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Subject: A Somewhat Long List of Questions rss

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Philip Othman
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To Pallantides or any other helpful playtesters/rule gremlins out there, I have a few questions that perhaps I could receive some help on.


1. The two skills "Counterattack" and "Attack From Beyond" refer to "unarmed attacks".

I have interpreted these as meaning attacks that roll the specified dice, but do not include the character's weapon. They are not considered to be the -2 attack power unarmed attacks. Is this correct? Also, I assume you cannot perform a re-roll on the free attack created by "Counterattack"?


2. On the scenarios "Hunting the Tigress" and "The Infernal Pursuit I/II" sharks destroy non-hero/leader units if they fall into the ocean.

Are heroes able to optionally choose to swim in the water and, if they do so, do they avoid taking damage from the sharks? If this is the case, does a hero need to be able to climb to descend into the water or can anyone step off the boat, but be required to climb out?


3. The skill "Ambidextrous" refers to allowing a hero to apply two one-handed weapon cards to one attack.

With every rule, I lean towards thematic sense and I have seen mixed responses to this on these forums. To me, a one-handed weapon is any weapon that costs 2 or fewer weight points. Likewise, a two-handed weapon is any weapon that costs 3 or more weight points. Are these understandings correct?


4. The skill "Support" allows fellow characters in the same zone as the supporter to re-roll 1 die per action performed.

I have understood this as the supported characters being able to re-roll any 1 colour dice of their choosing for every activation of an action. So, if a Conan supported by Belit chose to perform two separate attacks on two targets, he would be allowed to re-roll 1 die for free when resolving both individual attacks. Also, "Support" does not affect the provider of the skill (Belit). Correct?


5. I have noticed that there is an equipment card for "Conan's Sword".

In scenarios that advise Conan be equipped with a "Sword", should I actually use "Conan's Sword" instead, as it would seem to make a lot more thematic sense?


6. The skill "Leadership" does not specify that the hero bearing the trait may influence their ally's rolls.

I have personally understood this skill as being akin to the Overlord's unit control as they are both referred to as "units". This means that the leadership hero may spend stamina gems on their given character sheet to apply re-rolls, movement and guard effects to their activated ally. Is this correct?


7. Can a hero attack the same target twice in one turn?

Just double checking this, as I am a little shaky on the idea. Could Conan, for instance, attack for 3 stamina on an enemy, resolve the attack, perform another action (move away, a manipulation such as catching etc.) and then perform a second attack for 2 stamina on the same enemy? I would assume yes to this situation, but just want to double check.


8. May a hero equip a shield along with a two-handed weapon?

I lean towards the concept of weapon sets, for example, Conan would be able to carry both a two-handed weapon, a one-handed weapon and a shield, but would only be able to apply the shield to guard attacks to an Overlord's attack, if in the most recent hero turn he had used the one-handed weapon to attack on his final attack action. I understand this concept is not specifically listed anywhere and is more a homebrew one, but I'm curious if there are some internal logical rules around this that have failed to be included/I have missed?


Lastly, this one is very important to me, but not of the same nature.

When deciding heroes, equipment and spells for a scenario, how does one decide on the setup? This is referring to options outside of the specific suggested heroes in the book.

I have yet to do this, but my interpretation has been to apply a cap of 3 starting items maximum per hero. The starting items may not include consumables and should match the character sheet art of the character chosen. For spells, I was going to approach this as having to choose a number of spells equal to the cost of the currently suggested ones. I understand this is a more sandbox and less official element, but I am hoping some general rules/guidelines will be added to the site/2nd edition rules and I was wondering if there are already some in house ones, as I remember long ago Monolith's scenario video had Valeria, Conan and Shevatas as the heroes for the Pict village. It would also seem by the starting equipment for some scenarios that indeed, the logical Conan to choose would actually be the Warlord version.

A preemptive thanks for your help!


EDIT: Just thought of another one.
 
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Stephan Beal
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Circinae wrote:
To Pallantides or any other helpful playtesters/rule gremlins out there, I have a few questions that perhaps I could receive some help on.


