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Subject: Amazing Depth, but at what cost? rss

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Kain
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Calgary
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This game seems fantastic. The theme seems rich, options are vast. A real thinking man's game without burden of math puzzles, but still retains solid puzzle elements that definitely feel like they'll have a satisfying effect.

Despite having a worker/dice placement/quick turn movement, I fear that for some of my peers this may give crippling analysis paralysis! I want to pick it up, but should I need to implement a sand glass timer in my games? ;P
Anyone else have similar fear?

edit: side effect of typing topics past midnight. Edited for clarity.
 
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Dan King (The Game Boy Geek)
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I've seen the designer suggest a variant where you roll your dice behind your screen then you're not studying all the dice people haven't placed yet as well as all your own.
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Tahsin Shamma
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I've been reviewing the game for Board Game Quest (not posted yet), the analysis paralysis effect does not come in the dice placement phase from worrying so much about what dice your opponents have as much as what kinds of actions you need to take in what order.

You can't easily control or psyche out opponents into playing certain dice so you really just have to plan your dice placement for the most flexibility.

However, if analyzing opponents as well as your own dice is a problem, then the proposed variant should definitely work.
 
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Dave Anderson
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I've played it twice and love it! I have only played it with my wife and the slight AP did not bother either of us.
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Paul Marchbanks
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Dark63 wrote:
This game seems fantastic. The theme seems rich, options are vast. A real thinking man's game without burden of math puzzles, but still retains solid puzzle elements that definitely feel like they'll have a satisfying effect.

Despite having a worker/dice placement/quick turn movement, I fear that for some of my peers this may give crippling analysis paralysis! I want to pick it up, but should I need to implement a sand glass timer in my games? ;P
Anyone else have similar fear?

edit: side effect of typing topics past midnight. Edited for clarity.


We played for the first time last night and there was some definite AP on my part. Between trying to think a move or two ahead on the code breaking action or trying to figure out what was most important on the action spaces I had some times where I had to think it through. I really liked it though. I think a sand timer would make it fun but you would probably have tons of "oh crap" moments where you didn't place the dice in the order or quantity you really wanted.
 
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Jesús Couto Fandiño
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I'm still very confused about exactly what kind of analysis should go into this. I mean, in the end it is just probable that I suck (somehow I suck at games while loving them ) But I still have not a clear picture in my mind of what should I be looking at in the board and what my options are, apart from the obvious "try to make the missions you have and get more". Blocking people with your dice requires figuring out what are they planning to do with is not that clear - are they going to score a mission? Should I prevent them from moving? How do I decide?

Also becomes a bit difficult with 4 as, well, you may have blocked a guy for putting his dice right now but then somebody else puts the dice they need.

So, in a very general way, for people that have mastered it: what are the strategic considerations you look at when you are planning what you will do?
 
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Y P
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klauplacius wrote:
I'm still very confused about exactly what kind of analysis should go into this. I mean, in the end it is just probable that I suck (somehow I suck at games while loving them ) But I still have not a clear picture in my mind of what should I be looking at in the board and what my options are, apart from the obvious "try to make the missions you have and get more". Blocking people with your dice requires figuring out what are they planning to do with is not that clear - are they going to score a mission? Should I prevent them from moving? How do I decide?

Also becomes a bit difficult with 4 as, well, you may have blocked a guy for putting his dice right now but then somebody else puts the dice they need.

I've only played at 2p, but I can already tell that at 4p it's basically impossible to block others from doing what they want until maybe a few placements into the turn when people have less dice. In 2p you can definitely block by placing dice with values the other player doesn't have adjacent values to, but even then for me it's more a case of figuring out my priorities in what I absolutely need to do and make sure I place a die there so I don't get blocked out. Being able to do my action takes precedence over blocking the other player, but if I can do both then that's a nice bonus.

Quote:
So, in a very general way, for people that have mastered it: what are the strategic considerations you look at when you are planning what you will do?

I haven't even come close to mastering it, but after a couple plays I'm able to take more into consideration. 1st play I didn't even look at the special actions on the Agency cards when deciding which to pick, but by the 2nd play I was able to evaluate that as well.

Make sure to take advantage of your agent's special ability every round if possible. Some are more useful than others, so depending on your agent this might not be possible.

Early on go hard for Missions that provide a permanent resource so you save actions when finishing future missions.

Spread out your spies to make sure you have a lot of options in terms of which Missions you can complete and which Agency cards you can select.

Going first can be very valuable when a desirable card is available, so don't be afraid to skip placing your last die or even last 2 dice in order to pass first and become first player so you can grab a card you really need, although there's always the danger that another player has a card/token with the 1st player special ability.

In higher player counts accept that the game will be more chaotic, so don't count on very tight plans to work all the time. Have flexibility for when other players inadvertently foil your plans.
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