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Subject: Beyond the treshold box content rss

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Roberto de Gooijer
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It seems we'll be getting tiles and quite some more stuff in the expansion!
Excited!!
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Joshua Delahunty
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RobbieGemini wrote:
It seems we'll be getting tiles and quite some more stuff in the expansion!
Excited!!:)


The tiles we knew about. What people weren't so sure about was how many Thrall figures would be included. Alas, it looks like only the one.
 
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J P
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dulcaoin wrote:
RobbieGemini wrote:
It seems we'll be getting tiles and quite some more stuff in the expansion!
Excited!!


The tiles we knew about. What people weren't so sure about was how many Thrall figures would be included. Alas, it looks like only the one.


Not necessarily. I doubt we're getting only one of each card and token, yet that's all they show. Pretty sure we're getting more than 3 tiles, too.
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Clinton Rice
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DancingFool wrote:
dulcaoin wrote:
RobbieGemini wrote:
It seems we'll be getting tiles and quite some more stuff in the expansion!
Excited!!


The tiles we knew about. What people weren't so sure about was how many Thrall figures would be included. Alas, it looks like only the one.


Not necessarily. I doubt we're getting only one of each card and token, yet that's all they show. Pretty sure we're getting more than 3 tiles, too.


Indeed. I have seen a lot of previews on FFG and the photos almost never show all of the included miniatures, especially where multiples are concerned. Odds that there are more than one thrall are high since it sounds like a weaker monster. Bit nastier than a cultist perhaps but not a "boss". The mere name suggests a servant of a greater enemy. Why should it only have one servant? I would expact three, maybe four.
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Jon Aitken
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New figures for the heroes, different from the Arkham horror Premium range.

https://www.fantasyflightgames.com/en/products/arkham-horror...

https://www.fantasyflightgames.com/en/products/arkham-horror...
 
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David PIERRE
France
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RobbieGemini wrote:
It seems we'll be getting tiles and quite some more stuff in the expansion!
Excited!!


$40 for 3 figures and 3 tiles, this is crazy, even the extensions "Mansions of Madness - Suppressed Memories and Recurring Nightmares are at $ 49.95 have more tiles and figurines Soon they will sell a figurine and a. tile $ 50 for the script that goes with it will cost $ 10 more.
Instead of FFG is those I would ... total madness
FFG are too strong
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Gavin Meakings
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It doesn't have three figures and three miniatures. We know from the leak that it has at least 6 doubled sided tiles. The preview pictures never show the entire box contents but a small sample, just look at the previews for the base game or first two expansions.
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Three Headed Monkey
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Bikk wrote:
RobbieGemini wrote:
It seems we'll be getting tiles and quite some more stuff in the expansion!
Excited!!


$40 for 3 figures and 3 tiles, this is crazy, even the extensions "Mansions of Madness - Suppressed Memories and Recurring Nightmares are at $ 49.95 have more tiles and figurines Soon they will sell a figurine and a. tile $ 50 for the script that goes with it will cost $ 10 more.
Instead of FFG is those I would ... total madness
FFG are too strong

We don't know the full contents. There could be more than three tiles. Going by the data that has been extracted from the app regarding the scenarios it looks like there are twelve new rooms, which means six tiles.

Plus, as discussed above, There could be more than one Thrall miniature in the box. No other monster has just one figure. Don't come to a conclusion on price too quickly. Wait for a proper preview from FFG or a list of contents.
 
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Clinton Rice
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Bikk wrote:

$40 for 3 figures and 3 tiles, this is crazy, even the extensions "Mansions of Madness - Suppressed Memories and Recurring Nightmares are at $ 49.95 have more tiles and figurines Soon they will sell a figurine and a. tile $ 50 for the script that goes with it will cost $ 10 more.
Instead of FFG is those I would ... total madness
FFG are too strong


Too many people seem to be basing the value of this expansion on the amount of plastic included. I think this is wrong. These are my thoughts on the matter.

1. The first two expansions are reprints. There are no new miniature sculpts, no new artwork. All the assets are reused except for the one new scenario in each set. Despite the amount of plastic and cardboard included, the profit potential here was high since they probably justified the cost of all the assets the first time they sold them years ago.

2. Beyond the Threshold has three new miniature sculpts. That costs money. New artwork for room tiles. That costs money. Two new scenarios. That costs money. From FFG's perspective, there is a lot more new content in this for less money than either of the previous expansions.

