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Subject: The Boy Who Cried Conspiracy rss

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C Bazler
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I just read an interesting article about Trump's supporters' willingness to believe conspiracy theories, and this line struck me:

Donald Trump wrote:
Hillary Clinton meets in secret with international banks to plot the destruction of U.S. sovereignty in order to enrich these global financial powers, her special interest friends, and her donors.


For those of you who didn't catch it, yes, that was what an actual Presidential nominee said, unironically and without hyperbole, about his opponent in a televised speech in West Palm Beach, Florida. And oddly enough, no one is even talking about it. We're all too busy trying to wrap our minds around the dozen other crazy things Trump has said this week But looking back over the past few years, the pattern becomes frightening:


•The media, colluding with Clinton, "orchestrated" the groping accusations of nine women.

•The election is obviously rigged by Democrats, and if he loses it will be because of fraud.

•Global warming was a hoax created by the Chinese to damage U.S. manufacturing.

•Bill Ayres wrote Dreams from My Father.

•Obama never attended Columbia.

•Obama is a secret Muslim, born in Kenya, who wears a secret Muslim ring.

•Hillary is truly ill and is covering up her frailty with stimulants.


(Here's an enlightening list from last May of 58 other conspiracy theories explicitly or implicitly promoted by Trump)


------------------------------------------------------------

The problem with conspiracy theories is that they are predicated on an absence of proof: they're like a horror movie, where the monster is much scarier before you actually see it. So, Hillary's missing emails are unspeakably evil, and unquestionable proof of her corruption... as long as we don't see them. The moment a bunch of them get leaked, they actually turn out to be pretty benign.

But as with all conspiracy theories, the moment evidence arises that seems to disprove the theory, it is taken only as stronger evidence that the conspiracy is true, and that a deeper conspiracy is taking place: collusion, corruption, and cover-ups are added to the list of crimes. Nothing Hillary can do, nothing an insider politician can say, no evidence the media can provide, will convince us otherwise because they are all in on it too. Universities, schoolteachers, unions, blacks, gays, hispanics... they're all in on it. The world must be a nightmarish place for the conspiracy theorist, where unseen demons with hidden motivations lurk around every corner.

So here's my question: Will our country be able to heal itself after November 8, or are we stuck with this irrational paranoia for the indefinite future?

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Welcome Rolling Stones
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Paranoia and Conservatism go together like peanut butter and jelly.
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Junior McSpiffy
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49xjohn wrote:

Paranoia and Conservatism go together like peanut butter and jelly.


/handpat
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J
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GameCrossing wrote:
49xjohn wrote:

Paranoia and Conservatism go together like peanut butter and jelly.


/handpat

Perhaps RSP is not representative, and even here we have both sides spouting conspiracy theory crap, but it is the "conservatives" that seem to do it the most. Do you disagree?
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C Bazler
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jmilum wrote:
GameCrossing wrote:
49xjohn wrote:

Paranoia and Conservatism go together like peanut butter and jelly.


/handpat

Perhaps RSP is not representative, and even here we have both sides spouting conspiracy theory crap, but it is the "conservatives" that seem to do it the most. Do you disagree?


It must have to do with the fact that we've had a Democrat in the White House for eight years. There were plenty of crazy liberal conspiracies about Bush, 9/11, and the Iraq war.

I do think it is much worse this year, though, mostly because all the conspiracy theories aren't being promoted by no-name political bloggers but by the actual Republican nominee. If this year is an indicator of how future elections are going to go, it's terrifying.

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casey r lowe
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Donald Trump wrote:
Hillary Clinton meets in secret with international banks to plot the destruction of U.S. sovereignty in order to enrich these global financial powers, her special interest friends, and her donors.

its a bit of a stretch but she did say to a brazilian bank that she was for open borders (which diminishes national sovereignty to a degree) - but im for a world without borders so its fine by me
 
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Kissa
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The human mind likes to make connections and often connects things together that shouldn't be. We'll never be rid of conspiracy theories. It's the same kind of non critical thinking that makes people believe in ghosts, big foot, spirits, the soul, alien visitation/ancient aliens, and gods and demons.

