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Subject: Are any recent editions of this more colorblind friendly? rss

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H C
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I was thinking of giving this game another chance, but I wasn't sure if the colorblind issues were improved yet.
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Josh
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I'm interested. I'm notably colorblind, and the only thing I can think of is the color choices between "gene" and "rare" (or "minerals", I can't remember) resources. Are there other issues? For colorblind friendliness, I'd give RftG an 8 out of 10.
 
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Tom Lehmann
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We have been improving our color-blind support for our newer products in the Race universe:

* Roll for the Galaxy has extra small dots to help distinguish green from brown worlds on worlds (the single most common color-blind issue), while the colored dice have markings on their production barrels as a cue.

* The soon-to-be released Jump Drive has "moons" on its worlds to help color-blind players (see the Teaser images for examples).

Because there are so many expansions, foreign versions, etc. out there, we can't easily retrofit Race, itself, to solve its color-blind issues.

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John
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I think all editions are the same. I'm not colour-blind but the colours on all cards I've seen are the same. I think the game would be playable if you couldn't tell green from brown. Most cards you can guess which it is by the name. Biohazard Mining World (brown production, green trade power) and Research Labs (green consume power) at the two cards I think if have trouble remembering when I was learning the game.
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John
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You could modify your copy too, add dots like Roll or slip a small piece of paper in the card sleeves for one colour (assuming you use sleeves which is recommend for Race).
 
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If you don't mind writing on the cards, I used a nice fine tip marker to write a small G or B for Green and Brown next to the icons that needed them.
 
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Serge Levert
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Sharpie on the sleeve.
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H C
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I had modified my Imperial Settlers physically and found I don't like experience of doing it or playing with those cards

I also don't want to be guessing colors or memorizing them since doing it took some fun out of Robinson Crusoe and Bruges.

I may look into Jump Drive or Roll - thanks Tom. My main thing was I didn't want a simpler game which JD appears. And for Roll, its mainly because I tend to prefer cards and card play and I like portability.

Anyway, it doesn't seem like it's colorblind friendly or will be for the near future, but thanks for the responses everyone.
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John
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NowOrNever88 wrote:
I also don't want to be guessing colors or memorizing them since doing it took some fun out of Robinson Crusoe and Bruges.

Have a look at http://racepics.tk and see if you can work out which ones are brown & which green. Brown is about mining for rare elements to provide fuel for the jump drive. Green is genes including the Uplift races. I reckon you could get most of the base game cards from knowing that.

Alternatively play Roll first and you'll find you know the colours of various Race cards.

Actually I may be uunderestimating the difficulty of learning the colours as I'd guess you would find it much more difficult to remember what colours things are when you can't distinguish the colours...
 
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H C
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Yeah too hard to tell. You color seers underestimate our struggle. If I could distinguish these, this thread wouldn't be here.
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John
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Rubbish. I'm guessing it's a bit like trying to learn Shogi when you don't know kanji.
 
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Glenn Chambers

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zabdiel wrote:
Rubbish. I'm guessing it's a bit like trying to learn Shogi when you don't know kanji.

Except, of course, that you can learn kanji, but I can't learn colors.

I'm also colorblind. Race is a bit tricky, and my issues with Roll are actually more severe, but I can play both without too much trouble.

VivaJava: The Coffee Game on the other hand, is unplayable for me, and Lords of Xidit only worked once I realized that the problematic colors always appear next to each other, so I can compare them to choose the right one.

I experienced the reverse situation recently. Tiny Epic Western has two meeple colors that are hard for those with typical color vision to distinguish, but they were clearly different to me.
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rain
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I wonder if playing it on the computer would help. Is it possible to play around with screen colour settings to make the differences noticeable?

The program can be downloaded from here: http://www.keldon.net/rftg/
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John
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spambait42c wrote:

Except, of course, that you can learn kanji, but I can't learn colors.

Of course, but you can learn what colours the Race cards are which is what I meant. If Shogi pieces where different colour or hand something familiar on them like bugs (Hive style) then I think I could learn Shogi easily. As it is I could probably learn it in an afternoon. If a new race expansion was printed in monochrome then I think I could learn what colours all the cards were in a similar time frame. Unlike Shogi I'm sure if put the effort in as I know I love RftG so would enjoy playing it.
 
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Scott Russell
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Another color blind gamer here.

I have no problems marking my games when I can't tell the difference. Typically, the green pieces have some Sharpie marks. (Although, Saturday, we played Lewis and Clark and the red ones had the marks.)

It would be really easy to just put a sharpie dot in the middle of all the green worlds (after someone showed you which they were) and your problems are solved.

Since it's my favorite game, I urge you to try it!


That being said, I haven't needed to mark RftG. I tell red from green by the world names and there are three or four that are ambiguous that I've just memorized. And, when in doubt, I just show the card to a fellow player and confirm.

In Roll, the green worlds are marked and the production side of the colored dice have different icons. It can be a little difficult to tell from across the table what color an opponent has, but easy to see the mark(s) on your own tableau.

Edit: to the OQ, newer versions seem to be slightly different in color than older ones, but no easier to distinguish brown/green for me.



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zabdiel wrote:
Rubbish. I'm guessing it's a bit like trying to learn Shogi when you don't know kanji.


