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Subject: It's time to support Trump rss

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Mac Mcleod
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Seriously... it's too far from the election still. We need Trump to make it a couple more weeks so it's too late to change candidates.

Voting has already started so MAYBE it's too late.

But a huge number of anti-trump voters would vote for a dog as candidate if the mercers give trump the ax and suggest the RNC nominate the dog.

The "relief" bounce from trump going away and say, "Paul Ryan" would be large. And if trump "voluntarily" withdrew from the race and endorced the proposed candidate (which he would do for money I'm sure), the RNC might retain many of his current voters.



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Xander Fulton
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Doesn't seem super likely
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Pontifex Maximus
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XanderF wrote:


Goody, then we can still keep pointing out what a evil deplorable human being he is. What fun.
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Mac Mcleod
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XanderF wrote:


It does give me solace Xander.

Quote:
A hell of a lot of people on both sides of the aisle are suddenly tonight seriously suggesting the RNC replace Trump.

Folks...

They can't.

They can't. It's not possible.

I mean, they CAN.

But it would be a nightmare. The RNC rules allow for it -- and you can bet that rule is the single most popular search phrase on the RNC website right now. But it's never been done before. The RNC is a massive nationwide political organization composed of national and state divisions. There some pretty strict legalities here and for damned good reasons. It would be hellishly complicated. There are massive amounts of money involved, 50 state organizations, federal election law, state laws. The RNC would basically have to hold a convention and vote to withdraw Trump's nomination, I don't know that they could even organize something like that -- given all the lawyers involved -- in the time remaining, let alone pull it off. And you have to remember that this would hardly be uncontested or unanimous.

And if they managed to oust Trump, and there's no guarantee they could, then, well, then the real fun begins.

Mike Pence wouldn't just become the Republican candidate.

If Trump and Pence were elected to office and Trump crapped out, THEN Pence automatically gets moved into the hot seat -- that's the whole reason for a VP in the first place. But before that? As a candidate? The Constitution doesn't apply.

Pence wouldn't automatically replace Trump.

He can't. Legally.

By law, by their own rules, the RNC would have to hold a new convention, whether that was in physical space or virtual, they'd still have to meet their own legal requirements for a convention. Then they'd have to provide a list of declared nominees of which there are none at the moment, so candidates would have to reactivate their suspended campaigns -- Pence doesn't have one, he wasn't running for president, remember? Again this is a complex process. The legalities aren't clear. There are massive amounts of money involved. There would be a thousand legal challenges. People like Ted Cruz aren't going to just stand by while the RNC hands over the nomination to Mike Pence. It would be chaos.

Technically, Pence could be nominated, but there are legal hoops he'd have to jump through first.

Again, could they pull this off in the time remaining? I doubt it.

Then, once they have a list of nominees, the delegates would have to vote for the RNC's new candidate.

Then that Candidate would have to activate, fund, and organize a national campaign. Including nominating a Vice President.

Folks, we're two days out from the second presidential debate.

And even if they could pull all of that off, which they can't, it's too late. The deadlines for changing the ballots in a majority of states have passed. Absentee ballots, especially those from overseas military have already been cast in some cases.

It would be chaos.

It would be a legal nightmare.

It would be the end of the RNC -- I know some of you think that's a great idea, but it might not work out the way you think.

Likely the election would end up in the Supreme Court -- a court deadlocked 4 to 4. Or in the House, which I need not remind you is controlled by Republicans.

Hell, you might actually see Republicans shooting each other ... and the rest of us for that matter.

The RNC is screwed.

No matter how goddamned shitty Trump is, no matter how far into the rough he goes, they are going to have to play it as it lies.


The one difference in the scenarios is that Trump "voluntarily" steps down. But still the article eases my worry a bit. Especially the part where ballots have already been cast. I had a shock tonight when he was going to make a big announcement and I thought, "Omg, what if he withdraws?"
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He won't stabd down he can't stand down - Daddies not around to bail him outt of his current mess so he needs the powers\perks of being president to do so.
 
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Xander Fulton
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maxo-texas wrote:
It does give me solace Xander.


I did link the source!

FWIW, I've been quite engaged by Jim Wright's posts - he's worth following, IMHO. He's...conservative? But in the sort of conservative I was raised in, and very, very far from what the GOP is, now.

