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Subject: Imbalanced Scales too Powerful? rss

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Brad103
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Skaneateles
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Imbalanced Scales: When you turn in any number of Gold Bag dice, gain 1 extra gold token.

This item, repeatedly, has won games for people. The combo you can achieve from this is quite powerful. So long as you have a gold bag (or a die you can turn into a gold bag) you can almost always break even, or sometimes gain gold tokens on your turn, and still be able to buy a card.

For Example:
Say it's a 4 player game, and after dice are distributed I have in front of me: 1 Gold Bag, 1 Gem. Only two dice, chances are no one will steal these from me. Now, all but 2 cards cost 3 dice or less. So as long as I have 2 gold coins, I can buy anything I want, and break even on gold. If I have more than two dice (very likely in 3-4 player games), or if a card is less than 3 gems to buy (27 cards) then it's possible to gain gold token every round. If I spent 1 gold token and 1 die, I can turn a gold bag into 2 gold tokens, resulting in a net gain of +1 gold token.

It's a hard combo to stop, as you'd have to deny them gold bags (or cards turning gems into gold, though all but one of these would be bought before the Imbalanced Scales). If you deny them gold bags, you'd potentially be sacrificing your own strategies.

People have discussed the power of Wicked Clutches (which I've never seen to be true), but what about this card, is it too powerful? Would it be worth taking out of the deck to make things more balanced less Imbalanced)?
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Will Martin
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So my point to this is that having surplus gold in the end provides you with a bunch of purchasing power, yes, but only 3 points.

It also puts you a turn behind unless you have gold when you buy it, since you have to get the scales, get the bags, then get the gold tokens for the next turn. It also completely falls apart if no gold tokens are rolled, since your strategy of building gold requires you to break even, and if no gold bags are rolled, you won't be.

There's also the fact that stopping a player from starting an engine by denying him gold bags isn't a 'stop' to your own strategy because, as you put it, gold is useful to everyone.

So I don't see it as too overpowered. It's situationaly powerful, but so are a ton of other cards in the game.
 
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Brad103
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Skaneateles
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The gold bonus is nice, but often you'll be spending that on the last round to get a higher point card.

I think anyone who would be using this strategy would ensure they have a spare gold to get it going, before they bought the card. That's how I've always done it.

I guess denying gold bags isnt a big deal since they're usable. But if the player can turn a (useless to you) gem into a gold bag, then it becomes more of an issue. In my last game I was turning diamonds into gold, and for many rounds diamonds we useless to buy with, so I had easy claim to them (amidst much grumbling from others).

I guess every game would have situational powerful cards, but from what I've seen, this one is the biggest one. Wicked Sachel seems pretty weak imho, at most I get 4-5 tokens, but its easy to buy a card for that many points anyways (though it is a fun card). I guess going with a token/Political Campaign strategy could be more powerful, but that strategy would require several other cards to take off.
 
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Will Martin
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If your play group honestly sees it as a problem, remove it from the deck. There's no rules preventing you from making sure that things that are not enjoyable are removed.

I'm not trying to downplay your idea that it might be a bit borked, I just don't have that experience. But if it's a consistent experience with you guys, I totally think that it needs to be fixed lest people learn to hate the game.
 
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Brad103
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Skaneateles
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It's all good, was just seeing if anyone else noticed this. Apparently the Sachel is more popular than the Scales (makes sense though, they're cute little teethy things).

I imagine, with all the cards you remove from deck B, that someday it wont be in a game. We'll see how well I do then (im relying to much on this card lol).

And you're right, if it becomes an issue with my group it's simple to remove.

Thanks for the comments!
 
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