Recommend
 
 Thumb up
 Hide
7 Posts

Ashes: Rise of the Phoenixborn» Forums » Rules

Subject: Sympathy Pain when you die rss

Your Tags: Add tags
Popular Tags: [View All]
Dizdi
Greece
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
My opponent attacks my Phoenixborn and I will lose my last hitpoint.
Can I use Sympathy Pain (when your Phoenixborn takes damage, deal 3 damage to a unit or Phoenixborn) to also kill my opponent who has only 3 hitpoints left?
Who wins in this situation?

Thanks in advance!
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Scott Hill
United Kingdom
Cambridge
Cambridgeshire
flag msg tools
designer
badge
mbmbmbmbmb
Yes. And you win.

The reason for this is that dealing damage and the placement of wounds are two separate and distinct steps in the damage and destruction resolution process, and because Sympathy Pain responds to the damage being dealt and must be fully resolved before moving on.
7 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Samuel Favre
Switzerland
Sion
Valais
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Also remark that your opponent can answer with his own Sympathy Pain and win the game :D
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Daniel Melchert
Germany
Schleswig-Holstein
flag msg tools
In the version of ashes i play Sympathy Pain reads "You can play this card >after< your Phoenixborn has received damage.[...]"

The FAQ describes when effects get resolved that trigger when something takes damage.
Quote:
Step 1: A unit or Phoenixborn receives damage
Step 1b: Effects that trigger >on< receiving damage
happen now.
Step 2: Place wound tokens on the unit or
Phoenixborn equal to the damage that they have
received,[...]
Step 2b: Effects that trigger on a unit’s destruction or
a Phoenixborn's destruction happen now.


If you are strict you can not use the Rule 1b because it does not have the exact same wording and talks about simultaneous effects.
Sympathy Pain is explicitly worded to be playable after you already received the damage so you have to survive in order to do so.

Obviously you may have another opinion but they promised an updated version of the timing rules for the next expansion and we will probably be able to see what the intention was.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Scott Hill
United Kingdom
Cambridge
Cambridgeshire
flag msg tools
designer
badge
mbmbmbmbmb
Cornos804 wrote:
In the version of ashes i play Sympathy Pain reads "You can play this card >after< your Phoenixborn has received damage.[...]"

The FAQ describes when effects get resolved that trigger when something takes damage.
Quote:
Step 1: A unit or Phoenixborn receives damage
Step 1b: Effects that trigger >on< receiving damage
happen now.
Step 2: Place wound tokens on the unit or
Phoenixborn equal to the damage that they have
received,[...]
Step 2b: Effects that trigger on a unit’s destruction or
a Phoenixborn's destruction happen now.


If you are strict you can not use the Rule 1b because it does not have the exact same wording and talks about simultaneous effects.
Sympathy Pain is explicitly worded to be playable after you already received the damage so you have to survive in order to do so.

Obviously you may have another opinion but they promised an updated version of the timing rules for the next expansion and we will probably be able to see what the intention was.

You're splitting a semantic hair and concluding a difference that does not in fact exist.

1b is, in fact, the point at which "...after your Phoenixborn has received damage..." effects trigger.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Daniel Melchert
Germany
Schleswig-Holstein
flag msg tools
I'm aware that it is very pedantic to read it that way.
There are other cards though that call out events after something else.
An example is the Ice trap card :
You may play this after a unit [...] comes into play.

Obviously here it does matter that it specifically reads >after< which implies that units that come into play can use abilities like ambush (that read ">When< this comes into play[...]").

Also cards that do not use this phrasing have another dynamic :
Nightshade swallow & Frostback bear

Both have a ">when< this deals damage [...]" ability and if the active player is attacking a nightshade with a bear he may chose to use 'freeze 1' before 'deathstrike' resolves because they happen 'at the same time' and there is a rule for this in the rulebook. The nightshade then gets exhausted and can not use 'deathstrike' anymore.


I hope you can see where i'm coming from.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Nicola Pertici
Italy
Certaldo
Firenze
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
this is going to be clarified soon in the next FAQ/update
with the actual ruling Nightshade Swallow is really a shitty unit
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Front Page | Welcome | Contact | Privacy Policy | Terms of Service | Advertise | Support BGG | Feeds RSS
Geekdo, BoardGameGeek, the Geekdo logo, and the BoardGameGeek logo are trademarks of BoardGameGeek, LLC.