Bishop
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Christchurch
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*huge angry/saddened father rant incoming*


So on Monday this week I received a call from my partner telling me that our eldest was in the principal's office and was very upset and needed to be picked up.

I get there and see my 11-year-old daughter sitting facing the door in the principal's chair looking downcast with red-rimmed eyes. The principal looks at me and says that an incident has occurred in her classroom and Milla is very upset. I ask Milla to tell me what happened - and even now 6 days later I'm still flummoxed at how this even comes up in this age group.......

"We were in our spelling groups and some of the boys we're saying some rude things like swearing and then they would look at me and giggle." Milla is the only girl in her spelling group and everyone is the round the same age of 10 - 11. "They were annoying me and being loud and I said to them to shut up some of us are trying to work." Milla looked at me and with a mix of confusion, fear, and anger on her face, "'Boys name' looked at me after saying something else to the other boys and said, ''Another boys name' is going to rape you.'"


On talking to my daughter further she said she tried to ignore it, but one of her friends told her to go to the teacher, (on finding Milla crying in the toilets), so she did, and the teacher's reaction? "Ok well go to the office while I see if he really said that."
Seriously? You question and doubt the child that is obviously upset?
The principle noted to me after Milla had finished talking, "Milla has never lied about anything and has always admitted to things so I want you to know that I believe her and will action this."
I am assuming Milla told her what her teacher said.
We had a discussion on why she ignored it and in the end I said to her , "You can never ignore the threat of sexual (or any kind of) violence - that isn't a problem you ignore. That is what has happened for too long and all that would do to the boy is let him know that it is actually ok to say those things. So at some point down the track he will say it again to another girl and maybe say something worse.... and the chain will just keep going if we all ignore these things."


Frikkin' eleven years old. I seriously did not think this would be something I would have to deal with until 15/16 maybe? To say that I was angry was probably an understatement.

Now the thing with my eldest is that she is very aware of things and can work herself up over some things. In this case, when we got home I had to just hold her for a while, as she said that it made her scared of what's out there. What could happen when she is walking or going to a friends place etc etc etc.......

We played a few games to take her mind off it during the afternoon and she was fine to go back to school the next day. The school handled the situation appropriately so we are happy at that end.

But I ask, to society in general, "What is happening in today's world that kids at 10/11 are threatening sexual violence to one another?!"

I know, that the boys know what rape is - but, that they don't know the full issues with it, and how it affects someone on an emotional, intellectual, physical and general state of being level.
But I still don't understand how at that age, that is a go-to comeback? Cripes I was feeling bad-ass at that age to use s##t or call someone a t###pot and never at any stage in my life have I ever thought that threatening sexual violence was ok - even jokingly.

Sigh.......rant over.

When I look around the world today, I am truly saddened and almost in despair for our future generations. To be fair, though - I already lament a lot of present world problems that could have been avoided through just someone in the time / position displaying some human frikkin' decency!


TLDR: Humans suck. *A disillusioned parents view of present and future society*
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bob m
United States
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It has always been there and, sadly will always be there. Its the parents teaching or lack of. And so you get kids whom have an idea (i think it has to be developed/taught) of what is going down and other kids who dont care because they have never learned otherwise. Just coming from another parent.
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Liam
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I think your daughter did really well exposed to some particularly immature kids, who in turn were exposed to a particularly destructive culture of normalising and diminishing the word/meaning 'rape'.

The teacher failed in his/her duty of care. I'd probably leave it there.

I'd write to the school and request a written response to your concerns and a statement in how they will address these issues.

Your daughter did really well. Even in shock she didn't take it and made it an issue. It would have been easier to say nothing. If every adult who witnessed this sort of thing responded in the same way this 'rape culture' wouldn't exist for these young kids to be exposed to.

This experience will stand her in good stead for the future and standing up for her and everybody else's rights in the future. I'd stick your head round the door and tell her how proud you are of her (again).

Anxiety and fear during adolescence is a phase for many (focusing on every human issue). You monitor it and if required, get help.

Dad you should go for a walk, vent and distract yourself - it'll be better tomorrow and the next day but it'll take 6 weeks if your lucky.


