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Subject: Latest Update - A Little Worrying rss

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Magic Pink
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Very little of this seems like good news.

Quote:
Hi guys,

We are at this point of fulfillment where we cannot do much to speed things out. Last month was filled with ton of paperwork, permits, shipping, phonecalls, bad news, good news, assebly confirmations, add-ons, customs preparation etc. The production is done. Shipping is in progress and we will finaly have product in our hands at the Spiel. At least it is what we hope for if nothing goes wrong from this point. When we have it we will make a proper pictures and show it to you in the next update because pictures that we received from the factory do not show any details of components.

As for the translation. We were screwed by translation company. We were told that it was done by a native speaker and we paid a good money for it so we were sure that it will be flawless. It is not so we will take steps to fix that. We want to do that with you guys so it should look like this. First we will prepare the manual to the form where it will be easy to edit. We will upload it and ask all of you to make corrections and translations into different languages. We will post PDFs with fixed rules for final insight and when you approve it we will print a number of copies and send to those backers that will want a fixed printed copy. It will cost us a lot of money so we hope that for at least a part of you current manual will be enough but we are prepared to give you replacements.

It is our first campaign of such size and we made a lot of mistakes. It cost us a lot but we managed to fix most of things with one exception (that slotted bases will bring me nightmares for the rest of my life). When we fix that translation problem I believe that we will have a really good quality product and what can be even more important - an awesome game.

Last thing is Vengence Kickstarter. We promise you that except of suggestion and comments from our end whole KS is run by guys from Mighty Boards. Slawek, who made all sculpts for Lobotomy, made those for Vengence as well. He is our artist and he started making them long after all sculpts for Lobotomy were confirmed and accepted by the factory. In short for the last weeks I was 100% dedicated to Lobotomy. So please do not treat it as a another campaing from Titan Forge. Gordon made an awesome job on his product and it would be unfair for him and you to miss it just because you are unhappy with this campaign. They are less that 24h from the end so you still have time to back them!

Romek
 
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Robert Ruescher
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If its only the manual its not too bad, as long as a digital pdf is available upon release/shipping of the game to backers.

It might give some people time to paint the minis if the "fixed" rule book is unavailable for a bit.
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Joe Crane
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Yea the rule book is a worry to me. I have been kind of regretting backing this game now for a while. Hoping it turns out but not holding my breath for it turn out good.
 
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Kevin B. Smith
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Magic Pink wrote:
Very little of this seems like good news.

To me, it seems like mostly good news:
Quote:
1. The production is done.
2. Shipping is in progress
3. We will post PDFs with fixed rules for final insight
4. we will print a number of copies and send to those backers that will want a fixed printed copy.

 
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reaching out from the in-between spaces...
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Baldwin
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Is it ONLY the rulebook with issues? What about the other components?

Jorune
 
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Joe Price
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Let's see, rule book aside:
* Scenarios - right up there with the rule book.
* Character cards - fluff, skills, stats, equipment? - probably out of luck on the skills (if there are any on the card and not entirely on the cards), but the rest is mechanics (so it should be more language agnostic) assuming you can overlook potential fluff issues
* Character skill cards - definitely language heavy and probably more important than the rule book - these are probably my biggest concern along with the mental disorders
* Monster cards - mostly appear to be mechanics and language agnostic - unless they have special rules
* Inventory cards - these definitely seem language dependent - I haven't seen one that hasn't had special rules described
* Mental disorders - in the exact same boat as the character skill cards since they're general character skills

All told... so many cards with so much text. Rules and scenarios are probably the hardest to translate since they probably contain most of the words and difficult concepts - but the cards have the problem about being concise and understandable...