3. When FFG charges $3 for a downloadable scenario, nearly all that money goes to them. But in a physical product, they get far less of the MSRP. Lets say for the sake of argument that after retail and distribution get their cut, FFG makes $15 for every $40 unit sold. I dont know if that is correct, but it seems about right. The value of the scenarios needs to be subtracted from the $15, not the $40 for them to make as much as they do on the DLC. That leaves them making $9 off the sale of the physical components. Still think they are price gouging?

4) As I said above, making new sculpts is expensive. But the plastic used to produce unpainted miniatures is cheap. We are talking pennies worth of plastic. Once the mould is made, there is no need for FFG to short us on thralls. Including one or four costs them pretty much the same. The difference is in pennies.

5. But for those of you who equate the value with the plastic, lets imagine for a moment that FFG included more than enough thralls. Lets imagine each copy of BtT came with a hundred thrall miniatures. Thats more plastic than any other release for MoM2E. Does having so much make this feel like a better value? If you said yes, I am disappounted. Likely though, you realize that shoving in more plastic does not make this a better buy.

I am going to make a prediction. When Beyond the Threshold releases, no one is going to be much concerned with the amount of miniatures and tiles in it. The value of this expansion is going to be tied not to the amount of cardboard and plastic but to the quality of the scenarios.

If they deliver two of the best written, most replayable scenarios the game has to offer, AND new cards, minis and tiles, the true fans will feel like this was a bargain.
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Jens Hedfors
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I wounder what the purple key token (next to the clue token in the lower left corner) is used for.
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Frank La Terra
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Anyone who thinks this is great value for money clearly weren't around in the glory days of FFG when they were releasing the big boxed stuff.
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Roberto de Gooijer
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Cheunce wrote:
I wounder what the purple key token (next to the clue token in the lower left corner) is used for.

Yes, Im very curious about that too. The Mesmerized condition looks pretty interesting too. At the End of your turn you have to Flip it for some effect, the rest of those Small letters i can't Read.
 
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Dean L
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Mr Skeletor wrote:
Anyone who thinks this is great value for money clearly weren't around in the glory days of FFG when they were releasing the big boxed stuff.


Descent 1E had a hell of a lot of plastic. It also had a 31 page errata and FAQ document. There is less material in FFG games now (though much of that is inflation and the massive rise in printing costs) but the quality of the game and the rules are so much higher.
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Roy Cannaday
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I'm just hoping for tons of new cards! More spells and items to find !
There's already Ludacris amounts of tiles and miniatures in the game !
What we need is variety of new things to find an awesome scenarios!
 
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Three Headed Monkey
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Mr Skeletor wrote:
Anyone who thinks this is great value for money clearly weren't around in the glory days of FFG when they were releasing the big boxed stuff.
Oh, I was. And I agree prices were better. I just don't think that this is over priced. If someone thinks it is that is fine, but so far those doing so are under representing what's actually in the box.

Perhaps that key icon is a specific type of clue. Like a clue that can only be used in puzzles or something similar.
 
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Frank La Terra
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Deano2099 wrote:
Mr Skeletor wrote:
Anyone who thinks this is great value for money clearly weren't around in the glory days of FFG when they were releasing the big boxed stuff.


Descent 1E had a hell of a lot of plastic. It also had a 31 page errata and FAQ document. There is less material in FFG games now (though much of that is inflation and the massive rise in printing costs) but the quality of the game and the rules are so much higher.


Considering almost all of their games these days are rehashes of what's come before, I don't think the 'quality of the game' statement is at all true. Those were the days of great value and high creativity.

Your FAQ claim just shows how much the game was payed and consisted of 99% corner cases. I played almost all of the descent stuff and hardly read the thing. MoM is hardly a high watermark for non-faq needed rules. I'd rather te descent FAQ then the junk MoM 2nd ed one.
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Aaron Velox
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I'm probably not in the majority, but based on that picture... $40 seems like a bit much, considering both expansions out now (if found for actual retail price) is about the same, which each includes about 3x as much as this, quantity-wise.
 
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Clinton Rice
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StarryAqua wrote:
I'm probably not in the majority, but based on that picture... $40 seems like a bit much, considering both expansions out now (if found for actual retail price) is about the same, which each includes about 3x as much as this, quantity-wise.


But you are spending $60 more to get the same number of svenarios. Please read my earlier comment about why you shouldnt gauge the value of the expansion by how much plastic they shove in.
 
