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Subject: Ranior's Spoiler-Free SeaFall Impressions (Final Update) rss

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Ryan Feathers
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Finally updated this on March 14, 2017. Updated thoughts are found under the bolded "Final Thoughts" section below.

Hello,

I'm putting up my thoughts on SeaFall as I play through the games. I will try to update and maintain this post. This one will contain no spoilers (although if you absolutely want to know nothing you should likely still stay away as my impressions will be colored by the events I have played through).


I'm not going to be doing a run down of the rules or any of that. You can easily find rule summaries elsewhere if you want to get an idea of that stuff. I'll be trying to focus on how it makes me feel when I play, what my fellow players are enjoying, and what others may or may not like about SeaFall so you can know if you should play or not.

Finally, our group is three players, all fairly experienced gamers who play often and play a diverse range of games.

The Good Stuff

Legacy mechanics continue to be awesome in my opinion. Getting to name provinces, leaders, advisors, islands and make the game your own is awesome. While I certainly don't want every game to be a Legacy game, I certainly will be excited for more. The slow unlocking of rules and twists and turns in a storyline, the effects that carry over from game to game that add a new layer of strategy to the typical board game proceedings. There is something awesome about being able to discuss a game for many hours after it is over and throughout the week, contemplating what you will do with the newly unlocked things. I'm a full on Legacy lover. Yes, it is sad that I won't be able to play again once I'm done, but I can't complain about getting 15 games played of an awesome experience. Especially since I truly do love it I can simply buy another copy and play again. Or just wait for the next great Legacy game.

SeaFall presents many interesting options turn to turn. There is always plenty to consider. This is a fairly heavy game in my opinion, both in rules, complexity, and depth of choices.

The exploration is perhaps the most fun parts. Reading out of the Captain's book and engaging with the choose your own adventure type options is quite enjoyable. Getting to explore the unknown and find out what is there is great. In fact if anything the three of us are having issues with the fact we each want to be the ones to explore and find out more about the world--I do wonder how groups of five can work as it would seem some would have less of a chance to get to really interact with the world.

The story of SeaFall is interesting to us. We continue to want to know what is going to occur next. There are fun turns and twists, and you get the feeling your provinces and leaders are really slowly discovering the secrets of this wild world that continues to throw new and wild things at you, many of which have been foreshadowed well.

Things that are OK

The Prologue is alright...I guess. It is nice because it gives players a chance to interact with the world of SeaFall without any long terms effects outside of the sites on the islands. But because there is basically nothing on those islands, I fear it wasn't that demonstrative of a normal game, particularly with it's very low glory targets making exploring a few sites the only real choice it felt like to us.

The advisors showing up randomly is alright, but often the Forum seems filled with advisors no one really wants to spend money on. And it sometimes seems risky to buy one in case a very good one shows up for your opponent. it could be that we're just not utilizing these correctly in our strategy yet, but many turns we've gone without using or activating an advisor as none of the available ones mesh with what was wanted to do.

The game is pretty long, even for the three of us. We did learn rules at the table and played the prologue and game 1 all in the same session. It took about four and a half hours. And Game 1 was only 8 player turns which seems like it will be fairly likely as getting about one glory per turn is quite doable and with a milestone or two thrown in, this seems very possible.

The luck of endeavors can be frustrating. In the long run it should all even out, but I specifically got heavily penalized in the first game for failing an explore endeavor. I was rolling six dice and needed three success to avoid sinking. Had I passed I would have earned a milestone plus the endeavor, so I would have gotten 4 glory plus the benefit of the captain's booke entry. Instead I sank putting me a turn behind as I needed to rebuild it and sail it back out while also losing the upgrade I had built on it (to make exploring easier!). This critical roll is something that will be a constant experience in SeaFall to be sure and is something I can handle, but will admit it can be frustrating to build up a plan for a few turns and get crushed by the dice. Part of me wonders what the point of dangerous sites even is. If you have a mechanic that allows players to mitigate dice rolls, but only on the easier sites, it seems that for all the high defense sites you can't use that mitigating factor known as Fortune, yet those are the most critical rolls where you really want to be able to use Fortune. Ah well.

