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Subject: Question for sleevers out there. rss

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Austin Mckenzie
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Hello

So recently I have backed and purchased a number of card games and other games that need certain cards to remain hidden (so unmarked from cuts and tears etc that can identify them).

I am looking to protect some of my cards but I have one main problem with sleeves. Games I have seen using sleeves seems to get very untidy. When you have a stack of sleeved cards they always seem to slip of one another. When you grab a card from the top of the deck the other below slide and go everywhere.

Is there a brand that avoids this? Are are there any other suggestions. I know I could create many smaller piles of cards but sometimes it is hard to do this when you have little space available.

Thanks
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Dave Thomas
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I have often wondered this myself - I look forward to peoples responses also!

I sleeved all my X-Wing cards as they were getting heavy use and are actively out on the table. But it easily doubles the size of the deck and as Austin notes don't stack particularly well.
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Doug Poskitt
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This was a problem I encountered also.

It doesn't take long before a stack slides everywhere when simply drawing one from the top of the deck.

I got around it by taking all the stacks of sleeved cards in a game, arranging them into equal piles and putting a very heavy book on top. It did the trick.

I can't vouch for your results. but it worked for me.
 
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Chris in Kansai
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Sleeves are by nature slippery, so putting the cards in a box of some kind is your best bet. Buy 'em or make 'em.
 
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A Deal with Death
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My recommendation would be for Dragon Shield glossy finish. Matte finished (especially Ultrapro) are prone to this slipping problem. I've used Dragon Shields to play 100 card EDH / Commander Magic with very little problems.

Beyond that the sleeves are just very nice and sturdy quality, though they aren't cheap.
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A Deal with Death
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heretic_dave wrote:
I have often wondered this myself - I look forward to peoples responses also!

I sleeved all my X-Wing cards as they were getting heavy use and are actively out on the table. But it easily doubles the size of the deck and as Austin notes don't stack particularly well.


The Dragon Shield sleeves will most definitely cause a significant increase in your deck girth, which to me only becomes a problem if the cards no longer fit in the box.
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Austin Mckenzie
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Glad it is not only me that sees this issue.

I will have a look at those Dragon Shield sleeves. I have looked at alternative solution such as card trays. There are so many out there but I have came across these that might just do the trick.

http://www.basicallywooden.co.uk/our-collections/card-dispen...

I have never normally sleeved cards but I don't want soem of my games spoiled by being able to tell which card is which just because it has a knick on it somewhere.

 
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MURRUMBEENA
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Thicker sleeves are generally better. Sleeves with opaque/illustrated backs are best - almost no problems.
 
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Chris
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Here's my suggestion:

Check the sizes of the cards for the games that you bought in Taeraresh's card sleeves thread.

See which of the games have cards that are of a 'standard' size (typically in the 63x88mm to 64x89mm range, which is the 'standard' poker size). Even if they're not of this size, make a note of what size they are. If they are of the standard size, do not bother with sleeves in the short term. Card sleeves with opaque backs are readily available in the standard size and you can defer sleeving them until the cards are actually marked to the point where you can't play with them. Opaque-backed sleeves are also available in some (relatively rare) other sizes.

I have waaaay too many cards in sleeves (I started from a position of pretty much sleeving everything and have gradually moved away from it) and I've slowly come around to the opinion that you only need to sleeve if and only if the following four conditions are true:

a.) Card identity is absolutely critical

b.) Card quality or print quality is sufficiently low that the backs will easily develop identifying marks

c.) The game is sufficiently expensive (or rare) that the cards themselves can't be replaced trivially (e.g. it's not much more money to buy Love Letter, or one of the expansions for Ticket to Ride that contain fresh decks, than it is to sleeve the cards initially -- and neither of these is going out of print any time soon, so don't bother).

d.) The cards are of such a weird size that you can't buy opaque-backed sleeves to retrospectively cover-up any marks that do develop.

There are pretty much no sleeves on the market that do not cause cards to slip-slide over each other when freshly sleeved (this can assist with riffle shuffles, actually ...), and likewise there are no sleeves that don't develop the opposite problem (finger grease and body moisture causing sleeves to stick to each other). Even the thinnest sleeves will thicken up a deck considerably -- which can be a problem if there are a lot of cards in a given game (and the thinner ones also tend to suffer more from the grease/condensation stickiness). You can work around all of these issues -- they're not "fun-enders" -- but people envision sleeves as being a one-shot solution when they often introduce as much annoyance as they solve. When you're going through the deck from King of Tokyo for the third time with a micro-fibre duster getting rid of the surface grease/moisture so the cards don't stick together is round about the point where you go, "F*%k this noise", and realize the game functions perfectly fine without them (the card identities aren't as critical as in a game like poker, or something with Traitors, and even in the worst-case scenario it's not that expensive to replace).