1. The two skills "Counterattack" and "Attack From Beyond" refer to "unarmed attacks".


Translation error. They are attacks without a melee weapon, using the specified dice, but not the -2 "unarmed" penalty.

Circinae wrote:

I have interpreted these as meaning attacks that roll the specified dice, but do not include the character's weapon. They are not considered to be the -2 attack power unarmed attacks. Is this correct? Also, I assume you cannot perform a re-roll on the free attack created by "Counterattack"?


AFAIK (maybe wrong), Heroes can pay to reroll whenever they want unless specified otherwise.

Circinae wrote:

2. On the scenarios "Hunting the Tigress" and "The Infernal Pursuit I/II" sharks destroy non-hero/leader units if they fall into the ocean.

Are heroes able to optionally choose to swim in the water and, if they do so, do they avoid taking damage from the sharks? If this is the case, does a hero need to be able to climb to descend into the water or can anyone step off the boat, but be required to climb out?


Heroes don't fall in: the scenarios say the heroes stay in the ship space where they attempted to jump from.

Circinae wrote:

3. The skill "Ambidextrous" refers to allowing a hero to apply two one-handed weapon cards to one attack.

With every rule, I lean towards thematic sense and I have seen mixed responses to this on these forums. To me, a one-handed weapon is any weapon that costs 2 or fewer weight points. Likewise, a two-handed weapon is any weapon that costs 3 or more weight points. Are these understandings correct?


Since 3+ is explicitly 2-handed, i think we have to assume that <3 is de facto 2-handed.


Circinae wrote:

4. The skill "Support" allows fellow characters in the same zone as the supporter to re-roll 1 die per action performed.

I have understood this as the supported characters being able to re-roll any 1 colour dice of their choosing for every activation of an action. So, if a Conan supported by Belit chose to perform two separate attacks on two targets, he would be allowed to re-roll 1 die for free when resolving both individual attacks. Also, "Support" does not affect the provider of the skill (Belit). Correct?


Also my understanding.


Circinae wrote:

5. I have noticed that there is an equipment card for "Conan's Sword".

In scenarios that advise Conan be equipped with a "Sword", should I actually use "Conan's Sword" instead, as it would seem to make a lot more thematic sense?


Different stats, though. i tend to think that "sword" means "plain old sword," but there's another translation error where they write "bow", but the deck contains 2 different types of bow. i.e. it could go either way, really.

Circinae wrote:

6. The skill "Leadership" does not specify that the hero bearing the trait may influence their ally's rolls.

I have personally understood this skill as being akin to the Overlord's unit control as they are both referred to as "units". This means that the leadership hero may spend stamina gems on their given character sheet to apply re-rolls, movement and guard effects to their activated ally. Is this correct?


i remember seeing a thread where someone from Monolith clarified that a Leader may spend more gems for extra movement, defense, re-rolls, etc., but i don't have the thread number handy :/. The thread said that that would be clarified in the updated rulebook. (Please don't ask when it will be ready! They just started on it a week or so ago and it will likely take months to get it done, translated, and triple-checked by native speakers.)

Update: here's the thread, where BadKam says:

BadKam wrote:
Just to complete the answers, a character with the Leadership ability can also spend gems to gain extra movements (1 gem = 1 movement points) for their allies, and they can spend gems to defend them (1 gem = 1 orange die).

This will be cleared in the new version of the rulebook


Circinae wrote:

7. Can a hero attack the same target twice in one turn?


Absolutely. One big attack or many little ones, your choice. e.g. Big attacks are needed against opponents with 3 armor, but pirates often justify a series of smaller attacks.

Circinae wrote:

8. May a hero equip a shield along with a two-handed weapon?


Was clarified by (IIRC) Pallantides in another thread: YES. "two-handed" is sort of a misnomer, and is intended to represent "heavy" weapons, regardless of whether they're really 2-handed or not. In any case, he says yes, a hero may wield a shield with a "two-handed" weapon.

Update: here's a mention of it. It also applies to bows and crossbows.

Circinae wrote:
Lastly, this one is very important to me, but not of the same nature.

When deciding heroes, equipment and spells for a scenario, how does one decide on the setup? This is referring to options outside of the specific suggested heroes in the book.