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Ryan
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An terrible incident, but I'm not sure how much generalization can be made from it. Threatening sexual violence (especially at an age when they don't fully understand all the implications of what they're saying - as you admit is probably the case in your post) is nothing new among children.

I would also keep in mind that we (in the United States, at least) are constantly bombarded by the bad side of humanity in the news (regardless of whether it is TV, radio, online, etc.) The "feel good" stories get far less attention. I doubt it's much different in other countries.

As an obvious, recent example, look at the news stories about police in the U.S. over the last few years. Without any perspective, a person might think most cops are trigger happy, power hungry animals with no oversight going just by the majority of the news. Of course, that isn't the case at all - the vast majority are good people who do their jobs responsibly.

Of course we have many problems to deal with, but I don't think the outlook is quite as bleak as it may seem at first glance.
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Boaty McBoatface
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Cannot reply, RSp topic.

Other then to say, you should never ever take one persons version of an event as gospel (irrespective of sex or age).
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Liam
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Great constructive compassionate point.

shake
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Boaty McBoatface
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monkeyhandz wrote:
Great constructive compassionate point.

:shake:
It is a valid point, it does not have to be compassionate.

Would you (or the OP) be happy if you had sons and this was aimed at them? Or would you want the school to hear their side?

As I said this cannot be discussed openly or fairly within this forum. I have to bite my tongue and try to find ways to express my views without beaching the sties policies (as the OP did).

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T. Dauphin
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Oh, man, that's gotta hurt!
I agree, an 11 yr old should never have to deal with that kind of s#*t.
The positive side of this, I guess, is that it's a teaching moment, so she can be aware of potential a@@holes in the future.
I believe the boys, as you said, don't really understand the implications of what they've said. The world is coming to our children at younger and younger ages, these days, largely due to easy access to the internet. It's amazing how many kids that age have computers, tablets or phones and are allowed unmonitored access to them at all hours of the day--ie. they have them in their rooms without restriction. Of course, this means they are exposed to sex, drugs and violence before most of them have an understanding of what it's all about or how they can be affected. I see 9 yr olds at school with cellphones and wonder why their parents think this is necessary.

I think the teacher was attempting to do what was required of his/her job in talking to the other student, but the wording of that statement was truly unfortunate. Glad to hear everything was followed up on, though.
It's a hard thing to appreciate at the moment, but ultimately your daughter will be a stronger person for the experience. And she has caring committed parents, so she's well equipped.

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Bishop
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slatersteven wrote:
monkeyhandz wrote:
Great constructive compassionate point.

shake
It is a valid point, it does not have to be compassionate.

Would you (or the OP) be happy if you had sons and this was aimed at them? Or would you want the school to hear their side?

As I said this cannot be discussed openly or fairly within this forum. I have to bite my tongue and try to find ways to express my views without beaching the sties policies (as the OP did).



You're right. This should have been in the RSP thread. I was thinking along social/society/community lines hence the community thread post. I've red xed it. Apologies.

I also didn't aim anything at the boys - I questioned how society has evolved to the point that at that age this is even a thing to say.

My issue with the teacher wasn't that she needed to get the other side - it was that she implied to my daughter that she was lying. Which was merely a phrasing issue. But it shows how important such things are. She mentioned it to the principal (I've since found out that Milla did indeed question why the teacher didn't believe her).
The principal also did state to myself and Milla, that she would talk to the boy and get his version - and I was fine with that and so was Milla.

To all, I appreciate everyone's thoughts and opinions.

To the boy's credit, he admitted to what he said, apologised to Milla and admitted to his parents what he did. I am impressed with his integrity and courage in standing up to this.
The principal stated that she would look at suspension as an option, to which I disagreed with as this isn't a solution and wouldn't teach him the error he made.

As a parent I suffer from having a parents eye. But I am proud of how Milla handled the entire situation (more details have come out). I am pleased with the school, I am pleased with the boys post actions, and I am pleased with the boys parents and their actions.

