead. That's the only reason I don't have it now.


I agree here, those ebay scalpers will have to eat their games.

But i still think with a lower price tag he'll make a big profit

Why would you think that? There is no evidence that this is the case.
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(and KS shouldn't be for making a ton of money, he should raise money to keep selling the game, and there's where he should be making his money).

...but KS is the method he's chosen to "keep selling the game." Where on earth did you get the notion that people shouldn't make "a ton of money" on KS?
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alberto_gm87 wrote:
Jasonhofstedt wrote:

Regardless, it'll be fantastic getting to finally play this game without having to pay inflated prices to scalpers. Even if the price ends up being high, at least I'm supporting the company instead. That's the only reason I don't have it now.


I agree here, those ebay scalpers will have to eat their games.

But i still think with a lower price tag he'll make a big profit (and KS shouldn't be for making a ton of money, he should raise money to keep selling the game, and there's where he should be making his money).


If the price is less than $300, I'm absolutely buying at least 3 copies to flip on ebay. The 2nd printing will sell out eventually and those games will go back to being $600-$800 on the after market. If it's $200 then I have space for at least 6 copies in the closet. Heck, there's going to be a space between the kickstarter delivering and the games getting to retail in which you'll be able to double your money. Just look at what happened with Scythe.

I never understand why a group of people whose past time is to play games about economics and markets are so resistant to the world actually functioning that way. Every person I know who was in the original KD:M kickstarter, paid for their KD collection many times over by taking advantage of the way the aftermarket moved combined with what turned out to be an insanely low buy in price.
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Nathan Ehlers
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Quote:
(and KS shouldn't be for making a ton of money, he should raise money to keep selling the game, and there's where he should be making his money).

Quote:
...but KS is the method he's chosen to "keep selling the game." Where on earth did you get the notion that people shouldn't make "a ton of money" on KS?


Fun fact that people seem to not remember. KS takes a cool 5% off the top for each campaign. So when that hot board game closes out at 3 million bucks, KS pockets $150,000USD for running one page on a website for a few weeks. They make another percentage off processing your payment too (up to another 5%).

Think about that while you ponder the righteousness of selling platforms and buying/selling/reselling in a capitalistic market.

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Brandon Holmes
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It would be awesome if they had two versions of this game (a premium and a cheaper version) but unless they officially announce a cheaper version before the Kickstarter is complete I won't risk missing out on this game again.

If I have to buy the "premium" version I am hoping the game can be reduced from $400, $300-350 would be great. My main concern is the price of the expansions though. As a Canadian I am sure that trying to buy these expansions direct, after the Kickstarter, will be cost-prohibitive due to shipping. If I can buy it all now at a reasonable price and save on shipping I'd much prefer that. So I really hope there is a package deal or they available at a reduced price so that I can buy the base set plus gameplay expansions for $600-800 (I haven't followed the expansions closely so I'm not sure if that is reasonable, just my hope is all).
 
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Well I certainly hope we see at least a couple new expansions for those of us who are eager for more material. Of course this KS is going to blow up, so why not list Nightmare Ram and whatever other expansions Poots has near completion.
 
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Alberto Guerrero
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grant5 wrote:

Why would you think that? There is no evidence that this is the case.


Check out Gloomhaven, for example. 79$ plus shipping and more cards, more tiles, more everything except minis ("just 18 metal ones"). I think i read it will retail at 125$, and still make a profit. So probably KD: M isn't that expensive. Remember the first run is always more expensive, but now the molds (most expensive part) and the art (a big amount too) are done.

grant5 wrote:

...but KS is the method he's chosen to "keep selling the game." Where on earth did you get the notion that people shouldn't make "a ton of money" on KS?


I know it's the chosen method, and to me it's a logical decision. You get the money before starting to produce it and it's a big showcase. But where's the benefit for backers? We are not supporting an 'idea' (original crowdfunding labour) , because the game is already done. If the game just have a small discount i won't see the reason to back it instead waiting for retail, and i know many others (that obviously don't own the game yet) that are in the same position. People that already own the game are not (or shouldn't be) the target of a reprint.
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Why is everyone so sure that nightmare ram is near completion? Only update I read about it said that it was a very distant project. Are there info I missed?
 
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alberto_gm87 wrote:
grant5 wrote:

Why would you think that? There is no evidence that this is the case.


Check out Gloomhaven, for example. 79$ plus shipping and more cards, more tiles, more everything except minis ("just 18 metal ones"). I think i read it will retail at 125$, and still make a profit. So probably KD: M isn't that expensive. Remember the first run is always more expensive, but now the molds (most expensive part) and the art (a big amount too) are done.

grant5 wrote:

...but KS is the method he's chosen to "keep selling the game." Where on earth did you get the notion that people shouldn't make "a ton of money" on KS?


I know it's the chosen method, and to me it's a logical decision. You get the money before starting to produce it and it's a big showcase. But where's the benefit for backers? We are not supporting an 'idea' (original crowdfunding labour) , because the game is already done. If the game just have a small discount i won't see the reason to back it instead waiting for retail, and i know many others (that obviously don't own the game yet) that are in the same position. People that already own the game are not (or shouldn't be) the target of a reprint.

Oh, there is no retail. There is only buying from Poots in the Kickstarter, buying from Poots in the KD store, or buying second-hand from someone who used one of those first two options. I suppose it's conceivable that they could put the game into distribution, but there's been no hint of that happening.

There will be much more to the Kickstarter than a reprint.
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Hey, I would pay $100 more for an option for all the minis I bought to come already assembled. I know the reason why they don't and I know that others are good at assembling and that their minis look terrific; I just know by now that I am hopeless.

Regardless, I played for the first time last weekend and now I know that I'll be in regardless.
 
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Alberto Guerrero
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tumorous wrote:

Oh, there is no retail. There is only buying from Poots in the Kickstarter, buying from Poots in the KD store, or buying second-hand from someone who used one of those first two options. I suppose it's conceivable that they could put the game into distribution, but there's been no hint of that happening.

There will be much more to the Kickstarter than a reprint.


Yep, but when you buy it from Poots in the KD store you just have to wait for it to be delivered, not to be produced. I think it's not the same.

I hope the KS won't be just "a reprint", i hope to see more expansions. Even if i'm not OK with the price, i like everything else related to this game. Great setting.
 
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