He wrote a lot about that, here

Quote:

...
I attained the age of majority during the Carter Administration.  Back then I was defined as a traditional conservative.  Balanced budget. War only when necessary. Mom. Apple pie. Conservatives were doctors, engineers, scientists, the guys with the buzz cuts and white shirts who worked at NASA and got us to the moon and back. They smoked Pall Malls and drank Pabst Blue Ribbon. They worked on the assembly line at Ford and GM and they BBQ’d in their backyards in the suburbs on the weekends. You didn’t have to ask, you knew they were veterans.  If they went to church on Sunday, that was their business – they never talked about it.  They were Boy Scouts and Little Leaguers and members of the Elks Club. Live and let live. They were the folks who said “I don’t agree with what you say, but I’ll die to defend your right to say it” and they meant every word of it.
...
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James King
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maxo-texas wrote:
Seriously... it's too far from the election still. We need Trump to make it a couple more weeks so it's too late to change candidates.

Voting has already started so MAYBE it's too late.

But a huge number of anti-trump voters would vote for a dog as candidate if the mercers give trump the ax and suggest the RNC nominate the dog.

The "relief" bounce from trump going away and say, "Paul Ryan" would be large. And if trump "voluntarily" withdrew from the race and endorced the proposed candidate (which he would do for money I'm sure), the RNC might retain many of his current voters.

My, how naive of you or anybody else to speculate that Mike Pence would no longer be viably in the picture if Trump even voluntarily withdrew from the race. After all, who do you think recommended Pence to Trump in the first place?



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Boaty McBoatface
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ShreveportLAGamer wrote:



maxo-texas wrote:
Seriously... it's too far from the election still. We need Trump to make it a couple more weeks so it's too late to change candidates.

Voting has already started so MAYBE it's too late.

But a huge number of anti-trump voters would vote for a dog as candidate if the mercers give trump the ax and suggest the RNC nominate the dog.

The "relief" bounce from trump going away and say, "Paul Ryan" would be large. And if trump "voluntarily" withdrew from the race and endorced the proposed candidate (which he would do for money I'm sure), the RNC might retain many of his current voters.

My, how naive of you or anybody else to speculate that Mike Pence would no longer be viably in the picture if Trump even voluntarily withdrew from the race. After all, who do you think recommended Pence to Trump in the first place?



Right, if they drooped Trump Pence would be their candidate.

They have managed to pull a Palin again.
 
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Wendell
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It's already too late to legally remove Trump's name from state ballots and replace with another name.

Some con law dude spun a scenario where Trump if elected would promise to invoke Article 25 of the constitution on January 20 declaring himself incapacitated and making Pence acting president. Legally could be done, though nobody could force Trump to abide by the promise. Politically, probably a difficult sell.
 
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Junior McSpiffy
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So this whole seizure you've been having the last couple of months about how Trump MUST be stopped.... it really isn't about Trump? It's about Republicans? I actually bought it when you said your constant railing was about Trump, about how he was unpresidential, would damage the nation beyond repair, etc etc etc. All the reasons I can't vote for him myself.

But now it's just the generic "Rrrrrr.... GOP baaaaaaaad" rant. Drops you in the same category as jmilum, huggy, and Shreve. Admiration... lowered.
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Richard Keiser

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GameCrossing wrote:
So this whole seizure you've been having the last couple of months about how Trump MUST be stopped.... it really isn't about Trump? It's about Republicans? I actually bought it when you said your constant railing was about Trump, about how he was unpresidential, would damage the nation beyond repair, etc etc etc. All the reasons I can't vote for him myself.

But now it's just the generic "Rrrrrr.... GOP baaaaaaaad" rant. Drops you in the same category as jmilum, huggy, and Shreve. Admiration... lowered.


Last time I checked, OrangePussPussGrabber was the Republican nominee.

He didn't get there by putsch, but by process. The shit on the legs, can easily be traced back to the asshole from whence it came.

Must hurt to realize that your dimwit can't even capitalize on this gaffe and gobble up some votes, because.... oh, he is an unprepared idiot.

What Is Allepo?


"Being fat, high, and stupid is no way to go through life, son."

- Dean Wormer

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R. Frazier
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GameCrossing wrote:
So this whole seizure you've been having the last couple of months about how Trump MUST be stopped.... it really isn't about Trump? It's about Republicans? I actually bought it when you said your constant railing was about Trump, about how he was unpresidential, would damage the nation beyond repair, etc etc etc. All the reasons I can't vote for him myself.

But now it's just the generic "Rrrrrr.... GOP baaaaaaaad" rant. Drops you in the same category as jmilum, huggy, and Shreve. Admiration... lowered.


Setting aside the personal part of this rant I do agree.