Apologies to all for posting in the wrong forum.
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Daniel Blumentritt
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Quote:
To the boy's credit, he admitted to what he said, apologised to Milla and admitted to his parents what he did. I am impressed with his integrity and courage in standing up to this.
The principal stated that she would look at suspension as an option, to which I disagreed with as this isn't a solution and wouldn't teach him the error he made.

As a parent I suffer from having a parents eye. But I am proud of how Milla handled the entire situation (more details have come out). I am pleased with the school, I am pleased with the boys post actions, and I am pleased with the boys parents and their actions.


Sounds like other than the one teacher everybody handled this pretty well.
 
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Boaty McBoatface
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ClericID wrote:
slatersteven wrote:
monkeyhandz wrote:
Great constructive compassionate point.

:shake:
It is a valid point, it does not have to be compassionate.

Would you (or the OP) be happy if you had sons and this was aimed at them? Or would you want the school to hear their side?

As I said this cannot be discussed openly or fairly within this forum. I have to bite my tongue and try to find ways to express my views without beaching the sties policies (as the OP did).



You're right. This should have been in the RSP thread. I was thinking along social/society/community lines hence the community thread post. I've red xed it. Apologies.

I also didn't aim anything at the boys - I questioned how society has evolved to the point that at that age this is even a thing to say.

My issue with the teacher wasn't that she needed to get the other side - it was that she implied to my daughter that she was lying. Which was merely a phrasing issue. But it shows how important such things are. She mentioned it to the principal (I've since found out that Milla did indeed question why the teacher didn't believe her).
The principal also did state to myself and Milla, that she would talk to the boy and get his version - and I was fine with that and so was Milla.

To all, I appreciate everyone's thoughts and opinions.

To the boy's credit, he admitted to what he said, apologised to Milla and admitted to his parents what he did. I am impressed with his integrity and courage in standing up to this.
The principal stated that she would look at suspension as an option, to which I disagreed with as this isn't a solution and wouldn't teach him the error he made.

As a parent I suffer from having a parents eye. But I am proud of how Milla handled the entire situation (more details have come out). I am pleased with the school, I am pleased with the boys post actions, and I am pleased with the boys parents and their actions.

Apologies to all for posting in the wrong forum.
thanks for the clarification, yes I think I did misunderstand what you were saying.

But then we all make mistakes.
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Brad Miller
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RSP topic. One half of our current political climate, OK, to be honest, it's looking like about 38%, find this type of behavior acceptable, because they're just women. Sad.
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Things are definitely messed up. A student in my wife's class threatened to bring his dad's gun in and shoot another student because he didn't like what he was doing in their gym class. My wife teaches first grade.
 
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Steven P
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Sadly, I'm not surprised by this. Saddened, yes, but not surprised.

I lived a pretty sheltered childhood in a safe, quiet community and a very religious family. But by 5th grade (probably after we'd had sex ed), a friend taught me the meaning of the word "rape". (We were pretending to be karate warriors fighting, and he wanted me to pretend I was raping his imaginary girlfriend so he could come rescue her. He had to explain what it meant, and I was shocked that there was such a thing.)

If I learned about it by age 10, I'm surprised now if kids don't know about it by 8 or earlier, especially with how much more "edgy" the media has become since 1989 (people thought Simpsons was shocking; now, it's tame), and the fact that people let their elementary kids watch things like Deadpool.

I'm sorry that you (or anybody) would have to go through this. And while the particular threat is egregious, I'm not surprised by kids that age threatening people -- usually with things like "kill you", "beat you up", etc. Any such threat is, at the least, bullying, and needs to be handled immediately, and the teacher totally failed. I hope that Milla is feeling better, and that the later response was better -- but I also hope that those boys receive some proper counseling to straighten them out.

And now I need to go educate my 9 year old daughter... soblue
 
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T. Dauphin
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DoomTurtle wrote:
Things are definitely messed up. A student in my wife's class threatened to bring his dad's gun in and shoot another student because he didn't like what he was doing in their gym class. My wife teaches first grade.


I hope she's taking that very seriously--regardless of the age. Knowing there is a gun makes that a whole lot easier.
Of course, if there were no gun in the first place...


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