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Sentinels of the Multiverse» Forums » Variants

Subject: Hero to Villain Conversion - Ra rss

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Kevin Dexter
United States
Minnesota
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Some background: I have been a member here for a long time, but I haven't really been an active member. I never felt I could contribute much since I don't get many chances to play this game. I have certainly played with a number of other members creations, but never desired to put my own ideas up to public scrutiny. I love many of the Villain turned Hero variants people have shared, but I have been longing to see some Hero turned Villain ideas and see what kind of mechanic people use for that. After hoping for a long time, I realized I should just do it myself! So at long last, here is my first (still very) rough draft of Ra. If this starts to take off and look good, I will certainly make them into cards (using art form SotM because I can't pictures) so that people can have better print'n'play or Printer Studio them, and I will continue onto other ideas I have (which are currently AZ, Setback, Fanatic, and Sky-Scraper, but I want to for ALL heroes that haven’t converted already).

NOTE: I have playtested him, but he was way too simple, so I juiced him up a ton and haven't playtested him since. Intend to tonight/tomorrow, but I wanted to get him out sooner than later and get opinions from the pros on how I can better balance him.




Eye of Ra (75 HP)
Bringer of the Sun (V2)
Setup:
- Put Eye of Ra into play Bringer of the Sun side up.
- Search the Villain Deck for Staff of Ra and Solar Retribution and put them into play.
Gameplay:
- At the start of the Villain turn, if there are H cards under Solar Retribution, flip Eye of Ra
- Whenever Eye of Ra would be dealt Fire damage, he heals that much damage instead.
- At the end of the Villain turn, put the top card of the villain deck under Solar Retribution
Advanced:
- At the end of the Villain turn, Eye of Ra deals himself 1 Fire Damage

Eye of Ra (75 HP)
Flame Charged Deity (V2)
Gameplay:
- At the start of the Villain turn, if Eye of Ra did not flip this turn, flip Eye of Ra.
- Hero targets can not be immune to Fire Damage.
- Eye of Ra is immune to Fire Damage.
- At the end of the Villain turn, Eye of Ra deals himself X psychic damage, where X is the number of cards under Solar Retribution.
Advanced:
- At the end of the villain turn, Eye of Ra deals each Hero target 1 Fire damage.




Staff of Ra (Relic, 12 HP, x1) (V2):
Increase all Fire Damage by 1.
At the end of the Villain Turn, Staff of Ra deals Eye of Ra and the hero target with the highest HP 1 Fire Damage.

Solar Retribution (Ongoing, x1) (V2):
Solar Retribution is Indestructible.
Card under Solar Retribution are considered not to be in play.
Increase damage dealt by Ra by X, where X is the half number of cards under Solar Retribution rounded up.

Invoke Staff (One-Shot, x2) (V2):
If Staff of Ra is in play, Restore it to full health and play the top card of the Villain Deck.
If Staff of Ra is not in play, Destroy one equipment card. Search the Villain Deck and Trash for Staff of Ra and put it into play. Shuffle the Villain Deck.

Full Charge (One-Shot, x2) (V2):
Flip Eye of Ra to his Flame Charged Deity side.
Place cards from the top of the Villain deck under Solar Retribution until there are H cards beneath it.

Headlong into Fire (One-Shot, x3) (V2):
Each Hero may deal themselves 2 Fire damage and 2 Psychic damage.
Shuffle X cards from under Solar Retribution into the Villain deck, where X is the number of heroes that took damage in this way.

Hellscape (One-Shot, x2) (V2):
Destroy all environment cards. Eye of Ra deals each target X fire damage, where X is the number of environment cards destroyed this way.

Consuming Flames (Ongoing, x2) (V2):
When this card comes into play, play the top card of the Villain Deck.
Whenever a non-villain target enters play, Eye of Ra deals it 1 Fire damage

Wrath Unleashed (One-Shot, x3) (V2):
Eye of Ra deals the Hero target with the lowest HP H-2 damage.
Eye of Ra deals the Hero target with the second lowest HP H-1 damage.
Eye of Ra deals himself 1 fire damage.