According to pew, most evangelical and many mainline christians are conservative and since they are already prone to imaginary friends, believing in other conspiracy theory nonsense is a familiar feeling.
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J
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"International bankers" and "global financial powers". Hmmm. Now who could that be?
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Kissa
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jmilum wrote:
"International bankers" and "global financial powers". Hmmm. Now who could that be?
Yay, gold stars all around and fire up those cargo trains! devil
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jeremy cobert
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cbazler wrote:
The problem with conspiracy theories is that they are predicated on an absence of proof: they're like a horror movie, where the monster is much scarier before you actually see it.


Yeah what silliness !



Oh for fucks sake , its not like she was actively helping a candidate.



Oh never mind.
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Grand Admiral Thrawn
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cbazler wrote:
So here's my question: Will our country be able to heal itself after November 8, or are we stuck with this irrational paranoia for the indefinite future?

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Robert Wesley
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49xjohn wrote:

Paranoia and Conservatism go together like peanut butter and "jellyfish".
FT4A-L-L Everybody KNOWS that 'peanut butter' & 'trout' WERE: " 2 great tastes that taste great together too!" whistle
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Lone Locust of the Apocalypse
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jmilum wrote:

Perhaps RSP is not representative, and even here we have both sides spouting conspiracy theory crap, but it is the "conservatives" that seem to do it the most.


The dangerous shit yes.

the inconsequential stuff is probably evenly shared.
 
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Pontifex Maximus
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Altair IV wrote:
jmilum wrote:

Perhaps RSP is not representative, and even here we have both sides spouting conspiracy theory crap, but it is the "conservatives" that seem to do it the most.


The dangerous shit yes.

the inconsequential stuff is probably evenly shared.


Like why hot dogs and hot dog buns are sold in different quantity?
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Richard Keiser

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Conspiracy theories are for desperate people.

 
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Dickie Crickets
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jmilum wrote:
"International bankers" and "global financial powers". Hmmm. Now who could that be?


Almost makes you nostalgic for the era of more sophisticated dog whistles. Back then, after a couple of beers, you could almost convince yourself that one of America's two major political parties wasn't lurching towards Stormfront.
 
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Drew
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If you're hearing dog whistles, you're the dog.
 
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Donald
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Drew1365 wrote:
If you're hearing dog whistles, you're the dog.


Or you have a defective whistle.

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Mac Mcleod
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cbazler wrote:
jmilum wrote:
GameCrossing wrote:
49xjohn wrote:

Paranoia and Conservatism go together like peanut butter and jelly.


/handpat

Perhaps RSP is not representative, and even here we have both sides spouting conspiracy theory crap, but it is the "conservatives" that seem to do it the most. Do you disagree?


It must have to do with the fact that we've had a Democrat in the White House for eight years. There were plenty of crazy liberal conspiracies about Bush, 9/11, and the Iraq war.

I do think it is much worse this year, though, mostly because all the conspiracy theories aren't being promoted by no-name political bloggers but by the actual Republican nominee. If this year is an indicator of how future elections are going to go, it's terrifying.



Actually back during bush was a bit of a golden age of philosophy and reason here.

And my perception was that most of the people with 9/11 conspiracy theories were right wing extremists (I won't even call them conservatives) who thought it was a liberal conspiracy by the rino Bush who wanted to build a one world government.

 
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J
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Drew1365 wrote:
If you're hearing dog whistles, you're the dog.

we can just see the whistle being blown
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Matthew Schoell
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jmilum wrote:
Drew1365 wrote:
If you're hearing dog whistles, you're the dog.

we can just see the whistle being blown

and hear the subsequent barking.
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Richard Keiser

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Doc Mage wrote:
jmilum wrote:
Drew1365 wrote:
If you're hearing dog whistles, you're the dog.

we can just see the whistle being blown

and hear the subsequent barking.


and the piles of poo.
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Steve Cates
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cbazler wrote:


•The media, colluding with Clinton, "orchestrated" the groping accusations of nine women.

