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Subject: Grand Tour: slipstream and exhaustion rss

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Benji
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I understand that there is no slipstreaming for riders who have crossed the finish line. How about exhaustion? Do they still get a card after having finished the race?

Can a rider cross the finish line due to slipstreaming?

 
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Asger Harding Granerud
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No exhaustion.

No slipstreaming.

Asger
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Viktor Karlsson Mantel
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I would love a rule ecplination video on the grand tour. Dident really get hiw the points work do you score each biker or togheter? What does this mean? "● Top 1/2/3 for the General Classification also earns 3/2/1 TP after the last stage in the Tour is over.
" is this after the kadt race pr between each race!?
 
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Benji
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You score each biker (which means finishing each race with every biker) and record each time difference to the leading rider, keeping the individual times from race to race. 3/2/1 are the final scores awarded for this general classificarion based on the final times, just like for every individual race.

So in a tour of 6 races, you would have 7 x 3/2/1
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Benji
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AsgerSG wrote:
No exhaustion.

No slipstreaming.

Asger


Thanks a lot!
 
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Asger Harding Granerud
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Benji's answer is spot on.

Does it clarify it for you?

Asger
 
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Benji
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One more question: if an AI rider runs out of cards, i guess you just re-shuffle his deck?
 
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Asger Harding Granerud
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Yes. Hasn't happened yet to me, but I'll add it to the rules!

Asger
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AsgerSG wrote:
Yes. Hasn't happened yet to me, but I'll add it to the rules!

Asger


Thanks! It just did to me
(and it is more likely than with player controlled teams because the AI will sometimes burn "9s" on a mountain).

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Asger Harding Granerud
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Indeed. I'm just surprised it took you more than 15 turns to finish

But I will add it!

Asger
 
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AsgerSG wrote:
Indeed. I'm just surprised it took you more than 15 turns to finish

But I will add it!

Asger


I never said i was any good at it

But to be honest, it was the third race in my first grand tour, and things are starting to get REALLY hard...
 
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Asger Harding Granerud
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I should add! These AI solo rules have not been tested more than a few times by yours truly, and certainly not in a Grand Tour setting

Asger
 
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AsgerSG wrote:
I should add! These AI solo rules have not been tested more than a few times by yours truly, and certainly not in a Grand Tour setting

Asger


NOW he is telling me that ...

I think in a Grand Tour setting, the AI riders would need some exhaustion too. Maybe add exhaustion depending on the final standing after each race (to the AI riders only)?

1st/2nd place: 1 exhaustion
3rd/4th place: 2 exhaustion
5th/6th place: 3 exhaustion

something like that...
 
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Asger Harding Granerud
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Would it work to 'simply' allow the player to still discard half his exhaustion at the end?

Keeping an easy 'safe game state' would also be a priority to me. For solo gamers that want to do a 21 stage tour for example

Asger
 
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AsgerSG wrote:
Would it work to 'simply' allow the player to still discard half his exhaustion at the end?

Keeping an easy 'safe game state' would also be a priority to me. For solo gamers that want to do a 21 stage tour for example

Asger


I think it would probably work. On the other hand, from a thematic standpoint, seeing the other riders getting tired too has kind of an uplifting effect.
 
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Asger Harding Granerud
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Good point!
 
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Benji
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I will gladly give it a try. It might even need both.

Without discarding "something", exhaustion cards will tend to stay (and amass) in the player decks (if the player wants to keep up with the AI), while the AI will play most of theirs (slowing it down slightly, but getting rid of the few exhaustion cards).

I see your point of not adding to bookkeeping for "saved games". So i think the AI exhaustion should instead be tied to the overall standings (which need to be kept up to date anyway).

I will try the following:

Human riders start with X exhaustion, split over both riders (X min 3, but probably at least 2+2)

After a race:

AI riders lose all remaining exhaustion from their deck (if there is any), then...

- AI riders in 1st or 2nd overall place get 1 exhaustion for the next race.
- AI riders in 3rd and 4th overall place get 2 exhaustion for the next race.
- AI riders in 5th and 6th overall place get 3 exhaustion for the next race.

Ties will all get the lower exhaustion.

Player controlled riders lose half (rounded down) their exhaustion (normal rules).

Edit: See thread "Grand Tour for Solo plays" for the latest version.
 
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Viktor Karlsson Mantel
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Benji68 wrote:
You score each biker (which means finishing each race with every biker) and record each time difference to the leading rider, keeping the individual times from race to race. 3/2/1 are the final scores awarded for this general classificarion based on the final times, just like for every individual race.

So in a tour of 6 races, you would have 7 x 3/2/1

Hmm what? Why give more points isent the winner already determind after the 6 races? Why need to give the top 3 an extra set of points?
The top 3 who have most points after 6 races get extra ponta after all reces will not change the standings?
 
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Tolchock wrote:
Benji68 wrote:
You score each biker (which means finishing each race with every biker) and record each time difference to the leading rider, keeping the individual times from race to race. 3/2/1 are the final scores awarded for this general classificarion based on the final times, just like for every individual race.

So in a tour of 6 races, you would have 7 x 3/2/1

Hmm what? Why give more points isent the winner already determind after the 6 races? Why need to give the top 3 an extra set of points?
The top 3 who have most points after 6 races get extra ponta after all reces will not change the standings?


Take a look at the Grand Tour rules. You don't add additional points for the already earned points, instead you earn additional points for faster riders, independend of their classifications (the grand tour rules take time differences into consideration). A win always gives 3 points, but there is a difference in winning by a photo finish or by a huge advantage. The final classification takes that into account. You may be a lot faster overall if you won just one race by a mile compared to another driver who won two very tight races.

Why don't you just do what the rules describe and you will see the difference.
 
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Ryan Keane
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AsgerSG wrote:
No exhaustion.

No slipstreaming.

Asger


To clarify, do cyclists on the space immediately past the finish line provide slipstream to cyclists 2 spaces before the finish (the space immediately before the finish line being empty)?

It just feels weird for slipstreaming to suddenly disappear because the cyclist in front of you just barely crossed the line.

As is, the official ruling means you remove finished cyclists between the 2nd and 3rd phases. Personally, I feel it's simpler to rule the opposite. You finish the 3rd phase for all cyclists, and then remove finished cyclists. In other words, apply slipstreaming to all cyclists, including gaps between cyclists that are past the finish, and take exhaustion even if you have crossed the finish and have an empty space in front. That effort to sprint across the line without a draft should cost exhaustion. Note all this only matters for Tours.
 
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