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Subject: Teams? rss

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Roger Brown
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I own Mombasa and have played it several times. I'm struggling with deciding if I really like it. I haven't been trying to get it to the table. I know it's a feature many people like but the fickleness of the control of the land kind of drives me crazy. Also the fact that a person not doing well can be in a kingmaker position; something I really don't like in games.

I have been thinking that a good idea might be to play teams; 2 teams of 2 in a 4 person game. I think it would be really interesting to be able to team up to accomplish things and to work together on a strategy. And it seems the kingmaker thing that happens in this game would be eliminated.

I think I will suggest it to my fellow players soon.
Any thoughts.
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J
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Alexandria
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While I personally am a big fan of any team variant (teammates are just another form of asymmetry to me) Mombasa would probably be a pretty hard one to pull off. If you just want to combine 2 player's scores you can do that but it isn't really a team game if there isn't much interaction you can do for each other.

Books, Diamonds, Stock buying and card purchasing are really individualistic activities and I can see no variant which would in any way change that.

You could argue that one person can expand a company while another invests in it but then all the opponents need to do is invest in it more and then it's all rather meaningless.

Bottom line is I see no way to do a team variant with a meaningful change to the rules such that it feels significantly more than 4 players play their game and add up 2 of the scores at the end.
 
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Armand
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It's a variant therefore it's stupid, unnecessary, and presumptuous of you to waste your time and ours pretending you are a board game designer!

You're welcome, BGG, I got you covered!

(Now, strictly between you and me: I love team games; I love Mombasa; I think it's a brilliant idea to combine them. I wish you the best of luck hammering out the specifics and I can't wait to hear how it goes.

If I may offer a little advice, keep to Alex P's style: speed equals fun. Don't let the players get bogged down in discussion. If they try to predict each other's behavior and succeed you'll get some great high-five moments.

You might also consider playing around with a Tigris&Euphrates type scoring system where each team only gets to log their lowest score for a given item.

Ex.: you and I are a team. I score 56 for Capetown and 18 for bookkeeping. You score 28 for Capetown and 48 for bookkeeping. We score 28 and 18 respectively for those two fields. Just a thought...

Good luck!)

Dang! ninja'ed!
 
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Tahsin Shamma
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doctoryes0 wrote:
It's a variant therefore it's stupid, unnecessary, and presumptuous of you to waste your time and ours pretending you are a board game designer!

You're welcome, BGG, I got you covered!

(Now, strictly between you and me: I love team games; I love Mombasa; I think it's a brilliant idea to combine them. I wish you the best of luck hammering out the specifics and I can't wait to hear how it goes.

If I may offer a little advice, keep to Alex P's style: speed equals fun. Don't let the players get bogged down in discussion. If they try to predict each other's behavior and succeed you'll get some great high-five moments.

You might also consider playing around with a Tigris&Euphrates type scoring system where each team only gets to log their lowest score for a given item.

Ex.: you and I are a team. I score 56 for Capetown and 18 for bookkeeping. You score 28 for Capetown and 48 for bookkeeping. We score 28 and 18 respectively for those two fields. Just a thought...

Good luck!)

Dang! ninja'ed!


I love Mombasa and I don't see a problem with this if people want to play that way.

I would say take the highest track score from each track is the team's track score. Then take the average between the two players for the diamond and book tracks.

 
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Tucker Taylor
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Is your score positive? You win! (Some players win more than others.)
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doctoryes0 wrote:
It's a variant therefore it's stupid, unnecessary, and presumptuous of you to waste your time and ours pretending you are a board game designer!

You're welcome, BGG, I got you covered!

More like "It's a completely untested suggestion for a variant, so why are you wasting our time with it? Go try it out and let us know how it plays."
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Everyone can play games as they wish, of course. Since the OP asked for our thoughts, my $0.02 is this:

Based on your comments it seems that you just don't like games with incentive management, yet it is an integral part of Mombasa- you have to look at which companies other players are investing in and react accordingly. If I see someone shooting up the Cairo track and also picking up a bunch of helmet cards, then naturally I should expect that Cairo is going to do well, and I can react by purchasing cards that are Cairo stocks and moving up the track myself.

Despite superficial appearances, Mombasa is NOT a multiplayer-solitaire Euro where you churn some resources into points and compare scores at the end. Your level of control over the game state in a 4p game against three competent opponents will be around 25%; so you have to attempt to assess and if possible manipulate their incentives so you can benefit from their actions. Trying to remove this dynamic by turning it into a 2p game seems completely antithetical to what the game is about. If you want to play a game with less interaction where you exercise complete control over your destiny and simply compare who did better at solving the puzzle, there are TONS of games out there for you to enjoy. Why turn Mombasa into something it fundamentally is not.
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Armand
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I agree with everything you said with just two exceptions. First, Mombasa is a great 2p game so it should in theory work really well with 2p teams.

And second,
verandi wrote:
Why turn Mombasa into something it fundamentally is not.


Because he bought it, it's paid for, and he thinks he'll have more fun with it if he plays it differently. You know, some designers have a hard time teaching their own games because they can't remember which of the fifty rulesets (aka 'variants') they playtested they finally settled on.

Fact is, there are a lot of fun things you could do with the bits in any given box!
 
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LudoH LudoH
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Just to counter balance the other opinions ...

I must say that I quite like the original idea also because in this kind of game you would naturally "team" to make one company progress with another person interested in the company, but if the team is official you avoid some kind of diplomatic aspect that you might dislike in the game (like you work at two players on one company until the other changes strategy and you feel you were betrayed).

I am not saying that the game is bad at 4 players, I am not saying neither that team play would be better than the normal rule. However I agree with the original poster that playing by teams seems like an interesting variant to try. Some prefer might prefer this gameplay to the original one.

I am not yet much experienced with the game neither thus except from the global point of view I cannot comment on what is the best way to score or what common element we can add. If I was playing a first try I would add the points of the two players; perhaps I would also try to share the money: that could create nice synergies where one player is better at getting money without needing any discussion (you should just be able to reserve some money if you need it for your turn)
 
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Roger Brown
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LudoH wrote:
perhaps I would also try to share the money: that could create nice synergies where one player is better at getting money without needing any discussion (you should just be able to reserve some money if you need it for your turn)


Original poster here. When I first posted I hadn't really thought much about how it would work but after all the feedback I have some ideas. I hadn't thought about sharing money as the previous poster suggested but I had thought about being able to share other things. For example, it's my turn and I just got 2 bookkeeping points during expansion. I see the perfect books my partner needs and I see he has the Bookkeeper face up. So I get the books and he can use them on his turn.

So, yes, add scores at the end, but along the way teammates can optimize their resources and opportunities.
 
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