The fight for milestones seems critical. Perhaps there will not always be milestones to work towards, but right now it the strategy seems partially dictated as you pretty much have to go for them to remain competitive which means your strategy isn't so much yours to choose. And competition from another player can be brutal as it is all about who makes it their first. Second gets nothing. In a three player it was easy enough to aim for some other milestone, but I do worry that a five player game at least one or two players will be competing for the same milestone, and someone will be really screwed.

The ship upgrades and the buildings are cool but rarely seem to really be critical. Because the game really isn't that many turns, it feels like structures and upgrades are really more so ways to turn goods into glory rather than a path to victory. They are certainly useful, but they just didn't feel as important as I had thought or wanted.

Things I didn't like

The rules are not as clear as you'd hope they be, particularly some of the effects of the Captain's Booke entries or the new rule sticker unlocks. We weren't sure what to do with a few things and as of right now it's tough to look them up. If you're a person who wants absolute certainty you are doing things right, it may be best for you to wait until a full FAQ is compiled here and you can look up things. I will admit at least the designers had the foresight to put numbers for all the rules and captain's booke entries to make looking things up and referencing them easy, and their presence on these boards is great. Still, I've spent at least a half hour this evening making sure we knew what to do with all the new stuff that happened during the first game that wasn't as clear as I'd like it to be.

Because glory is very visible and trackable, it is easy to see who is in the lead and decide if you should raid them to hold it back. We aren't very inclined to be directly confrontational in games, but I do wonder how many times someone will be tempted to raid another to keep them from winning, even if it won't make them win. I suspect some tables will have real complaints and problems with this type of kingmaking or arguing about who should take the emnity in attacking the leader to prevent their win.

Analysis paralysis could be awful in this game. There is just so much going on between figuring out what advisor to use, where and how to funnel your goods around, and what you want to do and go for that it can be bad. We haven't experienced it much and our games are still pretty long. I would really hate to play this with someone who often took long turns as I think SeaFall could turn into a game with truly horrendous downtime issues.

Parting Thoughts

Ultimately, we had so much fun today that we've made plans to play game two (and maybe three!?) tomorrow. We can't wait to find out what is next, and we all have plans and strategies that we are excited to try out.

SeaFall seems like a good game that many groups will enjoy despite many of the early tepid reviews. It is not Pandmic Legacy and does not have the pacing or appeal of that game. But for players who enjoy some heavier games with some story and a strong theme, and are in love with the Legacy aspects of games, SeaFall should be very appealing. I think anyone who really hates luck in games will wind up hating SeaFall for those type of turns I have already endured where a single die roll resulted in a swing of 5 glory plus other effects that dramatically changed who would win the game. I think this game is for those who enjoy exploring games and seeing what will happen in addition to winning. If winning is all that matters, SeaFall probably isn't for you.

Similarly if you don't like longer games with many options, SeaFall probably isn't for you either. There may be long periods of downtime when you play this game. I personally think that you can play with 3-5 and have fun. But if you have 5 be prepared for games that probably could push 3 hours and be ready for some long downtime between turns. And be ready for some more direct conflict. At three we've mostly refrained from attacking each other as there have been plenty of other easier ways to get glory and do well. I'd expect four is pretty balanced in terms of that. I'd suspect five would see quite a bit more province raiding. Choose group size for what your group prefers in terms of player interaction.

I personally am happy we wound up going with three, although would have been happy having a fourth player I suspect. I personally probably would not like five, but I tend to dislike direct player conflict type games. For groups that don't mind and are cool with the longer play time and down times, I think you'd be fine playing with five.

In the end, this is a fun legacy game. It doesn't seem yet like it will be incredible, but I think it will be a solid game. I gave it an 8 currently and could see anywhere from 6-10 being possible still as we play through.

