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Subject: Why is it on KS? rss

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Crown of Command
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Looks like they are using KS as a preorder? Says on the page it's already produced and on its way to the US. Goal is $100. Weird.
 
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Mark O'Reilly
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Yes, just looks like a preorder page to me.
Just for US/Canadian backers, its already retail in Europe.
I played an early prototype of this with the designer Richard , in Devon 14 months ago. Was very good back then.
 
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Julien Grenier
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It is already in retail in Canada too in some FOGS. I order my copy yesterday and it is already in a shipping box as of this morning
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Brian Hunt
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They have done this with all their games for US distribution - they normally use Game Salute, but it seems they are doing it themselves this time.
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James Mathias
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BrianJohnHunt wrote:
They have done this with all their games for US distribution - they normally use Game Salute, but it seems they are doing it themselves this time.


Sort of. They are using Ship Naked, which is Game Salute. And they are still putting the Game Salute logo on the box.
 
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James Flight
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Thanks for posting this. I did not know you could order it this way already. They should publicize the link
 
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Scott C.
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Feels as if the KS is kinda slap together.... I still haven't seen really much as reviews and how to it compares to keyflower
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Michael Alexander
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I implore people to boycott this KS.

You're more strongly protected as a consumer by buying this at a retail store. There's no benefit at all to backing this campaign and you're encouraging silly behaviour by publishers.
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Chris Watts
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beefsack wrote:
I implore people to boycott this KS.

You're more strongly protected as a consumer by buying this at a retail store. There's no benefit at all to backing this campaign and you're encouraging silly behaviour by publishers.


Agreed. I was looking at backing but will pass now.
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Brian Hunt
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jmathias wrote:
BrianJohnHunt wrote:
They have done this with all their games for US distribution - they normally use Game Salute, but it seems they are doing it themselves this time.


Sort of. They are using Ship Naked, which is Game Salute. And they are still putting the Game Salute logo on the box.


I see, yes. I just saw that the project was by R&D rather than Game Salute.

It can be hard to find an R&D/Huch printing after the initial run, so often the Game Salute version is the only one available. I have already managed to get a copy of the game, so the KS won't trouble me, but in the past it was the only way to get Keyflower expansions.
 
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M.C.Crispy
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beefsack wrote:
I implore people to boycott this KS.

You're more strongly protected as a consumer by buying this at a retail store. There's no benefit at all to backing this campaign and you're encouraging silly behaviour by publishers.
I won't be backing this one because (a) I'm in Europe and (b) because it's EGG. However, I'm not sure that I agree with your statements. Especially "silly behaviour from publishers". If I were running a business and had access to a pre-order system that de-risked my publishing of a title and used a marketing channel that my target audience was already hooked into, I'd sure use it. Whether you believe that they should or should not use KS for some morally nebulous reason or another is irrelevant, the can use KS, so they will. And as a business that exists to deliver "shareholder value" that's what they should do.
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Justin R
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mccrispy wrote:
beefsack wrote:
I implore people to boycott this KS.

You're more strongly protected as a consumer by buying this at a retail store. There's no benefit at all to backing this campaign and you're encouraging silly behaviour by publishers.
I won't be backing this one because (a) I'm in Europe and (b) because it's EGG. However, I'm not sure that I agree with your statements. Especially "silly behaviour from publishers". If I were running a business and had access to a pre-order system that de-risked my publishing of a title and used a marketing channel that my target audience was already hooked into, I'd sure use it. Whether you believe that they should or should not use KS for some morally nebulous reason or another is irrelevant, the can use KS, so they will. And as a business that exists to deliver "shareholder value" that's what they should do.


By silly he probably didn't mean irrational. He probably meant more like "shitty", and it is probably judged from the standpoint of the consumer that ends up paying a higher price, even though the publisher saves on cutting out the middleman.
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M.C.Crispy
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JJRR_Esq wrote:
mccrispy wrote:
beefsack wrote:
I implore people to boycott this KS.

You're more strongly protected as a consumer by buying this at a retail store. There's no benefit at all to backing this campaign and you're encouraging silly behaviour by publishers.
I won't be backing this one because (a) I'm in Europe and (b) because it's EGG. However, I'm not sure that I agree with your statements. Especially "silly behaviour from publishers". If I were running a business and had access to a pre-order system that de-risked my publishing of a title and used a marketing channel that my target audience was already hooked into, I'd sure use it. Whether you believe that they should or should not use KS for some morally nebulous reason or another is irrelevant, the can use KS, so they will. And as a business that exists to deliver "shareholder value" that's what they should do.