Trump needs to be stopped, period. I disagree with republicans on the issues and I'd prefer Hillary to any republican who ran for president this year, but much more important to me than Hillary winning is Trump losing. There's no way Paul Ryan is an existential threat to democracy. Donald Trump is. There is no question in my mind that stopping Trump is the #1 priority in this election and everything else, like electing Hillary, winning the house and senate, etc., etc. is a distant #2.
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Mac Mcleod
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GameCrossing wrote:
So this whole seizure you've been having the last couple of months about how Trump MUST be stopped.... it really isn't about Trump? It's about Republicans? I actually bought it when you said your constant railing was about Trump, about how he was unpresidential, would damage the nation beyond repair, etc etc etc. All the reasons I can't vote for him myself.

But now it's just the generic "Rrrrrr.... GOP baaaaaaaad" rant. Drops you in the same category as jmilum, huggy, and Shreve. Admiration... lowered.


Gamecrossing, what an ugly thing to say... does this mean we're not friends anymore? You know, Gamecrossing, if I thought you weren't my friend, I just don't think I could bear it.

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Junior McSpiffy
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darthhugo wrote:
GameCrossing wrote:
So this whole seizure you've been having the last couple of months about how Trump MUST be stopped.... it really isn't about Trump? It's about Republicans? I actually bought it when you said your constant railing was about Trump, about how he was unpresidential, would damage the nation beyond repair, etc etc etc. All the reasons I can't vote for him myself.

But now it's just the generic "Rrrrrr.... GOP baaaaaaaad" rant. Drops you in the same category as jmilum, huggy, and Shreve. Admiration... lowered.


Last time I checked, OrangePussPussGrabber was the Republican nominee.

He didn't get there by putsch, but by process. The shit on the legs, can easily be traced back to the asshole from whence it came.

Must hurt to realize that your dimwit can't even capitalize on this gaffe and gobble up some votes, because.... oh, he is an unprepared idiot.

What Is Allepo?


"Being fat, high, and stupid is no way to go through life, son."

- Dean Wormer



As a fellow "If it has a D, it's for me" minion, let's review what was being said, shall we? The argument, which rylfrazier picked up below, is that Trump must be stopped because he is a threat to democracy. In in thrice-daily threads, that was mac's point. Trump must be stopped.

But now it has suddenly shifted to "Any and all in the GOP must be stopped." And if it had just stopped there, it would have just been a little saddening. But the more I read it, the worse it seems.

Anyone with a particular political view must be stopped from having a voice in the process. It's not that Trump must be stopped, it's that a replacement candidate who is not Trump (the threat to democracy) would be joined by others to support someone who is not such a threat to democracy... but that would be joining with Trump supporters. So no. Never. It borders on thought crimes.

rylfrazier can see it because, while he has a specific political view he would love to see reflected in society, he can appreciate arguments and appreciates integrity. You have none of that. You are just waving pom-poms.
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Mac Mcleod
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GameCrossing wrote:
So this whole seizure you've been having the last couple of months about how Trump MUST be stopped.... it really isn't about Trump? It's about Republicans? I actually bought it when you said your constant railing was about Trump, about how he was unpresidential, would damage the nation beyond repair, etc etc etc. All the reasons I can't vote for him myself.

But now it's just the generic "Rrrrrr.... GOP baaaaaaaad" rant. Drops you in the same category as jmilum, huggy, and Shreve. Admiration... lowered.


Best doc holiday ever. Sigh.

No, you are conflating two different things.

1) I'm opposed to Trump. He's incompetent, willfully ignorant, dishonorable, an incredibly liar, thin skinned, and too enamored with dictators for my tastes.

But as I've said MANY MANY times.

2) I'm for Hillary.

3) I stopped voting republican when the party started lying so much and disappeared over the hills into religious extremism. I voted for Reagan and Bush Senior. I voted for some republican candidates as late as 2008. Once they became the party of religious oppression, the party of "NO" and broke with the traditions of government that made our republican work, I could no longer vote for them for dog catcher.

4) As others have said, Ryan wouldn't destroy our form of government but it would literally kill me years earlier after financially bankrupting me by denying me access to health care insurance long before retirement age while also oppressing women, working to disenfranchise minority voters and many other actions I consider repugnant.

Republicans have been a stain on this country for the last 12 years. It's time to destroy the party and remake it into a fiscally conservative, socially liberal party. And leave all the loonies on the curb with ineffectual 3rd parties.
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Josh
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maxo-texas wrote:
GameCrossing wrote:
So this whole seizure you've been having the last couple of months about how Trump MUST be stopped.... it really isn't about Trump? It's about Republicans? I actually bought it when you said your constant railing was about Trump, about how he was unpresidential, would damage the nation beyond repair, etc etc etc. All the reasons I can't vote for him myself.