I intend to try to keep this updated, along with another post containing spoiler filled opinions as well. For now, I hope this has been helpful and I hope others are enjoying their SeaFall experiences!

After Game 2

Upped my rating for this game to a nine after this game. Many of my earlier complaints or stuff I wasn't really liking got a bit better due to a variety of things, but partially unlocked content I don't want to spoil. Suffice to say, the new stuff that got injected into the game helped make many of my earlier complaints vanish.

Our campaign glory sits at a remarkable 22-22-22. That's right. We're dead even through two games. First game was 11-10-9 while the next was 13-12-11. (Yes we only played to 12, but some extra glory was able to be got by some players.) I've sadly come in 2nd place in both of these games, so I don't have a game end upgrade yet. Still, upgrading ships seems to be the bigger benefit anyhow. I've upped the sail on both of my ships, while the others have upped the speed to three on their big ship and otherwise increased explore values. In a three player game like we have, exploration continues to be a big source of glory as there are many sites to go to still.

Further I will say that Game 1 had many easily accomplish-able milestones. We found that that wasn't the case for Game 2 and so some of my earlier complaints about ship upgrades and buildings were not as well founded as this time we got much more use out of them. Ship Upgrades do seem pretty much strictly better than buildings most of the time though, as those extra hit points can be vital. I in particular found the Nimble upgrade to be of great help during my last play through.

Overall this game still has us heavily engrossed and we can't wait for the next game and future unlocks. The game really seems to start opening up quickly and the game gets more interesting for that.

After Game 3

We are still having a lot of fun playing this game. There are plenty of different paths to take and things to try. I really like the options that continue to open up and really add some more depth to the gameplay.

The major concerns that I have continue to manifest though. Towards the end of this last game one player went out to do an action that would gain them three glory. They had reasonable odds of about 80% of succeeding. Given it was the final turn and they knew it, they didn't have more time to try to get themselves a better chance and they figured they had to go for it. Got unlucky and sank, and lost a glory because of it. These big swings in glory are very frustrating to take in. This game seems to want to be this big epic campaign full of meaningful strategy and decisions, yet decent to good plans can be completely derailed by luck, setting you back a lot.

The other main issue continues around the swinginess of glory, but this one is in the race for milestones. Milestones almost always grant at least 3 glory, plus glory for whatever action you took to meet the milestone requirements, plus possibly more boons from the captain's booke entry. Therefore the race to complete milestones is pretty much the only strategy, but if someone beats you out to one you were working for, you get set back a lot. It is doubly awful when you get poor luck on a raid you were trying to accomplish and sink, having your one boat require an action to repair, and losing a glory, instead of succeeding and getting tons of glory and benefits. That huge swing can be extremely frustrating and there is really no way to avoid it if you want to be competitive.

In the long arc of the campaign this probably will balance out and everyone will get screwed at times. But right now those moments can really make one wonder why they are bothering to play this game for 40 some hours the campaign requires. I continue to feel the entire idea of dangerous sites is pretty obnoxious, since the game does have mechanics whereby you can mitigate bad die rolls by spending fortune tokens, but you can never use them at the harder sites! (Given the higher difficulty sites tend to be dangerous ones). It just confuses me why that was the design choice--offering me a way to change die rolls for the easy sites where I will likely succeed anyhow doesn't help me when I actually need it the most.

We are still excited to keep playing and all have ideas for what we want to do going ahead. We continue to hit new milestones and occasionally unlock new content which continues to keep things interesting. We keep upgrading our ships in different ways which has also started to lead to some specialization each of us is hoping to take advantage of. We shall see which province can take the next game!


After Game 4

Well we continue to be very tight in overall score, now sitting at 50-49-46. The games are competitive and quite enjoyable still. We're are still continually excited to keep playing and exploring more of what this game has to offer.