I'm not saying they don't have a place, but don't do as I initially did and end up on a charge to sleeve anything that looked like it might need it.
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Sleeves are slippery at the beginning but this wears off after a few shuffle, so you shoudln't worry about it. As far as I'm concerned, the untidy thing you mention tends to be a problem when stacks are bigger than 100 cards. So most of the time, it isn't really a problem either.

I would not buy Dragon Shield if I were you, as they are very expensive and tend to gather dirt very easily. Deck protectors from ultra pro are a good compromise even though they're not perfect. Mayday are good if you take the thicker sleeves.

I sleeve all my games and I don't have a slippery problem with any of them except for the first few games. It's also mainly due to the air remaining in the sleeve. Once this goes off, the cards stay together.

As for drawing two cards instead of one, this happens to me even without sleeves

You should at least try it with one little game, play it a dozen times, and see how you feel about the sleeves. Avoid penny sleeves, try deck protectors from Ultra Pro, which are pretty standard, and then if you like the sleeved cards, find something better.

Let us know how it goes
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Ian Williams
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Much like Razoupaf, I've found the slippery issue goes away fairly quickly.
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Brad103
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ByDeadlyHands wrote:
My recommendation would be for Dragon Shield glossy finish. Matte finished (especially Ultrapro) are prone to this slipping problem. I've used Dragon Shields to play 100 card EDH / Commander Magic with very little problems.

Beyond that the sleeves are just very nice and sturdy quality, though they aren't cheap.


I've experienced the exact opposite with Ultrapro Sleeves. I specifically picked the matte versions to prevent sliding of cards, they work well for me. I'm using the clear matte sleeves which aren't as 'mattey' as the solid colored ones, but they still remain sturdy in a relatively large stack of cards.
 
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Andrew J.
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Second this! I've found matte to be less slippery -- I have 190-some Glory to Rome cards sleeved and in a single deck, and after a few shuffles they don't slip anymore at all. I also find matte more pleasant to look at, but glossy is often cheaper.

Even so, I usually only sleeve hard-to-find or OOP games, or games I foresee getting a lot of abuse (Council of Verona) as sleeves are generally an annoyance.

Braffe wrote:
ByDeadlyHands wrote:
My recommendation would be for Dragon Shield glossy finish. Matte finished (especially Ultrapro) are prone to this slipping problem. I've used Dragon Shields to play 100 card EDH / Commander Magic with very little problems.

Beyond that the sleeves are just very nice and sturdy quality, though they aren't cheap.


I've experienced the exact opposite with Ultrapro Sleeves. I specifically picked the matte versions to prevent sliding of cards, they work well for me. I'm using the clear matte sleeves which aren't as 'mattey' as the solid colored ones, but they still remain sturdy in a relatively large stack of cards.
 
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Eric Matthews
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I'm not a big sleever, but I sleeve a couple games for various reasons. I find them all slippery frankly; but as far as the messy stacks issue any kind of card holder that fits will help with your stacks during a game (for most games).

Whether it's a standard card holders sold pretty cheaply for use with regular playing cards or custom ones like what sometimes comes with Broken Token organizers (Blood Rage for example comes with one that holds all three decks sleeved) or something you slap together yourself an card deck holder can work great. a card deck holder is particularly useful if you have a large table and need to move a card deck frequently for people to reach; not unlike using a container for tokens or chits on a table.

E
 
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Brad103
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Ganybyte wrote:
I'm not a big sleever, but I sleeve a couple games for various reasons. I find them all slippery frankly; but as far as the messy stacks issue any kind of card holder helps.

Whether it's a standard card holders sold pretty cheaply for use with regular playing cards or custom ones like what sometimes comes with Broken Token organizers (Blood Rage for example comes with one that holds all three decks sleeved) or something you slap together yourself an card deck holder can work great. a card deck holder is particularly useful if you have a large table and need to move a card deck frequently for people to reach; not unlike using a container for tokens or chits on a table.

E


Blood Rage, and any game with small sleeves, likely do need a Card Holder. I sleeved all of Merchant & Marauders, that Cargo deck is tall!
Smaller/Mini sleeves are slippery little devils!
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Dave Thomas
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Mine were in Fantasy Flights standard sleeves [for X-Wing], don't seem to be losing the slip yet though :S
 
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Dave Thomas
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Any suggestions [and why] on card holder styles that work well for folks?
 
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Brad103
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There was some good discussion and pros/cons about sleeveing on this thread recently too:
https://boardgamegeek.com/thread/1614878/sleeves-am-i-travel...
 
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