There is no official answer to that question. You use the suggested setup or your on you're own. It's that simple :/.
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Ze Masqued Cucumber
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Re: A Somewhat Long List of Clarifications
Disclaimer: Answers from the top of my mind. Experts will confirm (or not ).

1- Correct.

2- If the heroes fail to jump they stay on the starting area, as indicated in the scenarios. Sure you could houserule something involving jumping in the water, swimming and climbing out (just make sure that the character has the swimming ability, otherwise he will obviously drown).

3- Yes (IIRC). In case of doubt, I'd apply thematic sense (for example, a rapier is 1-handed, a pike is 2-handed).

4- Yes and Yes.

5- If both weapons have the same (or similar) stats, I believe you can swap them without significantly over/underpower the hero. I don't remember if it's the case for "Basic" sword vs. Conan's sword.

6- Correct. 1 Gem to activate one ally miniature (works exactly like the OL, except the activation cost is 1 gem per mini, not per group). Then extra gem(s), if you wish so, for rerolls etc.

7- Yes.

8- Not sure. You can carry as many items you want, as long as you can bear their weight. Anyway, I'm not sure that carrying several "heavy" weapons sets (such as 2-h weapons, shields, etc) is a good option, due to the weight penalties.

Lastly- A fan has created a point-based character ranking system to help on this. However, this is intended as a help, not a "magical-auto-balance" tool. There's a thread about it here on BGG.

[Edit : Ninja'ed]
 
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Philip Othman
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sgbeal wrote:
AFAIK (maybe wrong), Heroes can pay to reroll whenever they want unless specified otherwise.


Seems like an odd one that, because you could logically apply the same concept to Belit's power and have her re-rolling attacks whilst she's dead. Both skills would only trigger on the Overlord's turn as well, so seems a bit odd re-rolling attacks, but you're probably right.

sgbeal wrote:
Heroes don't fall in: the scenarios say the heroes stay in the ship space where they attempted to jump from.


I'm aware of this, hence I was wondering if they could choose to enter the water, swim around and climb out, but I imagine the sea is just straight up out of bounds.

Roolz wrote:
(just make sure that the character has the swimming ability, otherwise he will obviously drown)


Drowning would be a most shameful way for Conan to go out!

sgbeal wrote:
Was clarified by (IIRC) Pallantides in another thread: YES.


I have no idea how I completely missed that thread, sorry. That seems rather silly really, but perhaps as Ze Masqued Cucumber said, encumberance makes it a poor choice generally.

sgbeal wrote:
They just started on it a week or so ago and it will likely take months to get it done


Yeah, I'm aware of that. I'm still aggrieved by how badly it turned out, that even equipment cards and tokens from the core set aren't referenced or seemingly put to use in any scenarios. That there isn't even a component layout is madness. Oh well.


Thanks for the help guys, you've helped set me at ease!

(Think I'm going to use Conan's Sword and balance be damned!)

 
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Stephan Beal
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Circinae wrote:
sgbeal wrote:
AFAIK (maybe wrong), Heroes can pay to reroll whenever they want unless specified otherwise.


Seems like an odd one that, because you could logically apply the same concept to Belit's power and have her re-rolling attacks whilst she's dead.


If she's dead she necessarily has no more energy left for rerolls.
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Stephan Beal
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Circinae wrote:
sgbeal wrote:
AFAIK (maybe wrong), Heroes can pay to reroll whenever they want unless specified otherwise.


Seems like an odd one that, because you could logically apply the same concept to Belit's power and have her re-rolling attacks whilst she's dead. Both skills would only trigger on the Overlord's turn as well, so seems a bit odd re-rolling attacks, but you're probably right.

sgbeal wrote:
Heroes don't fall in: the scenarios say the heroes stay in the ship space where they attempted to jump from.


I'm aware of this, hence I was wondering if they could choose to enter the water, swim around and climb out, but I imagine the sea is just straight up out of bounds.



As written, no the characters cannot choose to enter the water because the scenario makes no allowance for that.