World on Fire (Ongoing, x2):
At the start of each Hero’s turn, World on Fire deals them 1 fire damage.
At the Start of the Villain Turn, World on Fire deals Eye of Ra 2 fire damage.

Incinerating Curtain (Ongoing, x2) (V2):
The first time Eye of Ra would be dealt damage by a non-villain target each turn, that target deals themselves 1 Psychic and 1 Fire damage.
If the target is destroyed, Eye of Ra takes no damage.

Burned to Ash (One-Shot, x2):
Eye of Ra deals the Hero target with the Highest HP H fire damage.
Destroy an Ongoing and Equipment card that player controls.
Destroy an Ongoing or Equipment card that player controls.
If less than two cards were destroyed in this way, that player discards two cards.

Explosive Blast (One-Shot, x2) (V2):
Eye of Ra deals the Hero Target with the Highest HP H-1 Fire Damage.
Eye of Ra deals each other Target H-3 Fire Damage.
Place the top card of the Villain Deck under Solar Retribution.

Concentrated Flames (One-Shot, x1):
Ra deals the Hero with the most Ongoing cards in play H+2 fire damage.


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Dennison Milenkaya
United States
Washington
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I'm pretty sure the right way to face this deck is by never putting Ongoing or Equipment card in play.

It's a bad idea to state that cards under Solar Retribution are Indestructible. Since they are not in play, there's nothing going to destroy them anyway.

You should offer a manner in which to track the damage bonus that you're talking about on the character card. There's really no way for Ra to get a + (H) damage bonus. When he would be dealt fire damage and heals instead, he gets a + 1 damage bonus. Over time, he may have (H) instances of + 1 damage, but it isn't technically the same.

I propose that he puts a card under Solar Retribution and his front side says to increase his damage dealt by X, where X = the number of cards under Solar Retribution. At the start of his turn, he flips if (H) or more cards are under it. Reference the cards under Solar Flare instead of a theoretical damage bonus.

Either way, your auto lose condition is ill-advised.
 
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Michael Hunter
New Zealand
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FlatOnHisFace wrote:
I'm pretty sure the right way to face this deck is by never putting Ongoing or Equipment card in play.

It's a bad idea to state that cards under Solar Retribution are Indestructible. Since they are not in play, there's nothing going to destroy them anyway.

You should offer a manner in which to track the damage bonus that you're talking about on the character card. There's really no way for Ra to get a + (H) damage bonus. When he would be dealt fire damage and heals instead, he gets a + 1 damage bonus. Over time, he may have (H) instances of + 1 damage, but it isn't technically the same.

I propose that he puts a card under Solar Retribution and his front side says to increase his damage dealt by X, where X = the number of cards under Solar Retribution. At the start of his turn, he flips if (H) or more cards are under it. Reference the cards under Solar Flare instead of a theoretical damage bonus.

Either way, your auto lose condition is ill-advised.


I would support all this advice! The game being about Ra charging himself into a giant ball of damage-boosting fiery death is cool and logical (kind of like Chokepoint in a way, but quite a different feel), but the execution of having to keep track of bonuses from Full Charge/Bringer of the Sun in your head rather than with any on-board reminder (as well as damage reduction from World on Fire?) would get tricky, even more so when you add other bonuses from environments and such into the mix.

Putting the cards under Solar Retribution would make him charge up to kill everyone in a more natural way than just everyone suddenly dies for no particular reason, instead ramping up his offense to the point where everyone gets burned to a crisp. By contrast, it seems like the current effect could potentially ramp up VERY fast with a bad draw - imagine an H=3 game, turn 1 he plays Gamma Burst, turn 2 he plays Invoke staff, that plus Staff of Ra itself puts another 2, we're 1 off losing! Admittedly, destroy the staff helps a little, but that's a pretty low threshold. I can see in tight games Gamma-Ray Burst just being a "You suddenly lose". At least things like Forced Deployment, Prisonbreak or Raiding Party just give you really horrible turns it's hard to bounce back from, this is just a straight "Sorry guys, no clever tricks to try and fight your way, pack up your cards and stop having fun".