•The election is obviously rigged by Democrats, and if he loses it will be because of fraud.

•Global warming was a hoax created by the Chinese to damage U.S. manufacturing.

•Bill Ayres wrote Dreams from My Father.

•Obama never attended Columbia.

•Obama is a secret Muslim, born in Kenya, who wears a secret Muslim ring.

•Hillary is truly ill and is covering up her frailty with stimulants.


hmm...
-Trump wants a deportation force to go house to house rounding up immigrants.
-Trump hasn't paid any federal taxes for 19 years.
-Russia is working with Trump to expose DNC.
-Trump has "a Mount Rushmore of foreign dictators" that he loves. (quote from Kaine)
-Checking ID is an attempt by Conservatives to disenfranchise voters.
-Trump called ALL Mexicans rapists (this is actually believed or at least repeated falsely by Clinton and Kaine themselves)
 
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Mike Stiles
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ironcates wrote:
Braindead stuff


It feels like my IQ is dribbling out of my ears from reading this, but lets go through your list:

Quote:
-Trump wants a deportation force to go house to house rounding up immigrants.


I've literally NEVER heard this. This some kind of third generation straman?

Quote:
-Trump hasn't paid any federal taxes for 19 years.


I have heard this, but he's all but admitted it, so yeah.

Quote:
-Russia is working with Trump to expose DNC.


"expose" is a weird term there. More to the point, most of us don't think Trump is smart enough to work with the Russians.

Quote:
-Trump has "a Mount Rushmore of foreign dictators" that he loves. (quote from Kaine)


It's SO in character that you take a metaphor as reality.

Quote:
-Checking ID is an attempt by Conservatives to disenfranchise voters.


They've admitted partisan intent, so it gets down to wording.

Quote:
-Trump called ALL Mexicans rapists (this is actually believed or at least repeated falsely by Clinton and Kaine themselves)


trump wrote:
They’re bringing drugs. They’re bringing crime. They’re rapists.


You added all to it, I presume because you're congenitally dishonest.

~~~

Now then to the point, fisk out those Clinton accusations. I wanna see you try it.
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You appear to be conflating a conspiracy with a false statement. And in several of your examples, it wasn't a false statement, but merely an embellishment of something Trump actually said publicly. That's not a conspiracy, dude.

ironcates wrote:

hmm...
-Trump wants a deportation force to go house to house rounding up immigrants.

From the Trump website: "begin removing the more than 2 million criminal illegal immigrants from the country and cancel visas to foreign countries that won’t take them back"

https://www.donaldjtrump.com/press-releases/donald-j.-trump-...

ironcates wrote:


-Trump hasn't paid any federal taxes for 19 years.


Donald Trump declared a $916 million tax loss on his 1995 tax return, a tax deduction so substantial that it could have allowed him to avoid paying federal income taxes for up to 18 years...

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/10/02/us/politics/donald-trump-t...

ironcates wrote:


-Checking ID is an attempt by Conservatives to disenfranchise voters.



The Fourth Circuit ruled that North Carolina's law targeted "African Americans with almost surgical precision" by using data on the most common forms of ID by different races "to exclude many of the alternative photo IDs used by African Americans. The bill retained only the kinds of IDs that white North Carolinians were more likely to possess.

http://www.newsweek.com/voter-id-laws-discriminatory-disenfr...

ironcates wrote:


-Trump called ALL Mexicans rapists (this is actually believed or at least repeated falsely by Clinton and Kaine themselves)



This falls far short of a "conspiracy." It's merely an embellishment of Trump's actually despicable comments.

"When Mexico sends its people, they’re not sending their best," Trump said. "They’re not sending you. They’re not sending you. They’re sending people that have lots of problems, and they’re bringing those problems with us. They’re bringing drugs. They’re bringing crime. They’re rapists. And some, I assume, are good people."
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