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Three Headed Monkey
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StarryAqua wrote:
I'm probably not in the majority, but based on that picture... $40 seems like a bit much, considering both expansions out now (if found for actual retail price) is about the same, which each includes about 3x as much as this, quantity-wise.


True. Although the art assets and sculpts were already developed.
 
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Justin Colm
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My perception of 'value' isn't determined by number of miniatures, tiles, or the prolification or dearth of any particular component. It's not even determined by the price. My perception of 'value' is in how much satisfaction I got from the purchase. Components are a part of that; so is the quality of the game (in this instance scenarios), so is the amount of play I ultimately got from it, although neither one of those factors on their own are deal breakers. My first impressions / excitement level when I open the box is also a factor. After all, let's not kid ourselves: we're buying goodies.

I'm sure I can't be the only person to be familiar with that 'FFG feeling' of enthusiastically opening a new game box for the first time to find a half (or less) empty box padded out by that stupid insert they always use. And then there's the point when you start playing the game and found they scrimped on dice, or cards, or this, or that... that feeling that they begrudged you every piece they put in the box.

What I'm getting at here is it's not just a matter of counting the components... 1 Thrall vs 4. 4 tiles vs 6. To me, FFG games never make me feel like I got great value because from when I open the box for the first time, to when I play the game, to when the 1st expansion is announced it's always the feeling of 'just enough'. I never get that feeling I get with other games of thinking 'wow, look at all this stuff' or 'that's really cool; they didn't need to have this many cards but they did'. I never think 'wow. that's awesome. They really went above and beyond'. It's more 'well, I guess it's enough to play the game', 'I'd have liked more scenarios but X is enough I suppose'...

Having 4 Thrall miniatures instead of 1 makes not the slightest difference to me. Having tiles does but not when I can tell at a glance that they're more or less analogous to ones that already exist. A bedroom with a closet attached? Already exists in the 1st edition tiles. Why not use it? There's people who paid $50 MRSP for the damn thing. If the tiles were different: I'm excited. More or less the same: I feel like I'm paying for stuff that could just have easily employed the tiles I already have but they've hardly used. The components play a part in me feeling like I got value yes, but only if I feel they have worth to the game.

More cards: great. They actually will bring far more variety to the game than tiles or miniatures will. The monsters are more or less analogous anyway, barely distinguishable apart from flavour text.

That leaves the scenarios: 2 of them. One is rated at 3 Star difficulty. Judging from my previous experience with the other scenarios rated at this level I expect to play it twice maximum, with the likelihood that the second game will be a replay to see the 'variation' after winning the first game. That's not good. With this game already badly lacking replaybility I wish they'd just try and make all of the scenarios challenging. This is another factor in the 'value' of the game. If I have a fantastic experience with the scenarios I'm not feeling resentful of the price... if I don't then I do. It's subjective.

Thematically both scenarios sound interesting, and also the mechanics. They do seem a cut above the mediocrity of the last two they released. Of course, that's going purely off a piece of hyperbole from the preview article. And the hyperbole for this game has often fallen short of the execution to date IMO (ie. variability / replayability).

Is it worth $40? The most accurate answer is I couldn't say unless I'd paid $40. As usual for FFG, components-wise it does seem as though it might be 'just enough' to justify the price... but they're dredging the absolute bottom of 'just enough' these days by my reckoning. But will the components really bring enough 'new' to the game and were they necessary? Will I use them or are they mostly useless like the Call of the Wild tiles currently are? Is 2 scenarios enough? Meh: it's bare minimum. But FFG don't want to quench my thirst, they want to keep me on the line; I realized that ages ago. It's why I don't follow most of their games anymore.

Will I buy? Too early to say. I want to see what the DLC content is like first. Will I be pleased with those scenarios, with renewed enthusiasm for the game, or will they continue the current trend of leaving me disappointed with the unambitious and homogeneous nature of the scenarios.

I'm very vocal about what I don't like but what the Hell do I actually want? At this stage I like the proposal of another poster here, who's name I forget: small expansions adding new cards and scenarios, released as frequently as possible whilst maintaining quality. I feel like that will be the best 'value' (considering the factors I talk about above) for this game. 'Big boxes' are giving me the impression early on that they will be filled with components barely used and not enough gameplay for the price. DLC is a good option as long as it's reasonably priced (the first one announced is) and the scenarios are good, not hacked. If I pay for a scenario like 'Sentinel Hill' I'm not feeling satisfied, and thus not feeling I got value, regardless of the price. More monsters. tiles, investigators etc for their own sake... in my opinion don't add much in their own right as most of that stuff is very homogeneous in this game anyway. HOW it's used is the important factor.

