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Subject: Towing rss

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brad poon
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First of all, thanks to Riot Games for designing this board game and actively supporting this community throughout the release schedule.

I fortunately snagged a copy and am reading the first dossier mission as I prepare to learn the game before it arrives.

I have a question about the towing rule, which there seems to have been some ambiguity as other users have remarked.

I guess this can be classified as a spoiler? i guess? but not really since its in the rulebook? Anyways to be safe I'll put a spoiler tag on it.

Spoiler (click to reveal)
Is towing mandatory or optional?
The rulebook states “Like being pushed, you cannot opt out of being towed!”
Let's say, for example, a player wants to move two spaces, but someone is next to them. Do they tow the player instead, or do they have the option to move two spaces?
The rulebook seems to imply that the first player has the choice to tow or not, and the person being towed has no say in the matter. But it seems weird that they put this caveat in the rules since its a coop game and everyone is supposed to be working together in the first place. Unless, of course, there's some competitive mode introduced in future missions that we're not aware of
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Bryan Gustin
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If you listen to the RDTN podcast they talk about towing there. Basically you can tow one space and then drop the item and then move one more space. At least that is how I heard it.

Bryan
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brad poon
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I haven't listened to the podcast but I don't think what you said is true.
In the pictured example, it specifically says that "Mechs both move only 1 space."
 
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Chris Cantrell
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I don't think this is a spoiler and would prefer as many people as possible got their eyes on this response.

Each player is in control of their own 'execute' phase. So on your turn, if you wanted to push or tow me into lava, you can (I would still stop and take damage immediately upon entry of lava, so that damage might push you back).

You are not required to push or pull anyone on your turn, but if you are push or pulled on someone else's turn, you can ask them not to, but they have the final say. There's no traitor mechanic and it's fully co-op, so I don't think it's ever been a problem in playtests. Usually if you've gotten through the first few missions, everyone realizes that the game is hard enough that you really need to work together.
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James Palmer
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Riot Kades wrote:

You are not required to push or pull anyone on your turn


Thanks for the clarification. I'm unsure about not required to push though. If I have a movement card that forces me to move into a friendly mech, am I not required to push it?

And another quick follow up question. If I have a mech or some other towable object in front of me, can I tow it? Or can I only tow objects that are beside or behind me? So say I have a mech in front of me, and I move forward, can I plop that mech behind me and tow it instead of push it? From reading the reference book, this sounds possible.
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brad poon
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Thanks for the clarification, Chris!
So, as I understand it, if you are next to a player and execute a 2 move command, you can either move forward 2 spaces OR move 1 space and tow the player behind you.
 
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Jorgen Peddersen
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Felkor wrote:
And another quick follow up question. If I have a mech or some other towable object in front of me, can I tow it? Or can I only tow objects that are beside or behind me? So say I have a mech in front of me, and I move forward, can I plop that mech behind me and tow it instead of push it? From reading the reference book, this sounds possible.

That's an interesting one. If you were moving sideways, it's clear you could two the mech that was in front (it moves into the spaces you leave, not behind you, technically).

I think, rules as written and using the FAQ about towing with oil slicks, that in the case you are moving forward 2 spaces, the following would happen...

1: You move 1 space forward, pushing the mech in front of you (only if you can)
2: You spend the second movement point to move the mech that was in front to now be behind you.

It seems like this might not match intention, though. Perhaps the towing rules aren't meant to work when you already pushed the same figure. If that were the case, you would be forced to push the mech in front of you 2 spaces forward.

Edit:

Actually, I feel that we need an official ruling on towing something you would otherwise push. My example above leads to really silly things, especially if in step 1, the other mech glided across an oil slick, to suddenly be whipped behind the moving mech afterwards...
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Jeff M
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Riot Kades wrote:
..

You are not required to push or pull anyone on your turn, but if you are push or pulled on someone else's turn, you can ask them not to, but they have the final say. There's no traitor mechanic and it's fully co-op, so I don't think it's ever been a problem in playtests. Usually if you've gotten through the first few missions, everyone realizes that the game is hard enough that you really need to work together.


So, basically..


1) If you are the active player, you MAY push/pull another player, but you don't have to.

2) The player whose turn it is gets the final say on whether or not they push/pull another player.
 
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Jorgen Peddersen
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I really think push should be removed from that. I don't think that's what Chris meant, as pushing is definitely compulsory if your movement is compulsory...
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brad poon
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I think when Chris was saying that you are not required to push or pull anyone on your turn, he was referring to the spirit of the cooperative nature of the game and emphasizing the point that there are no traitor or competitive mechanics in the game.

That being said, during the execution phase, if your programmed movement would put you into a spot that is occupied by another object, you HAVE to push it. I think the rules are pretty clear on this: "Executing a Move Command that would put the Mech into a space containing another Mech or the Bomb pushes that object forward in the same direction, which
could push another Mech or the Bomb. (p10)
. This is mutually exclusive from towing.

My question was specifically in the case of towing. That is, during the execution phase, if your programmed movement would allow you the opportunity to tow an object, must you tow the object?