Overall, I have hope. I don't want to say it's a forlorn hope with this information, but I'm not going to not say it either.
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R.P. Kraul
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Because of the strong and unusual theme, I was close to backing but held off based on the game play--or lack of details about the game play. Now I'm glad that I held off. A question I would have at this point is whether they can deliver the product in a reasonable amount of time. No they can't, my instinct tells me. And when it does deliver, will it be something special? Maybe. Maybe not. But this issue with the translation of the rules and the text on the cards--it's a potentially huge issue, and one that will send Lobotomy on a one-way trip to What-Could-Have-Been Land, where it will share a park bench with Dark Darker Darkest. DDD will lament that its publisher couldn't even put together a coherent rulebook. Lobotomy will retort that its publisher doesn't natively speak English yet didn't seek feedback from those who do.
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Jack
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I'm with you, RP. So glad that I resisted the urge despite the alluring theme. The translation was my biggest concern and I've seen some promising games bite the nozzle due to poor/lacking translation. Some can overcome it when there is minimal text, but when there are more complex concepts, how something is said in one language can be MUCH different in another.
 
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Jason Farris
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When I first saw this kickstarter, I immediately noticed how poor the English wording was on the page. I edited the entire kickstarter page, sent a copy to them via email and offered to help them edit their rules for a kickstarter copy. I liked the theme but feared the game would be full of typos and poor grammar.

They never responded, and there was no way I would back any game with such poor English. I'm glad I did not.
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Brian C
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senorcoo wrote:
I'm with you, RP. So glad that I resisted the urge despite the alluring theme...

I found the theme a mixed bag: it sure does open the door to an awesome sort of "Matrix" feel -- which reality are we in now? On the other hand I feel it makes light of all those poor people who are in mental institutions. What a horrible life that must be, and we're out here making/playing a board game about it.

What's next, Homelessness, the Card Game? Draw cards to see if you get to eat today, or if someone stabs you in the back in the middle of the night while sleeping in an alleyway. Roll a die to see if the police care one whit about who stabbed you last night.

I dunno, I backed the game because I saw that spark of creativity that I gravitate towards, but I also saw a sort of callousness in that creativity, and in their business model too (all those exclusives).

If this one goes belly up, I don't know if I'll be too disappointed.
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Jack
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Exo Desta wrote:
What's next, Homelessness, the Card Game? Draw cards to see if you get to eat today, or if someone stabs you in the back in the middle of the night while sleeping in an alleyway. Roll a die to see if the police care one whit about who stabbed you last night.


I'd play that. devil
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Joe Price
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Exo Desta wrote:
senorcoo wrote:
I'm with you, RP. So glad that I resisted the urge despite the alluring theme...

I found the theme a mixed bag: it sure does open the door to an awesome sort of "Matrix" feel -- which reality are we in now? On the other hand I feel it makes light of all those poor people who are in mental institutions. What a horrible life that must be, and we're out here making/playing a board game about it.

What's next, Homelessness, the Card Game? Draw cards to see if you get to eat today, or if someone stabs you in the back in the middle of the night while sleeping in an alleyway. Roll a die to see if the police care one whit about who stabbed you last night.

I dunno, I backed the game because I saw that spark of creativity that I gravitate towards, but I also saw a sort of callousness in that creativity, and in their business model too (all those exclusives).

If this one goes belly up, I don't know if I'll be too disappointed.


https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/certifiablegames/endang...

Next game concept!

How about this one? Maybe closer to your homeless game?
https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/awakenrealms/this-war-o...

Or here's another one sure to cause issues...
https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/poots/kingdom-death-mon...

How about turning a serious issue that's part of the foundation of our species into a game?
http://www.periodgame.com/
(At least this one is trying to be educational right?)

There are a tremendous number of themes that someone some where could call "inappropriate". Even something simple as representing medieval knights - nearly every representation we use of that concept is not how they really were.

I really see this as more of a variant on slasher/horror films - outrageously overblown.

You are more than welcome to your opinion and your right to express it, but I think you've gone overboard with your "Homelessness, the Card Game" example. But I do agree that there's a certain callousness in this game - but you would be hard pressed to live in this would and not see that. After all, we have a long time-honored category: "slap stick comedy". Violence and stupidity for the sake of a laugh. Beating people up for fun and profit.

EDIT: Added quote.
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Robert Ruescher
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"What's next, Homelessness, the Card Game?"

As long as a stretch goal is called "House of Cards" I guess its all right...
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Fluid Karma
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Again, it has been asked a few times here: Does anyone have any information on the components that are affected by this "Lobogate"? The update speaks of "the translation" (so it could mean all parts of the game), but then quickly turns to the manual (so it could mean that only the rules are affected).