Then you guess wrong. 0 VP for you.

Try playing Shogi where all the characters are marked the same but retain their original movements and tell me how it works out.
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zabdiel wrote:
spambait42c wrote:

Except, of course, that you can learn kanji, but I can't learn colors.

Of course, but you can learn what colours the Race cards are which is what I meant. If Shogi pieces where different colour or hand something familiar on them like bugs (Hive style) then I think I could learn Shogi easily. As it is I could probably learn it in an afternoon. If a new race expansion was printed in monochrome then I think I could learn what colours all the cards were in a similar time frame. Unlike Shogi I'm sure if put the effort in as I know I love RftG so would enjoy playing it.


Right. And all colorblind players would have so much fun memorizing the cards and colors and it wouldn't detract from the experience or joy of the game at all. /S
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Derry Salewski
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If you don't want to play enough that the cards will be memorized anyway, it's not a game you should really want in the first place. So don't worry!
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scifiantihero wrote:
If you don't want to play enough that the cards will be memorized anyway, it's not a game you should really want in the first place. So don't worry!


Isn't it usually the reverse? People who play like the game so much they end up memorizing cards anyway.

People who can't enjoy playing will never get to that stage.

I also question your insinuation that players who don't memorize the cards don't derive any pleasure from the game.
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Francisco Gutierrez
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Jeez, can you imagine someone saying the same dismissive things about a different eye condition?

"Hi, I was wondering if there are any plans for a larger print edition of this game. I've lost some of the vision in one of my eyes due to degenerative glaucoma."

Playing the game requires sight, learn to see better before playing

Memorize all the cards before you totally lose your vision

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John
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NowOrNever88 wrote:
Right. And all colorblind players would have so much fun memorizing the cards and colors and it wouldn't detract from the experience or joy of the game at all. /S

Sorry, I missed some stuff like the following:

Yes, I doubt I would have bothered letting Race if I was colour-blind which was the point in my Shogi comparison - I haven't learnt it yet and I may not bother. I don't enjoy things like memorising cards but it happens when I play a game.
 
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John
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joetaco wrote:

Memorize all the cards before you totally lose your vision


No, I don't think anyone is trying to be dismissive, just listing the possible solutions. If I was losing my vision it would severely limit the games I could learn which rubbish but there's not much anyone on BGG could do about that.
 
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John
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Rainstar wrote:
I wonder if playing it on the computer would help. Is it possible to play around with screen colour settings to make the differences noticeable?

The program can be downloaded from here: http://www.keldon.net/rftg/


It's possible to override the default images for each card but I've never tried it. See here: Re: Race for the Galaxy AI patch
 
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Besides marking the cards, another suggestion is to print up a crib sheet. There are other files with other expansions, but one of them with TGS is here....
https://www.boardgamegeek.com/filepage/38139/complete-card-r...

It's just a spreadsheet, so reformat it to suit your needs, fit it on fewer pages, etc. The Roll-pics site has all of the cards via their actual images, but of course that doesn't help if you're color blind, whereas these spreadsheets will (or should) list out the goods and type of world (military or non-mili) in plain text.


entranced wrote:
Sharpie on the sleeve.

soblue this can't be good.... doesn't sharpie on plastic wear/smudge off anyways? Especially during the course of shuffling and fanning out cards in hand?

Although it may be "sacrilegious", I would opt to write on the card itself. I've seen somebody do this for the cards for Taj Mahal... 'g' for green, 'b' for blue, etc.


spambait42c wrote:
zabdiel wrote:
Rubbish. I'm guessing it's a bit like trying to learn Shogi when you don't know kanji.

Except, of course, that you can learn kanji, but I can't learn colors.

I'm also colorblind. Race is a bit tricky, and my issues with Roll are actually more severe, but I can play both without too much trouble.

VivaJava: The Coffee Game on the other hand, is unplayable for me, and Lords of Xidit only worked once I realized that the problematic colors always appear next to each other, so I can compare them to choose the right one.

I experienced the reverse situation recently. Tiny Epic Western has two meeple colors that are hard for those with typical color vision to distinguish, but they were clearly different to me.
I wasn't in that game, but a fellow gamer did express his frustration in trying to teach Race to a color blind newbie, as it was difficult for him to identify cards. And not to get anybody wrong, it was also frustrating for that newbie to the game too.


I suppose they could've added icons for the goods, and I recall responding to a poster who solicited suggestions on another thread (NOT related to color blindness interestingly enough) with...
Novelty = t-shirts... (was going to do cell phones and electronics, but I honestly couldn't see Primitive Rebel Race being able to pull off electronics!)
Rare Elemental = large, brown rock (like what you see on the card art with asteroids)
Genes = DNA chromosome
Alien Tech = Alien head (like the Alienware logo)

However, I'm sure this would've added complexity to the graphic designs and printing, which would explain why this feature was passed up on.
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Serge Levert
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ackmondual wrote:
entranced wrote:
Sharpie on the sleeve.

:soblue: this can't be good.... doesn't sharpie on plastic wear/smudge off anyways? Especially during the course of shuffling and fanning out cards in hand?

Sharpie = permanent marker. You must be thinking of dry erase markers. If i were a color blind Race player, my sleeves would absolutely be marked with sharpies. 5 minute solution and you're set for life.
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