By silly he probably didn't mean irrational. He probably meant more like "shitty", and it is probably judged from the standpoint of the consumer that ends up paying a higher price, even though the publisher saves on cutting out the middleman.
There's a reason that I don't support EGG KS projects.
 
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Magic Pink
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mccrispy wrote:
beefsack wrote:
I implore people to boycott this KS.

You're more strongly protected as a consumer by buying this at a retail store. There's no benefit at all to backing this campaign and you're encouraging silly behaviour by publishers.
I won't be backing this one because (a) I'm in Europe and (b) because it's EGG. However, I'm not sure that I agree with your statements. Especially "silly behaviour from publishers". If I were running a business and had access to a pre-order system that de-risked my publishing of a title and used a marketing channel that my target audience was already hooked into, I'd sure use it. Whether you believe that they should or should not use KS for some morally nebulous reason or another is irrelevant, the can use KS, so they will. And as a business that exists to deliver "shareholder value" that's what they should do.


So you're fine doing business in any way you can as long as you make the most money? Because I hear slavery really raises your profits.

Also, "morally nebulous reason" is bullshit.
 
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James Mathias
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mccrispy wrote:
JJRR_Esq wrote:
mccrispy wrote:
beefsack wrote:
I implore people to boycott this KS.

You're more strongly protected as a consumer by buying this at a retail store. There's no benefit at all to backing this campaign and you're encouraging silly behaviour by publishers.
I won't be backing this one because (a) I'm in Europe and (b) because it's EGG. However, I'm not sure that I agree with your statements. Especially "silly behaviour from publishers". If I were running a business and had access to a pre-order system that de-risked my publishing of a title and used a marketing channel that my target audience was already hooked into, I'd sure use it. Whether you believe that they should or should not use KS for some morally nebulous reason or another is irrelevant, the can use KS, so they will. And as a business that exists to deliver "shareholder value" that's what they should do.


By silly he probably didn't mean irrational. He probably meant more like "shitty", and it is probably judged from the standpoint of the consumer that ends up paying a higher price, even though the publisher saves on cutting out the middleman.
There's a reason that I don't support EGG KS projects.


This isn't an EGG campaign though. It's a cover operation for Game Salute.
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Jon Bowker
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mccrispy wrote:
There's a reason that I don't support EGG KS projects.

It's an R&D/Game Salute project. Perhaps EGG means something other than Eagle-Gryphon Games to you.
 
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M.C.Crispy
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proclaimed wrote:
mccrispy wrote:
There's a reason that I don't support EGG KS projects.

It's an R&D/Game Salute project. Perhaps EGG means something other than Eagle-Gryphon Games to you.
D'oh! My bad I could have sworn that I looked at this on KS and rule it out as an EGG project. Must have been the US only. Or have I completely misremembered the project? Apologies all.
 
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M.C.Crispy
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Magic Pink wrote:
mccrispy wrote:
beefsack wrote:
I implore people to boycott this KS.

You're more strongly protected as a consumer by buying this at a retail store. There's no benefit at all to backing this campaign and you're encouraging silly behaviour by publishers.
I won't be backing this one because (a) I'm in Europe and (b) because it's EGG. However, I'm not sure that I agree with your statements. Especially "silly behaviour from publishers". If I were running a business and had access to a pre-order system that de-risked my publishing of a title and used a marketing channel that my target audience was already hooked into, I'd sure use it. Whether you believe that they should or should not use KS for some morally nebulous reason or another is irrelevant, the can use KS, so they will. And as a business that exists to deliver "shareholder value" that's what they should do.


So you're fine doing business in any way you can as long as you make the most money? Because I hear slavery really raises your profits.

Also, "morally nebulous reason" is bullshit.
I'm very happy to engage with you in a reasoned argument, but really, opening up with "bullshit" and an example of reductio ad absurbum doesn't bode well for the direction such an argument would take. Perhaps you would be so kind as to expand on your moral stance against this campaign. If there's something that I've missed (other than the publisher blush) I'd be pleased to hear your contribution.
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Nathan Ehlers
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Most reviews at this point describe this as a lighter version of Keyflower. Whether or not that appeals (and as a result is well reviewed) depends a lot on your opinion of if you think Keyflower is too complex/heavy. Otherwise, if you're played Keyflower, you've played this one. Take that for what you will.
 