The answer to all questions regarding customization beyond what's explicitly stated in the rules/scenarios is: "you're on your own!"

Feel free to add swimming to it. IIRC, one of the early run-through videos (almost 2 years ago) mentioned the heroes falling in the water and having to climb out, but the scenario seems to have changed (streamlined) since then (or i am misremembering, which may very well be the case).
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Philip Othman
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sgbeal wrote:
If she's dead she necessarily has no more energy left for rerolls.


That is a cunning observation.

I now feel very daft.

sgbeal wrote:
The answer to all questions regarding customization


I'm on the same page as you, I was just unsure whether it even would be a case of customisation or if it's of not being comprehensive enough in the rules descriptions for scenarios. The state of the rule book, issues with translation and the fact components in the core box aren't even accounted for, just makes me want to double check if these things should officially be possible.

I appreciate your help!
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Philip Othman
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So after having a gaming session last night, one of these is still a bit of an issue for me.

Question: Can a hero attack the same target twice in one turn?
Answer: Yes


Now, I seem to lose my wits when talking about board games so I'm probably missing something obvious or am being dense, but I have problems with this regarding Conan.

With this answer, Conan's Circular Strike doesn't make any sense to me. I have previously read that the Overlord can roll to guard against the excess damage and that it still counts armour. If this is true, why would anyone ever bother wasting gems on one big strike than on multiple smaller ones? Even against a bigger enemy it still seems wasteful.

Conan with the Battle Axe could:

Spend 5 gems and strike for 6 red dice + 1 free reroll from the axe.

Spend 5 gems on individual attacks and strike for 5 x 2 red dice + 1 free reroll from the axe.

Even with an armour value of 3 like on the giant snake, it seems a lot more efficient to pay 5 gems for a potential 15 red dice, each individually capable of the 3 to surpass the armour, than 7 from the first attack.

I feel like I'm missing something obvious. Frankly, pretty much any item that gives you a free roll on an attack action on any charcter, makes using the reroll action absolutely wasteful and encourages you to just perform constant individual attacks.

 
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Ze Masqued Cucumber
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Circinae wrote:
I feel like I'm missing something obvious.

I don't know the stats by heart, but it's generally easier (and cheaper in terms of gems) to defend against few dice in several strikes than against many in a single strike.
PS: IIRC Conan can use 5 gems max for attack(s), but that's another story.
 
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Philip Othman
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You are correct, 5 gems maximum, the issue is that 5 gems in one go vs 5 gems on separate attacks is the difference between a potential 7 red dice rolls vs 15 red dice rolls.

Roolz wrote:
it's generally easier (and cheaper in terms of gems) to defend against few dice in several strikes than against many in a single strike.


I agree with what you're saying, but especially in the case of red dice, one high roll is potentially enough to bypass the armour of any enemy in Clutches of the Picts scenario and for every attack, Conan can roll 2 + 1 reroll of red dice without even activating a reroll action.

5 attacks of 3 red dice rolls for a measly 5 gems is going to utterly wither the Overlord's gem pool if he tries to guard against them and psychologically, gives an advantage to the hero player. You don't have to over commit and ultimately you have a chance to be consistently hitting 1 or 2 potential wounds if they go unguarded.

Perhaps my probabilities and ratio understandings are all awry.

In the case of Circular Strike, it makes the skill totally useless. If the damage by the cleave is both affected by armour and can be guarded, the only situation it will ever have value is when Conan performs a 1 gem single attack. That seems both un-thematic and largely irrelevant.

EDIT: I suppose Circular Strike works on every attack anyway so it's a decent passive, but it feels like it is intended for the big hit.
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Stephan Beal
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Circinae wrote:
Now, I seem to lose my wits when talking about board games so I'm probably missing something obvious or am being dense, but I have problems with this regarding Conan.

With this answer, Conan's Circular Strike doesn't make any sense to me. I have previously read that the Overlord can roll to guard against the excess damage and that it still counts armour. If this is true, why would anyone ever bother wasting gems on one big strike than on multiple smaller ones? Even against a bigger enemy it still seems wasteful.


