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Subject: The End of the Game (tie-breaker rules) rss

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Kohn Jevinston
Canada
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The rules say:

Quote:
In the case of a tie, the winner is (in this order):
- The player with the most VP.
- The player with the most Battle VP.
- The player who played earlier in the previous Day phase.


I am getting hung up on the first bullet. Isn't it totally redundant since the players are tied and therefore the second bullet will always apply?

Is it, for instance, supposed to say "The player with the most Permanent VP"?

Or is it simply saying that if Alice had 10 points and Bob and Charlie each had 9, then Alice is the winner followed by Bob or Charlie (depending on bullets 2 and 3).

If that's the case, I understand the reasoning... but it's confusing since most rulebooks for games simply focus on the tie-breaking procedure for tied players only, not the winner order for all players.

 
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brian
United States
Cedar Lake
Indiana
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Kohn wrote:
The rules say:

Quote:
In the case of a tie, the winner is (in this order):
- The player with the most VP.
- The player with the most Battle VP.
- The player who played earlier in the previous Day phase.


I am getting hung up on the first bullet. Isn't it totally redundant since the players are tied and therefore the second bullet will always apply?

Is it, for instance, supposed to say "The player with the most Permanent VP"?

Or is it simply saying that if Alice had 10 points and Bob and Charlie each had 9, then Alice is the winner followed by Bob or Charlie (depending on bullets 2 and 3).

If that's the case, I understand the reasoning... but it's confusing since most rulebooks for games simply focus on the tie-breaking procedure for tied players only, not the winner order for all players.


This is how I took it:

The rules for winning are that at the end of a day phase if a player has at least 8 victory points (or at least 10 if the players wanted the long game) he wins. It doesn't say the most points here. Just if you have 8 points or more you win.

So if multiple people have "more than 8" points, they are all winners - which is technically a tie.

So the first tie-breaker then looks at how many points they actually have. If You have 8 and I have 9, we were both winners by rule, but this tie-breaker now says I win.

Probably a better way to say this is that the game ENDS when a player has 8+ victory points with the winner being the player with the most points. This is usually how other games would state it, making the first point redundant. But since they don't say it in this way, the first "tie breaker" is necessary, even though it is already common sense.
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G√ľnter Immeyer
Germany
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Well, you forgot to read/consider the first sentence in the "The End of the Game" section... laugh

1) "As soon as a player has at least 8 VP (or 10 according to the players' choice) at the end of a Day phase, he is declared the winner."

Then, (I admit) the English rulebook is a little unprecise in continuing with

2) "In case of a tie, ..." - which is of course a bit unclear... as the rules in German (and possibly other languages) phrase it a lot better with

"In case several players meet this requirement [for winning], the tie breaking procedures are as follows:"

...and then the first bullet actually makes sense, because there could be a player with 9 VP and another with 8 VP (enough for a win in both cases, but the player with 9 should obviously trump the one with 8 VP). meeple

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Kohn Jevinston
Canada
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OK thanks for the replies.

Yeah, if I were re-wording the rules, I would state:

"In the case that multiple players surpass 8 VP (or 10 VP) to trigger the end game, then the winner is (in this order):" ... etc.
 
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