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Mansions of Madness: Second Edition» Forums » General

Subject: Fantasy Flight Confirms No Multiple Game Saves rss

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Toby Gee
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I have been perplexed as to why people aren't more concerned with only being able to save a single scenario in progress. Given that the shortest scenario is 90-120 minutes, with lots of people indicating that it actually takes much longer, the ability to only save one game at a time severely constrains the consumer. If I play a scenario with my game group and we don't finish, I cannot play this game with anyone else without overwriting the game.

Descent offers multiple game saves, so I wasn't sure if it was s development or technology constraint. I reached out to Fantasy Flight and this was there response:

"The decision to make a single save was a design decision. There are not any current plans to support multiple saves. We apologize for any inconvenience this may have caused, we also appreciate your understanding and support. As always, please contact us directly if you have any further questions or concerns."

This is really disappointing and feels like lazy development on their part. I have followed up asking for further explanation and will continue to update this thread when they respond.

It looks like people creating their own workarounds, at least for Windows, that can be found in the General forum. I have also provided a link below.

https://boardgamegeek.com/thread/1661630/save-game-manager-w...
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Reid
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While I would certainly rather have multiple game saves on one device, my work around is to take advantage of the app being free. Keep one saved on my tablet, another on the phone, maybe get it on Steam on my laptop. Not ideal, but it's the alternative that works for me.
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Toby Gee
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burningecho wrote:
While I would certainly rather have multiple game saves on one device, my work around is to take advantage of the app being free. Keep one saved on my tablet, another on the phone, maybe get it on Steam on my laptop. Not ideal, but it's the alternative that works for me.


Certainly a fair approach, but my opinion is that it shouldn't be up to the consumer to come up with workarounds for a feature that is seems like a standard requirement in gaming applications.

It becomes less free, unless you stick only to the free downloads, when they start releasing downloadable content. They don't have a process in place to allow for downloadable content to be available on multiple devices (with the possible exception of Steam), so you would have to purchase that content for each device you wanted to use.

It's each consumers decision as to whether this is an issue, but to me it seems like a glaring oversight and/or lazy development. It's too late to impact my purchase of the base game and already released expansions, but it certainly weighs heavy on my decision to continue to support the game.
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Dean L
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paco62 wrote:

This is really disappointing and feels like lazy development on their part.


They literally just told you it was a design descision though - if you're not going to believe what they tell you then why bother asking for more?

I can certainly see why - it's designed as a thematic, story-driven experience. While I can see the case for breaking up the larger missions over a couple of nights, the idea of stopping a game, starting a different one a few days later, stopping that, then going back to the original one, trying to remember what you were doing and where you were... it's not an ideal experience.

Obviously there's the school of thought that goes "let players do what they want, don't restrict them in any way" but it's not always that simple.
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Richard Little
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paco62 wrote:


It becomes less free, unless you stick only to the free downloads, when they start releasing downloadable content. They don't have a process in place to allow for downloadable content to be available on multiple devices (with the possible exception of Steam), so you would have to purchase that content for each device you wanted to use.

I would expect that multiple devices on the same platform (iOS, Android) will be able to share DLC. This was the case with previous games such as Elder Sign: Omens - I've only paid once for DLC for that game and have used it across two android phones and three android tablets without having to resort to any hacks.
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Toby Gee
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ricedwlit wrote:
paco62 wrote:


It becomes less free, unless you stick only to the free downloads, when they start releasing downloadable content. They don't have a process in place to allow for downloadable content to be available on multiple devices (with the possible exception of Steam), so you would have to purchase that content for each device you wanted to use.

I would expect that multiple devices on the same platform (iOS, Android) will be able to share DLC. This was the case with previous games such as Elder Sign: Omens - I've only paid once for DLC for that game and have used it across two android phones and three android tablets without having to resort to any hacks.


That would alleviate some of the concern for sure, though I can't imagine trying to play this on my phone due to the amount of text. I have reached back to them with a couple questions and will update the thread once I receive a response.