You generally can't reliably pierce heavy armor (3) with smaller strikes. If the OL is out of energy, or close to it, he can't block enough of a big strike to completely avoid it. Big strikes have their moments. e.g. depending on the OL player, he may or may not bother spending gems to protect minions, in which case one massive axe swing can take out a whole handful of them. If he does spend gems protecting minions, take advantage of that: force him to waste some gems on them and _then_ go after his heavier targets with stronger hits. He'll likely only let you get away with that once, which means he's unlikely to spend further gems to protect his minions, which makes them easier targets later on.

One excellent use for Circular Strike is against Hyenas, which have zero armor. One big CS can easily clear out a whole pack of them.
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Philip Othman
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sgbeal wrote:
One excellent use for Circular Strike is against Hyenas, which have zero armor. One big CS can easily clear out a whole pack of them.


But multiple individual attacks is far more efficient. Circular Strike occurs every time he kills an enemy. Hyenas have 0 armour and 1 hp. 1 large hit of 3 gems is:

4 Red Dice + 1 Free Reroll.

3 individual hits is:

2 Red Dice + 1 Free Reroll
2 Red Dice + 1 Free Reroll
2 Red Dice + 1 Free Reroll

The first hit is likely enough to kill 2 Hyenas and possibly all 3. If it isn't just do a second one on the next target. You get more dice and risk less.

Like I said, the only situation I can see a big hit being even worth considering is against one of the two 3 armour enemies and you're still more likely to inflict the same/more wounds at a lower cost doing multiple smaller hits, because of the free rerolls.

For bigger enemies, I really need to sit down and do the maths as it's probably already been done and makes sense, it just feels off to me.

I still think Circular Strike is an odd ability. It's a nice perk, but doesn't sync well with the concept of an especially big hit.

I need to play more to get a better feel for sure.


EDIT: BTW this thread has been really helpful and I'm grateful for you guys taking the time to discuss this stuff with me, thank you very much!


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Ze Masqued Cucumber
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What Stephan said. I played a demo a while back as the OL and was in a similar situation. IIRC I wasn't doing too bad, but I was a bit low on gems. Conan removed many of my meatshield undeads in a single strike, then finished my necromancer on next turn. I lost .

Circinae wrote:
I need to play more to get a better feel for sure.

Same for me . Haven't received the game yet, so I'm mostly using my -unreliable- memory.
 
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Stephan Beal
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Circinae wrote:
sgbeal wrote:
One excellent use for Circular Strike is against Hyenas, which have zero armor. One big CS can easily clear out a whole pack of them.


But multiple individual attacks is far more efficient.


That's very probably true. :/

Okay, so we relegate "big hits" to opponents with 3 armor.
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Frank BLACKFIRE
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Related to Philip 1st post :

I don't actually have the game...so everything 's from my mind...

1. It's not a "free unarmed melee attack", but a "free melee attack without weapon bonus".

Counterattack : no re-roll. This die is rolled after you've made active defense (or not) and taken damages (or not).

Attack from beyond : no re-roll, you're dead.

2. Nobody swims on this one...There are sharks ! gulp

3. Do not refer to 1-handed or 2-handed, just use the "encumbrance" of the weapons and you'll be fine.
To use "Circular Strike" you need a 3 encumbrance melee weapon.
To use "ambidextrous" you need 2 melee weapons of 2 or fewer encumbrance each.

4. Yes, you got it.

5. "Sword" and "Conan sword" are not exactly the same weapons...but I think you can do as you wish. Roolz is right on this one : "If both weapons have the same (or similar) stats, I believe you can swap them without significantly over/underpower the hero".

6. https://boardgamegeek.com/thread/1656447/belits-guards

7. Yes.

8. As told in point 3, do not refer to 1 or 2-handed weapons, just encumbrance. https://boardgamegeek.com/thread/1657042/using-shield-weight...
 
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Philip Othman
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sgbeal wrote:
Okay, so we relegate "big hits" to opponents with 3 armor.


Of course, it's more satisfying to take out your anger on a particularly annoying pict.

I may houserule CS to only trigger off an attack of 3 or more gems.

Thanks for the response Pallantides, but now that I've got you...

