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Subject: Table Talk rss

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Davy Ashleydale
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The rules make it very clear that players are not supposed to speak the names of locations and clues out loud. On page 16 it says:

Quote:
Players are not allowed to speak aloud about locations or clues during a game.


But can you say things like, "Don't go there!" when you see another player starting to move to a location?

Most of what other people say has to be taken with a grain of salt because they could be lying, but there are times in the game where two or more people come to know that they can completely trust each other. Like, if two people have seen the Glasses clue and neither of them have glasses. So if two or more people completely trust each other, they can effectively spread information to each other without explicitly stating location names and clue names.

Is that allowed? Or if I see someone that I trust walking into a location that I know is dangerous but they don't, am I just supposed to be quiet about it?

Social deduction / hidden traitor game designers need to realize that players need a lot more information about table talk in their rules. There are always communication loopholes that people come up with like, "Well, it says I can't say them out loud, so I'll just point at locations after I peek at them." That one's pretty obviously against the spirit of the game, but people always come up with more subtle communication tactics so it would be nice to hear from the game designers about their philosophy of communication in the game and have some examples of what is allowed and what isn't.
 
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Bradford Lounsberry
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I believe it is a fully acceptable to say anything you want except about specific information about locations and clues. And I think it fits thematically. We are all struggling to survive.

I had a game where I was going to move into a location and I was told I shouldn't go there. "Just trust me" No specific information was shared so no rule was broken, but I appreciate cooperation in the game so I stayed where I was. Klein attack, game over for me. My trustworthy partner was Klein, he wins.

So feel free to talk, just be careful about who you listen to...
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Davy Ashleydale
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Right, but I'm talking about the case where two or more people know for sure that none of them are Klein. And let's say that one of them has only peeked at one location and it's the Cemetery. They aren't allowed to come out and say, "I just saw the Cemetery," of course. But what if they take their next turn and say, "I'm going to move here. Oh no, wait. I know that place isn't safe," so they move somewhere else.

Now, all of the people that trust that player can make a note that he saw the Cemetery. It's the same effect as if he had said it out loud to them.
 
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Davy Ashleydale
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We just played twice on Saturday and had a great time, but we still have communication questions.

What is the intention of telling players that they can't speak aloud about locations and clues? What are some examples of things that you're not supposed to say? I take it to mean that I can't Peek at a card and immediately say, "The Binoculars showed me the Highway." But after looking at it, can I say, "Whoa! The Preppy is really in trouble!"? Because if the Preppy is on the Highway, that would definitely give away what I just saw.

Also, can someone look at a Clue and then announce, "Well, I just learned who Klein is. It's the Cheerleader!"? We really couldn't find any reason to doubt that player, especially if other players had seen either of the clues that lead to the Cheerleader. I mean, the player making that announcement could be Klein, but it seems like it would be so dangerous for the Klein player to make an announcement like that since if two or more players have seen a non-Cheerleader clue, they would just speak up and point out the lie.

It just seemed to us that the intention of the rule is to make it difficult for the players to share information with each other. But we found that just restricting players from announcing the name of the location or clue they just peeked at, didn't stop information from flowing easily. So it made us think that maybe there are other things that we're not supposed to say to each other.
 
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Greg Toystorian
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The Table Talk intention is to not give any information about the locations or clues. To say you know who Klein is would be giving away clue information and to say "The Preppy is really in trouble!" is giving away location information albeit indirectly. So both of these examples would be going against the spirit of the rules if the information you were conveying was in fact true.
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Davy Ashleydale
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TheToystoryian wrote:
The Table Talk intention is to not give any information about the locations or clues. To say you know who Klein is would be giving away clue information and to say "The Preppy is really in trouble!" is giving away location information albeit indirectly. So both of these examples would be going against the spirit of the rules if the information you were conveying was in fact true.


Okay, wow, that's a lot more restrictive than I had originally thought after just reading the rules. I like it, though. I actually prefer co-op games with NO communication, like Hanabi and The Grizzled, because it avoids the alpha player problem. I've even started playing other co-op games like Eldritch Horror and Dead of Winter with no communication, too. It increases the difficulty, but keeps everyone on equal footing and I think it makes the games more exciting.

This sounds like it's the type of game where it's probably best to keep mostly quiet and just try to impart information by use of the Sharing action, and no other way. Maybe it's even supposed to be fairly rare to make it through Act Three at all!
 
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