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Julien Grenier
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Tuesday when I saw the game on KS I backed it instantly, then I notice that boardgamebliss.ca were selling copies for the exact same total price (for a Canadian fellow) so I ordered it from their site at 5pm, cancel my KS pledge and now as of today, I have the game in my home
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Scott O'Brien
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mccrispy wrote:
beefsack wrote:
I implore people to boycott this KS.

You're more strongly protected as a consumer by buying this at a retail store. There's no benefit at all to backing this campaign and you're encouraging silly behaviour by publishers.
I won't be backing this one because (a) I'm in Europe and (b) because it's EGG. However, I'm not sure that I agree with your statements. Especially "silly behaviour from publishers". If I were running a business and had access to a pre-order system that de-risked my publishing of a title and used a marketing channel that my target audience was already hooked into, I'd sure use it. Whether you believe that they should or should not use KS for some morally nebulous reason or another is irrelevant, the can use KS, so they will. And as a business that exists to deliver "shareholder value" that's what they should do.



actually It's not moral... it's not a belief...it's black and white: Downright illegal.
it clearly violates the terms and conditions for using the KS platform.


see kickstarter is not a store

and

KS Prohibited items]

Quote:
Projects that share things that already exist, or repackage a previously-created product, without adding anything new or aiming to iterate on the idea in any way.

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M.C.Crispy
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sao123 wrote:
mccrispy wrote:
beefsack wrote:
I implore people to boycott this KS.

You're more strongly protected as a consumer by buying this at a retail store. There's no benefit at all to backing this campaign and you're encouraging silly behaviour by publishers.
I won't be backing this one because (a) I'm in Europe and (b) because it's EGG. However, I'm not sure that I agree with your statements. Especially "silly behaviour from publishers". If I were running a business and had access to a pre-order system that de-risked my publishing of a title and used a marketing channel that my target audience was already hooked into, I'd sure use it. Whether you believe that they should or should not use KS for some morally nebulous reason or another is irrelevant, the can use KS, so they will. And as a business that exists to deliver "shareholder value" that's what they should do.



actually It's not moral... it's not a belief...it's black and white: Downright illegal.
it clearly violates the terms and conditions for using the KS platform.


see kickstarter is not a store

and

KS Prohibited items]

Quote:
Projects that share things that already exist, or repackage a previously-created product, without adding anything new or aiming to iterate on the idea in any way.

Illegal? Doubt it.

I wonder whether KS are aware of this type of project and if they are, whether they've taken the view that they exist to create shareholder value and blocking this sort of project might damage that? What do you think? I wonder whether you and your supporters might be able to report every such project (there's a button on the project page) and whether it would make any difference. No, I didn't think so. KS has been allowing games-based projects to push the boundaries of what is both possible and allowed, while being more than happy to skim their share of the takings. I don't see that changing.
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Chris Grable
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I'm at the point that I no longer support companies like Game Salute that obviously have very little love for their customers and treat them as nothing more than a wallet and even at that, they show little to no respect for their customers after they have their money.

Period.

I will not even buy the game if it is produced by GS, no matter how badly I want it.

The only way that companies like Game Salute will get the message is if everyone does the same. No matter how great the title is, vote with your wallet. This is all that changes business methods or forces those out of business that do not learn.

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Chris Grable
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jflight1 wrote:
Thanks for posting this. I did not know you could order it this way already. They should publicize the link



They will not because GS believes that their customers are too dumb to figure this out on their own and would prefer to increase their profits over your satisfaction.

This is one of many, many reasons why all gamers should simply boycott ALL Game Salute products. ALL of them. They will either learn to stop being so greedy and manipulative, they will learn to communicate with their customers...or they will go out of business. Designers will cease to use GS when they see that gamers do not purchase products from them.

If having a single game is more important to you than how you are treated by the manufacturer, then continue to do business with this company, but do not feel you have the right to complain when they continue to have slimy business practices.

There are too many good titles out there to worry about a couple you may miss unless you are ok with the way they will treat you.

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Dan Ridge
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My main problem, besides the fact that it's a Game Salute KS, is GS uses so many different names and accounts to run KS' because they have a poor reputation. Instead of improving themselves and gaining my trust, they choose to obfuscate themselves and shuffle their projects around using all sorts of different accounts. That bothers me quite a lot as a customer and for this reason I would rather purchase the new Key game via some other source.
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