However, some more concerns continue to creep in. It gets increasingly difficult to share these concerns without spoiling anything, so I shall try to do so as best as possible.

The continued addition of new rules has left us stymied at times as to exactly what we are supposed to be doing. There are specific parts where it really seems more polish was required to make things clear. I have consistently been spending time going back through the forums to find the answers. To Rob and JR's credit they do seem to be fairly responsive and are doing what they can to answer questions when they are able to. And in evidence that it is hard to communicate many of these ideas, I will admit many gamers do not make it easy by asking pretty ambiguous questions. Becq is doing great work trying to assemble a FAQ, but for those who really want a smooth experience, you may want to wait many more months until more rules questions can be ironed out and a FAQ/errata can be better compiled to help players out.

As for the actual gameplay, I am still enjoying it but am frustrated at times more than I used to be. Saying much more will get into the realm of spoilers which I had hoped to avoid here, but suffice to say the strategy for this game does not seem very open, I think the game presents many more options to you but only a very few are truly viable. It's not the great open world where you can explore and do what you want that I had hoped for and would have preferred. Instead it very much feels like a race to the very few best spots and paths, even with three players. This may turn out not to be true in the long run and we shall see, but I have my concerns.

Still looking forward to future plays though at this point. I quite like the game at this point but I think the Legacy mechanics strongly keep this one afloat and staying interesting. Beyond that I can't help but feel this game could be even better with some clearer and cleaner rules and a bit of work done to balance out some of the wild swings in glory from different actions.

FINAL THOUGHTS

We never did get around to finishing our campaign. Like many other groups we all agreed to stop playing as we just weren't having that much fun. I think we got through game 5 at one point and I never did get around to including my post game thoughts on that one as it really did sour me off of the experience. I think I was the one most clamoring for the group to move on to other better games again, but everyone largely agreed.

A few weeks ago I did open up the rest of the stuff we had never explored and spoiled the rest of the game for myself. I can only say that I am super glad we ended when we did. While there is cool stuff that does emerge later, most of my main criticisms would have easily continued to plague this game.

In the end I think there are a ton of great ideas in SeaFall. I still loved the legacy parts of the game. Looking forward to unlocking chests, adding permanent upgrades to your ships, and jointly uncovering the world map and exploring sites and revealing islands was awesome. But much of the game feels poorly balanced. There will be wild swings in glory that can't be forseen sometimes. Players can be screwed over through no fault of their own. You can have all the resources stockpiled to take a critical action and then the game just ends when you didn't think it was possible for a player to earn 8+ glory in a turn. Furthermore milestones seem to be such critical things to earn and acquire, yet poor luck in dice rolls or advisor availability can really affect your long term chances to win as well. Finally, the rules are a mess and even if you try to be as prepared as possible you will wind up in nebulous situations sometimes. There are far too many confusing sections and the game is just not streamlined well at all.

I've settled on giving the game a 5. I had some fun with my sessions still and at times think back to some of the better moments and wish I could still play and explore the world more. But then I go back to some of the frustrations this game gave me either from confusion over the rules or just flat out angry at being screwed over by the wild swings in glory. And those remind me that this game just isn't that good.

Ultimately I think most fans of finely balanced Euro games will almost assuredly get annoyed by SeaFall at some point and probably would do best to stay away. For people who are much more willing to accept wild swings in luck, or perhaps just love stories, or perhaps don't care all that strongly about score as long as you can still do cool things, SeaFall may still be an excellent gaming experience for you.

In the end I guess my only real recommendations is to really do your research on this one and read plenty of opinions. If you are at all hesitant, I'd stay away.

Finally, I think this review does a much better job of echoing my thoughts about SeaFall in a clever and better written way. In fact I wish I had written the parting thought of that review for it perfectly encapsulates my thoughts on SeaFall:

Quote:
yep this at the end of the day is just a game and for what it's worth for a majority of it I did enjoy myself. But all of that goodwill, all of those hours poured into this sours when you finally have to shrug and acknowledge it's really not all that good of one.
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Ryan Feathers
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Re: Ranior's Spoiler-Free SeaFall Impressions (Updated through Game 2)
Updated with impressions after Game 2 now. Still working on putting up a full spoiler post, so sorry for anyone looking or waiting for that one.