Possibly controversial statement: Mansions of Madness 2nd Edition is an awesome game with massive potential but I wish it was being published by someone else.
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High Flying Bird wrote:
My perception of 'value' isn't determined by number of miniatures, tiles, or the prolification or dearth of any particular component. It's not even determined by the price. My perception of 'value' is in how much satisfaction I got from the purchase. Components are a part of that; so is the quality of the game (in this instance scenarios), so is the amount of play I ultimately got from it, although neither one of those factors on their own are deal breakers. My first impressions / excitement level when I open the box is also a factor. After all, let's not kid ourselves: we're buying goodies.

I'm sure I can't be the only person to be familiar with that 'FFG feeling' of enthusiastically opening a new game box for the first time to find a half (or less) empty box padded out by that stupid insert they always use. And then there's the point when you start playing the game and found they scrimped on dice, or cards, or this, or that... that feeling that they begrudged you every piece they put in the box.

What I'm getting at here is it's not just a matter of counting the components... 1 Thrall vs 4. 4 tiles vs 6. To me, FFG games never make me feel like I got great value because from when I open the box for the first time, to when I play the game, to when the 1st expansion is announced it's always the feeling of 'just enough'. I never get that feeling I get with other games of thinking 'wow, look at all this stuff' or 'that's really cool; they didn't need to have this many cards but they did'. I never think 'wow. that's awesome. They really went above and beyond'. It's more 'well, I guess it's enough to play the game', 'I'd have liked more scenarios but X is enough I suppose'...

Having 4 Thrall miniatures instead of 1 makes not the slightest difference to me. Having tiles does but not when I can tell at a glance that they're more or less analogous to ones that already exist. A bedroom with a closet attached? Already exists in the 1st edition tiles. Why not use it? There's people who paid $50 MRSP for the damn thing. If the tiles were different: I'm excited. More or less the same: I feel like I'm paying for stuff that could just have easily employed the tiles I already have but they've hardly used. The components play a part in me feeling like I got value yes, but only if I feel they have worth to the game.

More cards: great. They actually will bring far more variety to the game than tiles or miniatures will. The monsters are more or less analogous anyway, barely distinguishable apart from flavour text.

That leaves the scenarios: 2 of them. One is rated at 3 Star difficulty. Judging from my previous experience with the other scenarios rated at this level I expect to play it twice maximum, with the likelihood that the second game will be a replay to see the 'variation' after winning the first game. That's not good. With this game already badly lacking replaybility I wish they'd just try and make all of the scenarios challenging. This is another factor in the 'value' of the game. If I have a fantastic experience with the scenarios I'm not feeling resentful of the price... if I don't then I do. It's subjective.

Thematically both scenarios sound interesting, and also the mechanics. They do seem a cut above the mediocrity of the last two they released. Of course, that's going purely off a piece of hyperbole from the preview article. And the hyperbole for this game has often fallen short of the execution to date IMO (ie. variability / replayability).

Is it worth $40? The most accurate answer is I couldn't say unless I'd paid $40. As usual for FFG, components-wise it does seem as though it might be 'just enough' to justify the price... but they're dredging the absolute bottom of 'just enough' these days by my reckoning. But will the components really bring enough 'new' to the game and were they necessary? Will I use them or are they mostly useless like the Call of the Wild tiles currently are? Is 2 scenarios enough? Meh: it's bare minimum. But FFG don't want to quench my thirst, they want to keep me on the line; I realized that ages ago. It's why I don't follow most of their games anymore.

Will I buy? Too early to say. I want to see what the DLC content is like first. Will I be pleased with those scenarios, with renewed enthusiasm for the game, or will they continue the current trend of leaving me disappointed with the unambitious and homogeneous nature of the scenarios.

I'm very vocal about what I don't like but what the Hell do I actually want? At this stage I like the proposal of another poster here, who's name I forget: small expansions adding new cards and scenarios, released as frequently as possible whilst maintaining quality. I feel like that will be the best 'value' (considering the factors I talk about above) for this game. 'Big boxes' are giving me the impression early on that they will be filled with components barely used and not enough gameplay for the price. DLC is a good option as long as it's reasonably priced (the first one announced is) and the scenarios are good, not hacked. If I pay for a scenario like 'Sentinel Hill' I'm not feeling satisfied, and thus not feeling I got value, regardless of the price. More monsters. tiles, investigators etc for their own sake... in my opinion don't add much in their own right as most of that stuff is very homogeneous in this game anyway. HOW it's used is the important factor.