But now it's just the generic "Rrrrrr.... GOP baaaaaaaad" rant. Drops you in the same category as jmilum, huggy, and Shreve. Admiration... lowered.


Gamecrossing, what an ugly thing to say... does this mean we're not friends anymore? You know, Gamecrossing, if I thought you weren't my friend, I just don't think I could bear it.



Maybe politics just isn't your game.
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Mac Mcleod
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Shadrach wrote:
maxo-texas wrote:
GameCrossing wrote:
So this whole seizure you've been having the last couple of months about how Trump MUST be stopped.... it really isn't about Trump? It's about Republicans? I actually bought it when you said your constant railing was about Trump, about how he was unpresidential, would damage the nation beyond repair, etc etc etc. All the reasons I can't vote for him myself.

But now it's just the generic "Rrrrrr.... GOP baaaaaaaad" rant. Drops you in the same category as jmilum, huggy, and Shreve. Admiration... lowered.


Gamecrossing, what an ugly thing to say... does this mean we're not friends anymore? You know, Gamecrossing, if I thought you weren't my friend, I just don't think I could bear it.



Maybe politics just isn't your game.



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R. Frazier
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I'm not taking sides if you guys are seriously fighting, but I LOVE Tombstone quotes.
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Junior McSpiffy
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First and foremost, stop using my love of Tombstone against me. I hate thumbing stuff directed at me. But... Tombstone. I am powerless before it. So please knock it off.

Secondly, I know about your views on the GOP. You've shared it many times, including your having voted for Republicans in the past for president and elsewhere. But when questioned about why you are dropping three threads a day on us, it was all about "Trump must be stopped!" Now we get "I am afraid of Trump being stopped prematurely." Now stopping Trump isn't the biggest thing. And when combined with...

Quote:
The "relief" bounce from trump going away and say, "Paul Ryan" would be large. And if trump "voluntarily" withdrew from the race and endorced the proposed candidate (which he would do for money I'm sure), the RNC might retain many of his current voters.


... it looks like thought policing. It looks like denying people a voice based on what they think. "Any group that Trump supporters may glom onto do not deserve to be heard."

Or maybe it's just sleep deprivation on my part, trying to post after being woken up a daughter who needed to inform me that she woke up dry after I had a long night of shuttling drunks.
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Richard Keiser

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GameCrossing wrote:
darthhugo wrote:
GameCrossing wrote:
So this whole seizure you've been having the last couple of months about how Trump MUST be stopped.... it really isn't about Trump? It's about Republicans? I actually bought it when you said your constant railing was about Trump, about how he was unpresidential, would damage the nation beyond repair, etc etc etc. All the reasons I can't vote for him myself.

But now it's just the generic "Rrrrrr.... GOP baaaaaaaad" rant. Drops you in the same category as jmilum, huggy, and Shreve. Admiration... lowered.


Last time I checked, OrangePussPussGrabber was the Republican nominee.

He didn't get there by putsch, but by process. The shit on the legs, can easily be traced back to the asshole from whence it came.

Must hurt to realize that your dimwit can't even capitalize on this gaffe and gobble up some votes, because.... oh, he is an unprepared idiot.

What Is Allepo?


"Being fat, high, and stupid is no way to go through life, son."

- Dean Wormer



As a fellow "If it has a D, it's for me" minion, let's review what was being said, shall we? The argument, which rylfrazier picked up below, is that Trump must be stopped because he is a threat to democracy. In in thrice-daily threads, that was mac's point. Trump must be stopped.

But now it has suddenly shifted to "Any and all in the GOP must be stopped." And if it had just stopped there, it would have just been a little saddening. But the more I read it, the worse it seems.

Anyone with a particular political view must be stopped from having a voice in the process. It's not that Trump must be stopped, it's that a replacement candidate who is not Trump (the threat to democracy) would be joined by others to support someone who is not such a threat to democracy... but that would be joining with Trump supporters. So no. Never. It borders on thought crimes.

rylfrazier can see it because, while he has a specific political view he would love to see reflected in society, he can appreciate arguments and appreciates integrity. You have none of that. You are just waving pom-poms.


It is that I don't believe you, but are you sure that is the prevailing thought that is so separate from a typical election year goal? I guess I'm not sure what you are pointing out.... is it the fact that Democrats wouldn't want Pence also? He isn't Trump crazy or a threat, but his positions are definitely not anywhere close to either McCain or Romney... much further extreme. If the electorate rejected their mostly moderate, conservative views, why would they choose Pence... as a less painful poison to the OrangeMan.