We're likely not going to get to play for about a week and half to two weeks now, but I simply can't wait. I'm loving this game and thinking about what I am going to do or try next throughout the week is great fun, as is talking to my fellow players about what province will reign supreme.
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Ryan Feathers
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Re: Ranior's Spoiler-Free SeaFall Impressions (Updated through Game 3)
Updated through Game 3 now. Soured a little bit from the last time, but still very much looking forward to more plays.

We should be going pretty much weekly on Wednesdays now as our DnD campaign has completed, but with Thanksgiving coming next week, it probably will be two weeks before our next play.

At some point I still intend to put up a spoiler filled thoughts section so I can go into more details about what I like and don't like about SeaFall....but I have yet to find the time. Ah well. Hoping others are enjoying their playthroughs of this game, or hoping that these and others thoughts will help make it clearer to others if they will or won't like SeaFall.
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j n
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Re: Ranior's Spoiler-Free SeaFall Impressions (Updated through Game 3)
Ranior wrote:
I continue to feel the entire idea of dangerous sites is pretty obnoxious, since the game does have mechanics whereby you can mitigate bad die rolls by spending fortune tokens, but you can never use them at the harder sites!


I'm pretty sure it's not a spoiler to note that there are advisors and upgrades (at least one of each anyway) that let you violate this rule to some degree.

(I would think that without something like the rule, that bumping fortune might prove to be OP).

Nonetheless I can understand the frustration. Hope you continue to enjoy the game.
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Ryan Feathers
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Re: Ranior's Spoiler-Free SeaFall Impressions (Updated through Game 3)
I've tried to avoid any possible spoilers, but I agree it wouldn't be bad to mention that.

Mild spoilers on an advisor who is unlocked in one of the earlier boxes:

Spoiler (click to reveal)
Specifically, I have been carrying over the guy who allows you to use up to four! fortune tokens at dangerous sites, and gives you two fortune tokens when he is your active advisor. I also wound up with "The Lucky" as my starting appellation, so I am generally swimming in fortune tokens I cannot or do not need to use.


Still, you have to get one of those advisors and actually be able to use them...and then you can only use them once per year. It is at least helpful. I do think that there is a ship upgrade that can also help allow you to use fortune at dangerous sites.

So for that specific criticism, you are correct that there are at least some things to help mitigate that. You're likely correct fortune would be too powerful without those restrictions.

Still the base problem for me and my players thus far simply is those wild swings in glory. I would have much preferred a game that didn't feature those. As is we're playing two hour games where sometimes the winner is determined by who didn't get screwed by the dice.

Still, we're enjoying it and want to keep playing. It's just one of those cases where you I feel this game could be an almost perfect game for me and my group, yet some of the mechanics are holding it back from being the game I think it could be. Such is the way of things, but I suspect many other gamers will feel this way too. It feels like there could have been some ways to help reduce the huge swings in glory that are very luck based. Either give more options to deal with poor rolling, or else make milestones not worth so much glory. As is right now, those factors taken together are holding this game back for us.


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Becq Starforged
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Re: Ranior's Spoiler-Free SeaFall Impressions (Updated through Game 3)
lactamaeon wrote:
Ranior wrote:
I continue to feel the entire idea of dangerous sites is pretty obnoxious, since the game does have mechanics whereby you can mitigate bad die rolls by spending fortune tokens, but you can never use them at the harder sites!


I'm pretty sure it's not a spoiler to note that there are advisors and upgrades (at least one of each anyway) that let you violate this rule to some degree.