If it's just the rules, I would give it a try at Essen Spiel next week, but if not... Skip and let Fireteam Zero fill the gap.

Given the fact that on the KS page and on this forum lots of worries are expressed, it may be wise of TFG to start communicating now.
 
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Jochen Wiesner
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Exo Desta wrote:
senorcoo wrote:
I'm with you, RP. So glad that I resisted the urge despite the alluring theme...

I found the theme a mixed bag: it sure does open the door to an awesome sort of "Matrix" feel -- which reality are we in now? On the other hand I feel it makes light of all those poor people who are in mental institutions. What a horrible life that must be, and we're out here making/playing a board game about it.


Do you play wargames, or any other games that evolve around plotting against and/or killing other people, for example Junta or Bloody Inn?

I perceive Lobotomy as a pop cultural and even satirical approach to the theme, as I do with the other two examples. I have much bigger problems with games that take those themes seriously, but avoid any kind of moral or ethic examination. But that's a personal thing. If others have fun simulating WW II, so be it.



Back to topic: I scanned a handful of pages of the rulebook beta Titanforge provided with the KS update from 9.9.2016 and these didn't seem screwed to me. That's not a guarantee for anything, but I guess the probability of the game turning out to be unplayable is very, very low.
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R.P. Kraul
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Exo Desta wrote:
senorcoo wrote:
I'm with you, RP. So glad that I resisted the urge despite the alluring theme...

I found the theme a mixed bag: it sure does open the door to an awesome sort of "Matrix" feel -- which reality are we in now? On the other hand I feel it makes light of all those poor people who are in mental institutions. What a horrible life that must be, and we're out here making/playing a board game about it.

What's next, Homelessness, the Card Game? Draw cards to see if you get to eat today, or if someone stabs you in the back in the middle of the night while sleeping in an alleyway. Roll a die to see if the police care one whit about who stabbed you last night.

I dunno, I backed the game because I saw that spark of creativity that I gravitate towards, but I also saw a sort of callousness in that creativity, and in their business model too (all those exclusives).

If this one goes belly up, I don't know if I'll be too disappointed.



Themes about insanity and asylums have been so prevalent in horror I'm suprised it took this long for a game like Lobotomy to appear. People seem more sensitive to these themes than they were, say, thirty or forty years ago. Movie studios like Hammer and Amicus got a lot of mileage out of such themes. Maybe there are more outcries now, given that we don't really have a system for treating mental illness, at least we don't in the United States, unless you consider treatment throwing a few pills at someone in hope it cures them.

Don't get me wrong. Asylums became pretty horrible places, especially once government funding dried up and the ratio of patients to care givers grew much too high. To me, personally, horror is one of the great forms of escapism. Thus I don't really understand the protests to Lobotomy's theme. At least TFG were trying to be creative. If they weren't, they would have just provided another zombie game. I applaud their creativity, even though I'm quite happy that I didn't back this game.
 
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J Bailey

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senorcoo wrote:
Exo Desta wrote:
What's next, Homelessness, the Card Game? Draw cards to see if you get to eat today, or if someone stabs you in the back in the middle of the night while sleeping in an alleyway. Roll a die to see if the police care one whit about who stabbed you last night.


I'd play that. devil


They have that. It's called This War of Mine.
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Jack
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asmoron wrote:
senorcoo wrote:
Exo Desta wrote:
What's next, Homelessness, the Card Game? Draw cards to see if you get to eat today, or if someone stabs you in the back in the middle of the night while sleeping in an alleyway. Roll a die to see if the police care one whit about who stabbed you last night.


I'd play that. devil


They have that. It's called This War of Mine.


I have it and I love it. Look forward to the boardgame version of it as well.
 
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Brian C
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asmoron wrote:
senorcoo wrote:
Exo Desta wrote:
What's next, Homelessness, the Card Game? Draw cards to see if you get to eat today, or if someone stabs you in the back in the middle of the night while sleeping in an alleyway. Roll a die to see if the police care one whit about who stabbed you last night.


I'd play that. devil


They have that. It's called This War of Mine.

No they don't, and no it's not.
 
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