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Mistfall: Heart of the Mists» Forums » General

Subject: Should I start with this or the original? rss

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Ben Hirsh
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Hi all

I know many people would probably not have had the chance to play this yet, though copies were being sold at Essen. It was here I had (a pretty bad) demonstration of the mechanics and decided not to purchase.

More recently I have gotten into Adventure Card Games, I liked the idea of Pathfinder but am quite let down in how it facilitates cooperation.

There are many comparisons between Pathfinder, the original Mistfall game and Shadowrun: Crossfire and it seems like Mistfall will be more my type of game.

The question is: do I grab a very reasonably priced copy of Mistfall now or wait for this standalone? Does Hearts of the Mists address any of the common drawn up issues others have found with the original (lack of character progression, low level of difficulty)?

Thanks in advance!

B
 
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Jonathan Rowe
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I don't think Heart of the Mist addresses character progression, though there is a Valskyrr Campaign expansion for Original Mistfall that adds rules for that.

As for low level of difficulty, I'm not sure that's a commonly leveled accusation. Original Mistfall is scaled in lots of different ways (double sided character boards with a more difficult set of stats on the back, double sided Quest board which is also more difficult on the back).

I've used the PnP Heart of the Mists rules and characters and they're certainly more complicated to use. If by "low level of difficulty" you mean difficulty to _use_, then Heart of the Mists is more demanding (but probably more rewarding thereby).

Otherwise I'd say jump in the Original Mistfall
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Stephen Zipprich
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I'm a Kickstarter backer, and I backed for the original as well as Heart of the Mists. I'll be playing the original first.

That said, it's certainly not required. HotM is a standalone after all, so it shouldn't make a difference. You could always pick up the original later if you like the expansion enough.
 
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Joke Meister
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ben2000677 wrote:
I know many people would probably not have had the chance to play this yet, though copies were being sold at Essen. It was here I had (a pretty bad) demonstration of the mechanics and decided not to purchase.


What about the demonstration was bad? I'm wondering what went wrong and whether that might impact whether you like the game.

ben2000677 wrote:
The question is: do I grab a very reasonably priced copy of Mistfall now or wait for this standalone? Does Hearts of the Mists address any of the common drawn up issues others have found with the original (lack of character progression, low level of difficulty)?


Jonathan already covered this one really well (and for what it's worth - I also very rarely hear people complain that the game is too easy). However, re the Valskyrr campaign system, while I've never used it, I have heard that it feels tacked on. If you're looking for character progression, I don't think this game will fully satisfy that particular itch.
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Chris Sanderson
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I started with this then added the original into it. Not sure if that made much difference to the over all experience, biggest change that i see is the time cards are replaced with a time board in this version.

Ease of play...there are a whole host of eays to make the game harder, not an issue I am seeing

 
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Ben Hirsh
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Jokemeister wrote:


What about the demonstration was bad? I'm wondering what went wrong and whether that might impact whether you like the game.


I believe the demonstrator was in a rush to get somewhere and didn't try to calm my response at the daunting amount of text on the cards. I'm not adverse to complex games, I actually quite prefer them. At the time though, I just felt I had other things to see and knew I had Pathfinder ACG on the way so would rather wait to see if I like adventure card games first.

Jokemeister wrote:

Jonathan already covered this one really well (and for what it's worth - I also very rarely hear people complain that the game is too easy). However, re the Valskyrr campaign system, while I've never used it, I have heard that it feels tacked on. If you're looking for character progression, I don't think this game will fully satisfy that particular itch.


Character progression between games is less important, though I do like the idea of progression during the game. Like in Mage Knight, how you develop your skills and deck of cards. Does Mistfall have nothing like this?
 
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Derek Long
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A crucial element of Mistfall (and of HotM) is that characters have a deck of advanced feats that may be purchased and added (to the hand, in fact) using "experience points" earned during the game. So, yes, there is character progression (and it is absolutely necessary to find the right combos to advance characters in order to win) during a game.

There is no *between games* progression - characters reset to play the next scenario - unless you use the Valskyrr campaign. Because in-game advancement is really at the core of what you have to achieve to win the game, it is hard to make between-game advancement work well - each scenario is built, by default, assuming the players will start at base level (just as every Mage Knights game starts with all players having their basic deck). If players start more advanced, then the scenario must either be scaled up in difficulty, or else the players will find it unsatisfyingly easy. So, even with the campaign, characters largely reset - there is a small saved advancement and scenarios scale with a few more unpleasant foes to try to balance this. I enjoy the campaign, but very happily play single scenarios and accept that characters reset each game.
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Ben Hirsh
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Thank you all. I've decided to go for the original game first as it's very available and reasonably priced atm
 
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ben2000677 wrote:
Thank you all. I've decided to go for the original game first as it's very available and reasonably priced atm


Someone can jump in and correct me here if I'm wrong, but I'm pretty sure there were changes/updates/errata that were part of the 1st game reprint as part of the Heart of the Mists KS. I don't know what owners of the original first game can do to address those changes, assuming a retail purchase. I didn't see anything mentioned here, but maybe I'm missing something.
 
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Ben Hirsh
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Phantom Load wrote:
ben2000677 wrote:
Thank you all. I've decided to go for the original game first as it's very available and reasonably priced atm


Someone can jump in and correct me here if I'm wrong, but I'm pretty sure there were changes/updates/errata that were part of the 1st game reprint as part of the Heart of the Mists KS. I don't know what owners of the original first game can do to address those changes, assuming a retail purchase. I didn't see anything mentioned here, but maybe I'm missing something.


This is actually something I've been trying to find more info on too, if anyone could shed some more light on this would be great!
 
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Even if you buy the current version of Mistfall, you should download the rulebook to Heart of the Mists and learn from there. The original rulebook left much to be desired. Also check NKSN's website for the errata.

Errata correction and new rulebook comes in the reprint.
 
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Ben Hirsh
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Logus Vile wrote:
Even if you buy the current version of Mistfall, you should download the rulebook to Heart of the Mists and learn from there. The original rulebook left much to be desired. Also check NKSN's website for the errata.

Errata correction and new rulebook comes in the reprint.


Reprint of the original? Is it not worth getting a kickstarter version then?
 
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During the Kickstarter for Heart of the Mists, they also reprinted the first box Mistfall. That Mistfall box includes a new rulebook and the errata corrected.
 
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Ben Hirsh
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what about the kickstarter version of the original? should that be avoided?
 
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ben2000677 wrote:
what about the kickstarter version of the original? should that be avoided?


Not at all. The Heart of the Mists standalone game comes with the corrected cards for the first box. So if you buy the Heart of the Mists you can substitute the cards and use the rulebook from the new one.

If you don't plan on getting HotM, then you can print the errata from their website (or just correct the cards with a fine pen) and download the new rulebook as well.
 
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A. B.
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I can also recommend Valskyrr expansion, it allows character progression between games and it works really well in my opinion.

I really like this system, I have all the stuff that has been released so far,it gives a lot of replayability with 60 types of basic monsters, corresponding 60 lieutenants (elite enemies), special enemies (bossess) and other stuff.HotM introduced more diversified loot, better rulebook and ally companions. The number of card combinations is mindblowing.
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