Also, it's my experience that (box 2 spoiler)
Spoiler (click to reveal)
Many of the most difficult island sites are not "dangerous". None of the difficulty 10-12 sites on the six Box 2 islands are marked dangerous, though most of the lower difficulty sites are. (And, of course, all of the sea explorations are dangerous, regardless of difficulty...)

 
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Ryan Feathers
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Re: Ranior's Spoiler-Free SeaFall Impressions (Updated through Game 4)
Updated with Game 4 thoughts now.

Still enjoying this game and looking forward to more plays. But at the same time, the issues with it are getting to bother me a bit more. I hope it doesn't come to the point where we don't want to play or continue like some groups got to, but a part of me can see how that could come about.

For now I'm looking forward to playing more though and we shall see how it goes.

Also, after reviewing all the rules once again, I did realize we were making a mistake that made fortune a bit weaker than it should have been, and therefore was making luck more of a factor than it should have been--we were using fortune tokens to allow re-rolls of blank dice instead of just getting to straight out turn them into standard successes. So in that one small way the game got a little better in terms of dealing with my issues with the massive glory swings due to luck. (which are still there but can be mitigated more than I thought now)



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Becq Starforged
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Re: Ranior's Spoiler-Free SeaFall Impressions (Updated through Game 4)
Ranior wrote:
Also, after reviewing all the rules once again, I did realize we were making a mistake that made fortune a bit weaker than it should have been, and therefore was making luck more of a factor than it should have been--we were using fortune tokens to allow re-rolls of blank dice instead of just getting to straight out turn them into standard successes.

That actually makes a fairly significant difference -- not statistically, perhaps, but in terms of safety margin.

Each fortune token is like a one-shot, guaranteed success that you can use (at non-dangerous sites) to ensure that your endeavor succeeds even when the dice are against you. Each ship has another two of these (damage card slots). Each upgrade on your flagship is another one. The core game upgrade that lets you soak a damage card with your support ship is yet another. And so on. If you can build up enough of a "success reserve", you can all but guarantee success on most rolls, even with pretty bad luck. And if you happen to roll reasonably well, then you simply save the reserve for the next roll...
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Ryan Feathers
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Re: Ranior's Spoiler-Free SeaFall Impressions (Updated through Game 4)
Indeed, it is a meaningful difference. I'm glad that we are playing it correctly now as it does make some of my earlier concerns (the wild swings in glory due to luck) a bit more manageable as you have an easier way to ensure success.

It still isn't a crazy huge difference where I feel like we've ruined where we should be in the campaign or anything though which is good. All in all a relatively minor and mostly harmless rule mistake that got corrected relatively early. Still, I'm the groups rules guru for most games, so I suspect I shall hear about this for many months haha. Ah well.

My philosophy is that rules mistakes will often happen while learning games, and that's why I try to go back and reread rule books after an early game or two to try and find what I might be screwing up and reading some rule threads to see what other rules people are often getting wrong to see if I am too.

Glad to have caught it though as it does make things easier for all of us going forward. Specifically...
Spoiler (click to reveal)
it really benefits me the most honestly as I have the most fortune. I still have the Lucky appellation so I am getting extra fortune that way, and I still have an advisor that gives me two(!) fortune when he becomes my active advisor. That means I am getting three fortune tokens every year on top of my starting two. Not to mention in game three I got an advisor that let me refresh an exhausted advisor, so I got to play the two fortune guy twice each year during game three....

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Adam Strong-Morse
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Re: Ranior's Spoiler-Free SeaFall Impressions (Updated through Game 4)
If it makes you feel any better, my conclusion is that it's nearly impossible to play a Legacy game without some rules errors. Because the rules change over time, it's really easy to make mistakes--either misapplying (or forgetting) new rules, or screwing up old rules because there's new stuff coming in. I made some big errors in the Prologue, but oh well. Fortunately, the games usually re-equilibrate pretty well to past errors.
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Ryan Feathers
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Re: Ranior's Spoiler-Free SeaFall Impressions (Updated through Game 4)
ahmorse wrote:
If it makes you feel any better, my conclusion is that it's nearly impossible to play a Legacy game without some rules errors. Because the rules change over time, it's really easy to make mistakes--either misapplying (or forgetting) new rules, or screwing up old rules because there's new stuff coming in. I made some big errors in the Prologue, but oh well. Fortunately, the games usually re-equilibrate pretty well to past errors.


