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Panzer (second edition)» Forums » Rules

Subject: Spotting - what's going wrong...? rss

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Frank Bradshaw
United Kingdom
Horsham
West Sussex
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Hey everyone - I hear the designer is active on this forum so I thought I'd post to see what shakes out.

My mate bought this highly anticipated game and after a rule read through last week, we sat down for our first battle - Scenario 1 top of the list.

We printed out several extra help sheets, plus also my mate teased out the essential striped down rules as a guide. As Combat Commander veterans we steeled ourselves for the ultimate showdown - tank vs tank.

We understood that we were playing with the basic rule set and things like basic penetration; but we found ourselves utterly confused by the Spotting Phase. Rather than type out what we were trying to do, can someone explain the Spotting Phase to us?

At one point we were getting rid of the spotted (fire/move) counters because virtually all the vehicles were firing/moving/short halting/overwatching, so at Medium range and closer, and as long as there was no block to LOS, everyone could be seen. So essentially the Spotting phase became pointless.

But is that the thing we are missing? That in the basic, early scenarios, we are more looking at the Command/Combat/Movement mechanics? We can see how the game is progressing in terms of difficulty and I love the ability to switch on or off optional rules making each scenario completely varied.

Hope someone can provide some pointers!

thanks
 
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Fernando Sola Ramos
Spain
Pilar de la Horadada
Alicante
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In the Spotting Phase you check which units are spotted. That's it. Keep spot counters, as they modify spotting ranges, and remove them once a unit is not spotted by anyone.

The Spotting Phase is important because you can fire at enemy units using Fire or Short-halt commands only if they are spotted.

Once you begin to use terrain to cover you units, the spotting phase becomes more and more important, although I see your point now that you are learning the game. I guess those rules seem more complicated at first than they actually are when playing. Keep the number of units low at the beginning and you will learn all the basics swiftly.
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Peter
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I agree Fernando, the spotting rules are actually very straightforward (simple even), but something about how the rules are written makes it seem more complex and mysterious than it is.

Frank (OP), if your tanks are all moving and firing, the spotting fairly well follows LOS. Where it gets interesting is when you can set up in a woods hex for example before being "LOS"-ed. In that case you won't keep the move/spot counter (removed during the next turn's spotting phase). So spotting to you will have a range of (I think) 7 hexes, instead of the usual 20.

Adding complexity -- I found the following advanced rules added tactical depth without overwhelming: advanced armor penetration rules & suppression. I also add in the optional "variable AP penetration" and "staggered initiative". I haven't used them, but there are some variable spotting rules that might be to your taste.
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John Correll
United States
Oklahoma
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Our first game of Panzer got us thinking the same thing. I think the fact that a tank can not be fired upon without being spotted first got forgotten and lost during the long A can see B, but C can not see A stuff. It is good info, but a boxed example of why spotting is important and how it fits in the playing would have been aces. Our second game the other night went along well and was an exciting tank battle. Panzer Pusher tutorials good, but lack the all important "page#" of "total pages" at the bottom of them. When loose, they can be easily and confusingly mixed up in a pile of paper.
 
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