Possibly controversial statement: Mansions of Madness 2nd Edition is an awesome game with massive potential but I wish it was being published by someone else.


That was a well written post and I can see your point of view clearly. Imo the only FFG game I feel I get true great value going by your own reference would be Eldritch Horror's small box expansions. Although with that game we all know Foresaken Lore was more of a fix for the base games content.

Personally as for MoM2e, Yeah I love the game and I might even call it my favorite game so I feel like it's got good value for me. I don't know how I feel about the expansion however, seeing repeated tile themes in the preview doesn't excite me. And frankly I think I have enough characters and monsters considering I also own 1e and got Supressed Memories to finish up my monster collection (I'll be honest I wanted it mostly for the Dunwich Horror). So right now I'm more excited for the DLC scenarios than the 1st box.
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Dean L
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High Flying Bird wrote:
My perception of 'value' isn't determined by number of miniatures, tiles, or the prolification or dearth of any particular component. It's not even determined by the price. My perception of 'value' is in how much satisfaction I got from the purchase. Components are a part of that; so is the quality of the game (in this instance scenarios), so is the amount of play I ultimately got from it, although neither one of those factors on their own are deal breakers. My first impressions / excitement level when I open the box is also a factor. After all, let's not kid ourselves: we're buying goodies.

I'm sure I can't be the only person to be familiar with that 'FFG feeling' of enthusiastically opening a new game box for the first time to find a half (or less) empty box padded out by that stupid insert they always use. And then there's the point when you start playing the game and found they scrimped on dice, or cards, or this, or that... that feeling that they begrudged you every piece they put in the box.

What I'm getting at here is it's not just a matter of counting the components... 1 Thrall vs 4. 4 tiles vs 6. To me, FFG games never make me feel like I got great value because from when I open the box for the first time, to when I play the game, to when the 1st expansion is announced it's always the feeling of 'just enough'. I never get that feeling I get with other games of thinking 'wow, look at all this stuff' or 'that's really cool; they didn't need to have this many cards but they did'. I never think 'wow. that's awesome. They really went above and beyond'. It's more 'well, I guess it's enough to play the game', 'I'd have liked more scenarios but X is enough I suppose'...


Interesting. What games are you buying that do give you that feeling? Because I totally get it but honestly, outside of Kickstarter, FFG games were pretty much the only games that gave me that feeling of opening the box and being blown away by all the stuff. MoM 2e does less well in that regard although I did get a similar thrill firing up the app for the first time.
 
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Stephen Winterflood
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It would seem that going the path of releasing physical expansions is the most expensive option for the customer when there is already so much in the core and tile packs to use with DLC. Every time they release a new box that is then adding something else to the game that someone might not have when they make DLC investigations, when they could have just focused on exploiting the contents that we got with the core box, that they know everyone will have.
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Nicola Zee
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Winterflood wrote:
It would seem that going the path of releasing physical expansions is the most expensive option for the customer when there is already so much in the core and tile packs to use with DLC. Every time they release a new box that is then adding something else to the game that someone might not have when they make DLC investigations, when they could have just focused on exploiting the contents that we got with the core box, that they know everyone will have.

I agree. FFG should focus on releasing scenarios using the existing room tiles and monsters.

If FFG feel they had to release a new expansion box then at least they should have gone for a new theme. For example, if they released a night in the museum type expansion they could go for the following completely new room tiles: Exhibition Room, Display Hall (with display cabinets), Museum Foyer and so on. They could include a number of new monsters such as Mummies, The Beast and Nephren-Ka.

As it is although I will probably buy the new expansion, I feel it's a little bit of a let down. I just hope the two scenarios that come with it are really good.

[PS Added] On a more positive note, the extra insanity condition cards will be welcome as I have replaced a couple of the existing ones I did not like.
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David Saraiva
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Everyone who fills this way (FFG should focus on scenarios and not expansions) should speak with their dollars. Buy the DLC, heck buy it multiple times for your different devices and don't buy the box expansions.

They are a business and they will (rightly so) continue to do what turns a profit and stop doing what doesn't turn a profit.

As for me, I'll likely be picking this one up.
 
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