I would also like to point out that they have been very responsive to my questions and have offered further explanation, which is very nice of them. To keep this thread from being too cumbersome, I will post them in summary once I have enough information.
 
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Mark Kwan
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While this may not be a solution for everyone, it's a relatively simple solution (atleast for now) which would potentially work for some:

Install the app on multiple devices and associate each device with a play group.
 
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Markus Sinnabell
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I think the whole project is not well designed......

Example:
Select a scenario from expansion (only in english selectable).
Then save it, change the language to german and you can play it in german.......im not sure if all text parts are translated but - WTF!!!!

After you select the language and go back to menu - you see the download animation, only the NEW GAME and CONTINUE are not selectable during downlaod. After xy seconds (end of download the package) the buttons are selectable.

today if i testing savegame manager i detected this leak.....
 
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Barry Miller
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paco62 wrote:
I reached out to Fantasy Flight and this was there response:

"The decision to make a single save was a design decision. There are not any current plans to support multiple saves."

It'd be nice for once, for FFG to step aside from their aloof & omniscient posture to actually engage with their fans, by sharing why this was a design decision.

Because I agree with the OP... to be able to save multiple games for multiple groups just seems like a no-brainer, that to arrive at an exactly opposite decision I think warrants an explanation so that we can all "get it" and move on.

Until then, I think it's a great idea and thusly should continue to push FFG to make it happen. Or they explain to us why it can't. Simple as that.

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Toby Gee
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I received some more feedback and will summarize. Again, I feel like - aside from the initial response - FF customer service has been very open and engaged. While I don't agree with their approach, I think it is more thoughtful than what I initially expected. I am paraphrasing their responses because I didn't wan't to quote further without permission (right or wrong).

I asked for further explanation around what "design decision" meant. Their response was that they wanted to give MoM a more perilous feel since it was much more of a narrative experience than Descent (comparing the two due to similar approach with digital applications). They felt that multiple save slots would allow groups to replay to find the best course to proceed with.

My response:
"Thank you for the expanded explanation. That is an interesting and understandable perspective, but couldn't the same be achieved by allowing only one game slot per scenario? That way, you could at least enjoy the game and a different scenario while waiting to complete the previous? I would also be curious as to why this is different from Descent, which allows multiple game save slots? It creates a feeling of peril as well. Is it how the application randomizes the monsters, with Descent being more randomly generated and Mansions of Madness being more scripted (due to the nature of the narrative)?

It feels like a decision that hinders the majority of consumers to limit the play style of a minority of gamer's, especially if that is how a particular game group likes to approach things (by 'choosing' the best course of action).

If this is the design decision, will downloadable content (which requires purchasing) be available across multiple devices? The prominent workaround on the forums is to download the app on several different devices so you can have multiple game sessions. This would require multiple purchases of downloadable content and could be prohibitive, myself included, in supporting future expansions and content."

Their response was the Descent and Imperial Assault are more about multiple player choices and narrative paths, whereas MoM is more linear. They gave an example of an open ended RPG video game versus one that is more on "rails". They only addressed downloadable content by saying it is tied at the account level by whatever platform you purchase the content on.

Again, I absolutely disagree with the approach and decision. I really enjoy this game, but their decision not to at least support a game save for each scenario is short sighted, solves a non-existent problem, and indicates that they don't care much for user feedback. I can't imagine any user feedback group saying they don't want to save multiple games because a few number of gamers are going to meta the whole thing.

However, I am pleasantly surprised at the level of engagement and explanation that has been given my questions. As a consumer, I appreciate it very much.
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Dean L
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paco62 wrote:

Again, I absolutely disagree with the approach and decision. I really enjoy this game, but their decision not to at least support a game save for each scenario is short sighted, solves a non-existent problem, and indicates that they don't care much for user feedback. I can't imagine any user feedback group saying they don't want to save multiple games because a few number of gamers are going to meta the whole thing.