I believe the implied answer is no, you don't have to tow if you don't want to.

edit. my English sucks.
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Jorgen Peddersen
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poondog wrote:
I believe the implied answer is no, you don't have to tow if you don't want to.

That part's not just implied. Chris' answer makes that very clear that you don't have to do so.

It's just unfortunate that the addition of 'push' to the answer makes it easily misunderstood in a way that contradicts the rules.
 
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Hans Moleman
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Clipper wrote:
poondog wrote:
I believe the implied answer is no, you don't have to tow if you don't want to.

That part's not just implied. Chris' answer makes that very clear that you don't have to do so.

It's just unfortunate that the addition of 'push' to the answer makes it easily misunderstood in a way that contradicts the rules.


When I first read it, it sounded like towing was mandatory, but thinking about it, that would make no sense... Especially if adjacent to multiple towable things. After rereading, seemed clear enough... Active player choice on the tow. Push or tow is forced (if able based on position), meaning the receiving player can't deny it.
 
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Jorgen Peddersen
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Right. The only thing we need to figure out now is if it's possible to tow a mech that is in front of you. If so, do you first push the mech, or do you instead pick it up before you move and then place it afterwards?
 
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Mike Malley
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"Wouldn't you need to go backwards to tow something in front of you?" asks the guy who doesn't even know if you can go backwards in this game.
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Jorgen Peddersen
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caffeinehead wrote:
"Wouldn't you need to go backwards to tow something in front of you?" asks the guy who doesn't even know if you can go backwards in this game.

There are no cards (except perhaps Damage) that can move your Mech backwards, apparently, but there is one that can move them sideways:

Rules wrote:
All Moves except for Omnistomp will only move the Mech forward. Omnistomp can move the Mech forward or to either side, but not backward.


So you can tow something that is in front of you orientation-wise when strafing left or right with Omnistomp.

But yes, I agree that towing something that you are moving towards and would push if you didn't tow it is somewhat absurd. It probably should be disallowed entirely, but the rules as written make such figures valid targets, as the only qualification given is that the target must be adjacent to the moving mech.

 
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Nick LAROSA
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Another question on towing. If I have a speed card upgraded to 4 spaces can I choose to tow another mech or the bomb 2 spaces instead. Or am I limited to 1 space then move the obligatory additional 2 spaces?
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Jorgen Peddersen
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usbpt2004 wrote:
Another question on towing. If I have a speed card upgraded to 4 spaces can I choose to tow another mech or the bomb 2 spaces instead. Or am I limited to 1 space then move the obligatory additional 2 spaces?

I see no reason why not. Nothing says you may only tow once during your turn. So towing 1 space twice in a row seems fine. You could even tow one thing once, then tow something else you now happen to be next to the second time.

I believe you can also do stuff like move 2 spaces, then tow something you are now next to 1 space for a total of 4 spaces of movement.
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Frederick Ernst
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You cannot tow a mech (or bomb) that is directly in front of your mech. In order to tow, the object to be towed must be next to or behind the towing mech.

If you would move into the space of another mech or the bomb, you MUST push it, unless that would move it off the board or into an immovable obstacle like a wall. In that case no one moves and you just grind your gears as if you were walking into a wall.

I hope that clears it up a bit!
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Jorgen Peddersen
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It does clear it up a lot.
 
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Jon van Oorschot
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usbpt2004 wrote:
Another question on towing. If I have a speed card upgraded to 4 spaces can I choose to tow another mech or the bomb 2 spaces instead. Or am I limited to 1 space then move the obligatory additional 2 spaces?


Good queston, as I wonder the same?
 
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Jon van Oorschot
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Jonezy wrote:
usbpt2004 wrote:
Another question on towing. If I have a speed card upgraded to 4 spaces can I choose to tow another mech or the bomb 2 spaces instead. Or am I limited to 1 space then move the obligatory additional 2 spaces?


Good queston, as I wonder the same?


And it got answered in another thread:

Riot Kades wrote:
YggrdasilEx wrote:
When i want to tow lets say the bomb for example and I have the Speed command with level 2, how many spaces can I tow the bomb?
We played it, so that We can tow the bomb 1-3 spaces. Was that correct?


No, towing moves the bomb (or mech) one space for every two points of movement. Since level 2 speed provides 2-4 movement, you can choose '4' and tow two spaces.
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TJ Marsh
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I want to tow an object. I understand that a move command worth two spaces results in a single move, while successfully towing the object into my last occupied space.

If my next command is a move command worth only one space, do I have the option of still holding onto the object, and just failing to move forward? Or am I required to let go and move forward one space, leaving the object behind?
 
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Jonas Vanschooren
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You must do the last move, and simply can't take the object with you.
No choice then to leave the object behind and do the 1 move.

The opposite is true aswell, you can use 1 move to move next to an object and then 2 move to tow it (al from the same lvl 3 move stack), works extremely well with omnistomp.
 
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Derek P
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So when you're towing with Movement 3 would you tow the bomb one space then your Mech moves one space leaving it behind
 
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Derek P
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When you're towing does the bomb stay beside you
 
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