If there is any "Republican" thrashing, it is because they have not only allowed (passive), but they have actively nominated this abomination for a candidate.

Any group that produces a horrible product should be held responsible. The Republican party has so veered away from anything sensible, rational, and tasteful since 2008 that they deserve to be torn asunder from both the inside and out. As a slightly conservative Democrat, I will hatchet away at any body politic that allows the worst of our society to steer the ship. I won't gas 'em, but I will do everything in my power to insure that their views and influence don't tarnish what is a pretty decent Democracy.

So, please point me to the next part of the creature that needs to be attacked. Hopefully, after it bleeds to death, something more reasonable, amicable, and moderate will rise up. If the virulent strain gets stronger, then a bigger blade will be in order.

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Richard Keiser

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GameCrossing wrote:
First and foremost, stop using my love of Tombstone against me. I hate thumbing stuff directed at me. But... Tombstone. I am powerless before it. So please knock it off.

Secondly, I know about your views on the GOP. You've shared it many times, including your having voted for Republicans in the past for president and elsewhere. But when questioned about why you are dropping three threads a day on us, it was all about "Trump must be stopped!" Now we get "I am afraid of Trump being stopped prematurely." Now stopping Trump isn't the biggest thing. And when combined with...

Quote:
The "relief" bounce from trump going away and say, "Paul Ryan" would be large. And if trump "voluntarily" withdrew from the race and endorced the proposed candidate (which he would do for money I'm sure), the RNC might retain many of his current voters.


... it looks like thought policing. It looks like denying people a voice based on what they think. "Any group that Trump supporters may glom onto do not deserve to be heard."

Or maybe it's just sleep deprivation on my part, trying to post after being woken up a daughter who needed to inform me that she woke up dry after I had a long night of shuttling drunks.


I'm all for the sentiment that everyone deserves to be heard. It is just in my five decades of life, I have learned that not everyone deserves the right to continue to be heard (by me).


 
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Robert Wesley
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Re: It's time to support Trump OUT
"TRUMP"

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R. Frazier
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GROGnads wrote:
"TRUMP"

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It appears my hypocrisy knows no bounds - I will even thumb Grognads if he quotes Tombstone.
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Mac Mcleod
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GameCrossing wrote:
First and foremost, stop using my love of Tombstone against me. I hate thumbing stuff directed at me. But... Tombstone. I am powerless before it. So please knock it off.

Secondly, I know about your views on the GOP. You've shared it many times, including your having voted for Republicans in the past for president and elsewhere. But when questioned about why you are dropping three threads a day on us, it was all about "Trump must be stopped!" Now we get "I am afraid of Trump being stopped prematurely." Now stopping Trump isn't the biggest thing. And when combined with...

Quote:
The "relief" bounce from trump going away and say, "Paul Ryan" would be large. And if trump "voluntarily" withdrew from the race and endorced the proposed candidate (which he would do for money I'm sure), the RNC might retain many of his current voters.


... it looks like thought policing. It looks like denying people a voice based on what they think. "Any group that Trump supporters may glom onto do not deserve to be heard."

Or maybe it's just sleep deprivation on my part, trying to post after being woken up a daughter who needed to inform me that she woke up dry after I had a long night of shuttling drunks.


I can't see the thought policing angle you are going for.

It's an opinion on winning the election for Clinton- who I support. When i started posting a many months ago we were getting regular anti-hillary posts by people who were definately not supporting trump.

I decided I could have more influence on this electing by posting here, on you tube, yahoo forums, and on slashdot than my actual vote here in texas-- (93% chance for Trump to win).

In the process of researching the allegations against Clinton- the most telling was her foundation. The allegations were not just misleading- they were false statements or lies by omission.

That solidified my support for her which started back when she ran so damn hard in 2008 and then so gracefully lined up with the party to get Obama elected (a damn site better than Bill IMHO). I had a negative opinion of Clinton in 2007 and still considered her unelectable as late as last year. But almost all of the republican candidates were very hard right wing conservatives.

I made a conscious decision to back Clinton at that point tho I would have been equally happy with Bernie- it took a while to get to know him. However- what I saw I liked better than Clinton. While a politician he had a very straight forward way of dealing with questions. He admitted and recognized reality instead of evading it. But he lost.
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Mac Mcleod
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So what can I say... she's my huckleberry.

(broken into a separate post intentionally)
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