That's true, and the explanation they gave you sounds like nonsense. Descent doesn't allow multiple saves in that fashion - you can't play, get to a branch between A and B, save, go down path A, then later reload that save and try path B. But you can start multiple campaigns and manage them separately. So it wouldn't even need to be one per scenario, it could be multiple slots, just without the ability to copy/branch them. It seems far more likely it was done because Descent is a 20 hour campaign and MoM is 6 hours max.

But I think you're over-estimating the number that care. If asked, I'd take it, but I doubt I'd ever use it. If it was a 99c DLC in the store I wouldn't bother buying it.

The vast majority won't be wanting to play with multiple groups concurrently. The vast majority just don't play games that much.
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Toby Gee
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Deano2099 wrote:
Paco62 wrote:

But I think you're over-estimating the number that care. If asked, I'd take it, but I doubt I'd ever use it. If it was a 99c DLC in the store I wouldn't bother buying it.

The vast majority won't be wanting to play with multiple groups concurrently. The vast majority just don't play games that much.


Absolutely fair point and could be the simple answer as to why I haven't heard more noise about it.
 
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Nicola Zee
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Deano2099 wrote:
paco62 wrote:

Again, I absolutely disagree with the approach and decision. I really enjoy this game, but their decision not to at least support a game save for each scenario is short sighted, solves a non-existent problem, and indicates that they don't care much for user feedback. I can't imagine any user feedback group saying they don't want to save multiple games because a few number of gamers are going to meta the whole thing.


That's true, and the explanation they gave you sounds like nonsense. Descent doesn't allow multiple saves in that fashion - you can't play, get to a branch between A and B, save, go down path A, then later reload that save and try path B. But you can start multiple campaigns and manage them separately. So it wouldn't even need to be one per scenario, it could be multiple slots, just without the ability to copy/branch them. It seems far more likely it was done because Descent is a 20 hour campaign and MoM is 6 hours max.

But I think you're over-estimating the number that care. If asked, I'd take it, but I doubt I'd ever use it. If it was a 99c DLC in the store I wouldn't bother buying it.

The vast majority won't be wanting to play with multiple groups concurrently. The vast majority just don't play games that much.

One reason board gamers are willing to put up with many issues is board gamers have much lower expectations compared to computer gamers. It was not that long ago when the hobby was regarded as eccentric and slightly sad. The quality of the games was mostly poor with the biggest board games companies churning out cheap roll the dice and move around the track type games. We now live in the golden age of board gaming but board games are still a somewhat a niche market and so many board gamers expect issues. To be far to FFG, if enough customers complain, they do at least take notice of the complaints.

FFG's explanation is - of course - utter and total bullshit but in the grand scheme of things it's not really that big an issue. For me the bigger issue is the lack of an undo button.
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Dean L
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Do you really think? I have far higher expectations of board games, and find them to be far stronger on launch in general than video games. Of course, they're much harder to patch too.
 
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Nicola Zee
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Deano2099 wrote:
Do you really think? I have far higher expectations of board games, and find them to be far stronger on launch in general than video games. Of course, they're much harder to patch too.

You have a point there. Some video games are rushed into launch early and contain some serious issues. I try to wait until several patches have been released before playing a video game or using any piece of software. But I hope you'll agree some fans of video games can be extremely (and sometimes even scarily) vocal in their criticism.

In my experience most board gamers are willing and happy to give the publishers the benefit of the doubt and are a bit more patient or at least less likely to resort to a string of expletives . Although you could be right that part of the reason for this is a board game is a lot easier to patch. All that is needed is often an entry in an official errata sheet or failing that a house rule.
 
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Christopher Todesco
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Read it again, carefully...
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burningecho wrote:
While I would certainly rather have multiple game saves on one device, my work around is to take advantage of the app being free. Keep one saved on my tablet, another on the phone, maybe get it on Steam on my laptop. Not ideal, but it's the alternative that works for me.


Another reason to purchase the DLC for the Steam version-- much easier to backup and restore the same game files. (And the screen is much bigger than any device.)
 
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