I strongly agree with this.

Which is why I'm not really that worried about it. I'll be very happy if the biggest rule mistake we wind up making is having Fortune tokens a little bit worse for the first three games.

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Finally got around to updating this with my final thoughts. We never did finish the campaign, instead quit after game 5. I've put up my parting thoughts after several months since our final game along with opening the rest of the chests just to see what I missed out on.
 
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Darrell Goodridge
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It's funny to see how many people went from a 9/10 in their first two games to a 5 and quit. I started at a 7, but finished the campaign. Games 9-12 were kind of a slog, but after that things got moving again. It was worth seeing to the end (maybe because I won), and I still enjoy Legacy style games.
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Ryan Feathers
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I'm sure some will have enjoyed their experience and find it to have been worth it to play through to the end. I'm glad many were able to find it fun enough to do that. I just knew I could have more fun playing other games and our group agreed.

As for legacy games I still think they have a ton of promise and am excited to see what other titles come out. I still rate Pandemic Legacy a 10 and think it is one of the greatest games ever. It is designed fantastically well.

But by comparison to SeaFall, my group almost never had issues with Pandemic Legacy rules wise. Things were much much clearer there. SeaFall was a mess with rules in my opinion (and the forums here really seem to speak to that too as the SeaFall forums are filled with rules questions from tons of players).

Pandemic Legacy was challenging for the group of us, and the game constantly put up new surprises, but things felt fair. We had a real chance almost every month, and when the game sent changes our way the game often included some new ways of dealing with them.

SeaFall by comparison doesn't seem to have those traits in my opinion. Of course it's almost impossible to judge them against each other like this as one is competitive and one cooperative, but many things in SeaFall seems quite unfair to me. They advantage a player, usually one who just got plumb lucky for being in the right situation at the right time. Or perhaps I just got supremely unlucky a few times, but there were several games and several moments where I tried my best to plan ahead and prepare and then I either had poor luck on my roll and got screwed, or the game unexpectedly ended because I didn't know someone would be capable of earning 8+ glory in one go, or some other reason. To me that speaks to a failure in the design.

I look forward to what future games may bring for Legacy mechanics though. I've even said and honestly believe that I'd buy a SeaFall 2 or Revised SeaFall is they took a lot of the feedback and tried to tidy up the game a bit. I think there is a great game lurking in the ideas here, but unfortunately it just isn't realized due to a variety of shortcomings.
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Darrell Goodridge
United States
Windsor Locks
Connecticut
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I don't want it, I don't need it, but I can't stop myself. - Stabbing Westward
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Yeah, I hear you. People (not just you) are complaining about the unexpected boosts of 8+ glory, but it honestly evens out. Our main explorer had many of those turns, and he was Prince for 4 games and finished 3rd overall, but I had zero of those turns (the unexpected kind) and I was Prince for 12 and winner of the campaign. I also only explored maybe 3-4 sites total across all the islands. So, clearly those boosts are nice in the short run, but long-term you can't count on them.
 
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Ryan Feathers
United States
Madison
Wisconsin
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Glad to here it was your experience that they balanced out in the long run.

But...

it was undeniably frustrating to have finally built up all the resources needed to build a colony only to watch the player already in the campaign lead by a nice margin get blessed with great fortune and wind up earning more glory than I thought he possibly could and I therefore got stopped from making my colony, earning the glory and long term benefit such a move would have provided.

That's just incredibly frustrating to me. That doesn't make the game fun at all. Perhaps you can say it all evens out in the end, and maybe it would have. But I didn't want to play through more games like that just to hope it would have.
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