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Eclipse» Forums » Variants

Subject: No plasma missles variant? rss

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Steve Dillon
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I haven't played Eclipse in real life in several years. But I do play on the Ipad quite a bit. With the newest update, you have the option of turning plasma missles off. Is this a common variant? I know loading up on plasma missles and annihilating your opponent in the first round of combat is a good strategy... Has there been some errata saying that taking plasma missles out of the game is an official variant?
 
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Jim Parkin
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Nope, but the app AI is notorious for reallllly making a bee-line for Plasma Missile above all other objectives.

Honestly, whether face-to-face or on the app, I've never seen the Plasma Missile OP outcry to be justified. That said, I don't see any reason to adopt the "variant" in the physical game.
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neko flying
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It has been discussed to death on this forum. With this search you can have a look at what has been said on the topic:

https://boardgamegeek.com/spsearch.php?objectid=72125&object...

It isn't a common variant. It isn't an official variant. Some people do play without PM.

The first expansion nerfs the PM considerably. Some people think it has gone too far.
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Chris K.
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dr_steve_dillon wrote:
I haven't played Eclipse in real life in several years. But I do play on the Ipad quite a bit. With the newest update, you have the option of turning plasma missles off. Is this a common variant? I know loading up on plasma missles and annihilating your opponent in the first round of combat is a good strategy... Has there been some errata saying that taking plasma missles out of the game is an official variant?


No, not as an official variant. A number of people keep inquiring about experiences by other players though.

And usually these threads quickly devolve into a big rehash of the discussion whether Plasma Missiles are overpowered or perfectly adequate. Those who feel they are overpowered and who tried to just plain remove them usually report being quite happy and pleased with that option.

That said:
The first expansion (Rise of the Ancients) offered a few "Rare Technologies" that serve as mitigation options outside the "get missiles yourself", "load up on hull and/or shield" and "pin them with cheap ships" strategies that are the most common counters in the base game. Since these rare technologies are easier to execute and in some cases even very specific direct counters to missiles, many people consider this as confirmation that the designers consider PMs overpowered in the base game.
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Jim Parkin
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chrisdk wrote:
many people consider this as confirmation that the designers consider PMs overpowered in the base game.

...but we'll never really know...

ninja
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Chris K.
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Annowme wrote:
chrisdk wrote:
many people consider this as confirmation that the designers consider PMs overpowered in the base game.

...but we'll never really know...

ninja


My personal opinion is:
The designer believes PMs to be balanced but has seen the feedback and realized that the mitigation options in the base game were either not obvious enough or not adequately easy to execute. Hence they included more obvious and easy to execute options.

Also I consider PMs not overpowered at all, but I am willing to concede that it takes considerable experience with the game to come up with adequate counters and hence it is not surprising that most people with only a few games behind them consider them overpowered. Strong PM implementations just appear too much earlier on the experience curve than strong PM counters do.
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Doug DeMoss
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Annowme wrote:
Nope, but the app AI is notorious for reallllly making a bee-line for Plasma Missile above all other objectives.

Honestly, whether face-to-face or on the app, I've never seen the Plasma Missile OP outcry to be justified. That said, I don't see any reason to adopt the "variant" in the physical game.


Excessively so - the AI clearly doesn't take into account the specific matchups it's going to face. I've seen an AI that just got Plasma Missiles take a bunch of UPG actions to convert its entire fleet when it was ALREADY ENGAGED by ships designed specifically to counter missiles (two Phase Shields, three Improved Hull, and a single Plasma Beam, plus the obligatory power source and engine). It might have had a chance if it had stuck with the beams, but going to missiles was just glorified surrender.

And then there are few things more pathetic than an AI Planta that got PM when almost everybody else is also fielding them. No initiative = lose every battle. I really don't think the AI considers initiative at all.
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Jim Parkin
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demoss1 wrote:
Annowme wrote:
Nope, but the app AI is notorious for reallllly making a bee-line for Plasma Missile above all other objectives.

Honestly, whether face-to-face or on the app, I've never seen the Plasma Missile OP outcry to be justified. That said, I don't see any reason to adopt the "variant" in the physical game.


Excessively so - the AI clearly doesn't take into account the specific matchups it's going to face. I've seen an AI that just got Plasma Missiles take a bunch of UPG actions to convert its entire fleet when it was ALREADY ENGAGED by ships designed specifically to counter missiles (two Phase Shields, three Improved Hull, and a single Plasma Beam, plus the obligatory power source and engine). It might have had a chance if it had stuck with the beams, but going to missiles was just glorified surrender.

And then there are few things more pathetic than an AI Planta that got PM when almost everybody else is also fielding them. No initiative = lose every battle. I really don't think the AI considers initiative at all.

Growing pains!
 
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Will Baker
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Yeah the AI always goes for them. I keep them out if my tabletop games too.
 
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Adam Pillari
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We always keep them in. Reason being, they're the only counter to orion antimatter + gluon computer spam.
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Jim Parkin
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Adder007USA wrote:
they're the only counter to orion antimatter + gluon computer spam.




mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
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Mistah Frooza
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Adder007USA wrote:
We always keep them in. Reason being, they're the only counter to orion antimatter + gluon computer spam.


Yeah this is what I don't get. Without PMs in the game, Antimatter Cannons just become way too powerful. They're already insanely deadly in the wrong hands.
 
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