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BattleCON: Trials of Indines» Forums » General

Subject: Replayability? rss

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Jack Swan
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How long does it take till each duel is 'solved' by an optimized strategy?
In other words: is a duel of A against B more or less a puzzle to determine who wins using a fixed set of moves?
With only 10 characters, how soon will you need more to keep having fun?
 
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Corporal Joe Bauers
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Unplugged wrote:
How long does it take till each duel is 'solved' by an optimized strategy?
In other words: is a duel of A against B more or less a puzzle to determine who wins using a fixed set of moves?
With only 10 characters, how soon will you need more to keep having fun?
It depends on you. Just about any character can beat any other character, depending on your strategy. Some characters I could play week after week without the urge to get more, others I can barely play once without wishing for something more.

Your optimized strategy will probably be defeated in rematches because your opponent will learn your heuristic and play their counters to it.
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Kyle Currie
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Agreed with Corporal Bauers (props to the awesome Kingdom Death avatar by the way).

Fighters are not solvable puzzles. Every fighter is capable of defeating every other fighter. There may be weak and strong matchups depending on the characters involved, but no fight is truly impossible. You have plenty of options each turn, and those options change depending on the order of your attacks and pairing of your cards.

You could totally play this game with just these 10 fighters and get dozens of matches out of it. Usually it takes ~3 fights or so to even get a proper feel for a character's option and unique abilities. Multiply that by 10 fighters, and you've got 30 matches just trying to get some basic comfort with all the fighters. Then you've got all the different matchups against other fighters. Trust me, there's plenty of game in one box.

Not to say that you shouldn't get more! I have and will be getting all fighters to date and into the future, and the amount of total options at this point is utterly staggering.
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Aaron White
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Even with 10 fighters, that is a lot of matchups. Even if you played the each matchup 10 times, that would be a thousand or more games. So I think you should be ok for replayability.

If it helps, BattleCON has a lot of room for personal play style. So even if you solve your friend who plays Hikaru, get ready to be surprised when someone else plays him totally differently.

Hope this helps.
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Tiran Kin
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Unplugged wrote:
How long does it take till each duel is 'solved' by an optimized strategy?
In other words: is a duel of A against B more or less a puzzle to determine who wins using a fixed set of moves?
With only 10 characters, how soon will you need more to keep having fun?



There's only one matchup which currently stands a chance of being "solved," which is Voco vs. Zaamassal, and even that hasn't actually been solved. Since players can choose their starting discards (i.e., opening hand), highly-advanced players in an exhaustively-researched matchup (none of which exist yet) can engage in counterplay and prediction before the game even starts, which damages the "solution."

(Incidentally, Voco is widely regarded as one of the weakest characters in the game.)

"Solved" implies a different kind of game than BattleCON, as the others above have mentioned. If you determine your "best possible" opening move and play it predictably, then I'll quickly learn that pattern and play something that beats it. Then it won't be your best play, so you have to pick something else; if I anticipate you doing that, I'll pick something else... and so it goes.

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Alex Martinez
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Late to the party, but I'll agree with what everyone else has said. One of the things that makes Battlecon remain one of my favorite games is that it is highly interactive.

Most games are interactive to some degree or another. There are a few non-interactive game like Candyland where nothing the players do matter. Then there are low interaction games where players do interact, but it's still mostly about knowing the right move to play in situation X.

Then there are games like Battlecon where it's almost all about player interaction. Sure, fighters each have their own unique strengths and weaknesses, but even within that framework, there's still a ton of player interaction going on.

As people have pointed out, in order for this game to be "solved", it would require both players to stick to a rigid decision spectrum. This is a game that shines with repeated plays because of how interactive it is. Here's how all my teaching experience goes:

GAME ONE: Players just randomly swing at each other with random results for most of the match. By the halfway point, one player figures out a tactic that works. (At this point, I've seen a lot of players lose interest in the game, thinking it's just random. But those who stick with it are rewarded.)

GAME TWO: Both players begin to grasp their fighters and how those fighters interact. Both players will seek to play to those strengths. Usually, the simpler fighter will win though not always. By game end, both players are starting to see not just the patterns in the fighters, but the patterns in their opponent's choices.

GAME THREE: Both players begin to anticipate not just their fighters abilities, but also their opponent's tendencies. More importantly, they begin to assess their own tendencies and try to adjust those to avoid being too predictable. The game evolves into a complex web of character and player interactions.

From then on, the game continues, gaining more depth as it goes.

In most games, ten fighters might not seem like that many. But in Battlecon, it's a universe in itself. Replayability is not an issue, so long as you like the game.
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