Q: Can Mitra's Halo be cast on other heroes/allies?

Q: Does Wall Wrecker cost 2 movement points in addition to the 1 cost to cross a border (=3) or do you pay 2 movement points for the whole action (basically the same as a hut flap)?

Q: Hadrathus can hurt himself with Lightning Storm if he casts it on his area (just like Explosive Orbs) correct?
 
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Frank BLACKFIRE
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Q1 : no, only on the spellcaster.
Q2 : yes, 2 mvp in addition to the 1 to cross the border, so 3 mvp (if you need extra gems, you put them in the mvt box).
Q3 : Yes correct.
 
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Stephan Beal
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Pallantides wrote:
Q2 : yes, 2 mvp in addition to the 1 to cross the border, so 3 mvp (if you need extra gems, you put them in the mvt box).


i have to dispute that one. The rules say:

Quote:
The character can spend 2 movement points to move across a wall or wooden door from 1 area to an adjacent area and place an opening token on that obstacle...


(Ignoring for the time being that it should say "wooden wall" instead of "wall".)

That is, IMO, unambiguously a total cost of 2, not 3. If that's not the case then this skill is a prime candidate for improvement in the upcoming rules revision.
 
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sgbeal wrote:
Pallantides wrote:
Q2 : yes, 2 mvp in addition to the 1 to cross the border, so 3 mvp (if you need extra gems, you put them in the mvt box).


i have to dispute that one. The rules say:

Quote:
The character can spend 2 movement points to move across a wall or wooden door from 1 area to an adjacent area and place an opening token on that obstacle...


(Ignoring for the time being that it should say "wooden wall" instead of "wall".)

That is, IMO, unambiguously a total cost of 2, not 3. If that's not the case then this skill is a prime candidate for improvement in the upcoming rules revision.


I think this is a translation issue. In french: during movement, it costs 2 movement points to traverse a wooden wall/door.

As I understand the translation, this is 2 movement points extra (on top of the usual 1 MP.)
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Stephan Beal
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stenfisker wrote:
In french: during movement, it costs 2 movement points to traverse a wooden wall/door.

As I understand the translation, this is 2 movement points extra (on top of the usual 1 MP.)


i disagree with that, too . To me that means 2 points, instead of 1 (not in addition to 1), to traverse a wooden wall/door. "2 points to traverse" sound unambiguous to me - there's no mention of a 3rd movement point there, nor does it say "2 extra" movement points.
 
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Frank BLACKFIRE
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stenfisker wrote:
I think this is a translation issue. In french: during movement, it costs 2 movement points to traverse a wooden wall/door.

As I understand the translation, this is 2 movement points extra (on top of the usual 1 MP.)

You're right, in french it's stated 2 more mvp to cross and that's how I've always played it. The word "surcout" means additional here.

So 1 mvp for the move and 2 more to destroy the wall.


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Pallantides wrote:
stenfisker wrote:
I think this is a translation issue. In french: during movement, it costs 2 movement points to traverse a wooden wall/door.

As I understand the translation, this is 2 movement points extra (on top of the usual 1 MP.)

You're right, in french it's stated 2 more mvp to cross and that's how I've always played it. The word "surcout" means additional here.

So 1 mvp for the move and 2 more to destroy the wall.


Facepalm. FACE. PALM.

i think my patience/tolerance for the mistranslations in the rules skill and scenarios just officially ran out :/.

Edit: replaced "rules" with "skills and scenarios", as i've no notable problems with the wording of the core rules.
 
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Frank BLACKFIRE
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sgbeal wrote:
Facepalm. FACE. PALM.

i think my patience/tolerance for the mistranslations in the rules just officially ran out :/.

soblue
 
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Anders Olin
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I'd buy plentiful of lager (or anything else) to have someone rework the rulebook for us ASAP.

This is the fourth game I have given a ten and it's 6 years since I handed out the last...but please, please, please fix the rules for us. I think I haven't played any scenario correctly jet(5 games) due to translation errors shake
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amanwing
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@Anders as long as you are having fun and rate it a 10 it can't get better. Or would better rules make it an 11?
 
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