There's a good idea here with putting the cards under retribution, and the interesting ways you have to drag them back out (Headlong into fire especially), but I'm not sure if having the core mechanic being him ramping up to quite a low ceiling where everyone just dies no questions asked is not it. Merge it with the boosting of his own power (as heroic Ra so loves to do) as the main ramp up mechanism and it could be very interesting!
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Geoff B.
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I agree with the above posters, this deck has a lot of potential.

Also agree that the auto lose doesn't really fit, nor does a destruction heavy theme fit Ra very well.

Lastly the amount of text on each card needs to be watched, or it gets hard to process the card.

I like the flip mechanic based on damage boosts, that feels cool. I wonder if it should be like a tide going in and out, or like he builds up and then burns out and has to recover.

More thoughts later.
 
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Kevin Dexter
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Minnesota
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Wow! Thank you to all of you! I didn't think I would get a response so fast.

So:
- Do away with Solar Retribution (at least as an instant lose scenario), probably something like FlatOnHisFace recommended)
- Less text heavy cards
- Different way to measure power up (again, FlatOnHisFace's idea)
- Less destruction overall.

I want to make this a villain that may be similar to others, but is still distinct (not too similar to Chokepoint).

What would people think of having cards from his deck go under Solar Retribution, and once he flips he plays one of those cards at the start of the villain turn? I pondered that but doing so feels like this would become a one-shot deck. Along the same vein I thought about making so that one card is played each hero turn. He'd be hero-powered on his normal side, but could unleash a torrent of damage once every few turns, then go back to his hero-leveled power.

Or I could stick to it's current vein, just less destruction and more focus on defeating a charging fireball, which could involve a handful more ongoings. I'm not sure which would be better. I have ideas for how to implement both, but they both go in very different directions, though both will have him flipping based on his damage output.

 
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Dennison Milenkaya
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Just because you play an extra card per turn doesn't mean it's One-Shot heavy. Consider Omnitron. It plays 2 cards per turn and only has a few One-Shots. Mostly Components and Devices.

If you do play a card per hero turn, each card must be really weak individually, because that's (H) + 1 cards per round!

Regarding heavy destruction, Citizen Dawn is thought to be extremely destructive, but she only has 2 full destruction cards, Autumn (who misses a lot), and Sweat (who is easy to blow off). When half the cards in the deck break something and further punish the heroes (deals damage when destroying cards or keeps said destroyed card for bonus), you'd prefer to not put them into play. They're likely taken before doing any good and actively work against you.

I think you'll find the right groove in time.
 
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Kevin Dexter
United States
Minnesota
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I updated this to look more the path I intend to take now, but I realize I may need to spend more time before I ask for feedback. I started reading the Tips for Playtesting Customs forum page which I never looked at before (since I never intended to try my hand), and think I should be honing this a bit more before I try to "officialize" it. Played a couple games and I like the feel it's making, but it's definitely a little rough still. There are a few cards I really like the feel of, and some I don't. I want to be at the point where each one feels really like it has it's own cozy home, right next to the happy trees, slowly burning.

I do have one question though. Right now, if you have 0 ongoing destruction, you stand nearly no chance unless you have decent healing to offset the damage from World on Fire and Incinerating Curtain (I made it for a while, but I couldn't do almost any damage). Is that something I should avoid? Or is it something that can be permitted?
 
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Seamus Butler
Ireland
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Viken Xetred wrote:
I do have one question though. Right now, if you have 0 ongoing destruction, you stand nearly no chance unless you have decent healing to offset the damage from World on Fire and Incinerating Curtain (I made it for a while, but I couldn't do almost any damage). Is that something I should avoid? Or is it something that can be permitted?


Of course it can be permitted, there's no reason why healer decks shouldn't get their chance to shine against a villain deck or two.
If every villain was a simple damage numbers run to the end the game would be boring, one of the things that makes SotM a great game is that every villain deck tests the heroes in different ways.
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