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Subject: Dark Moon vs. Dead of Winter rss

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Michael Gonzalez
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What are the pros and cons of each? Which should I get??
 
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Dave Lartigue
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I personally find Dark Moon to be far better than DOW.

The latter goes on too long, has a tired theme, a nonsensical betrayer aspect, and relies on reading cards to each other to provide atmosphere. I think Dark Moon does its thing more interestingly and efficiently.
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Michael Gonzalez
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Legomancer wrote:
I personally find Dark Moon to be far better than DOW.

The latter goes on too long, has a tired theme, a nonsensical betrayer aspect, and relies on reading cards to each other to provide atmosphere. I think Dark Moon does its thing more interestingly and efficiently.


Thanks! I did always think the DoW mechanism for hiding the traitor seemed contrived and potentially annoying.

I may give Dark Moon a try...
 
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Robin Vermeersch
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It really all depends on your taste.

Dark Moon generally is a more tense game, where you're never really sure if your neighbour and close friend can be trusted or not. Tasks seem to fail an awful lot when he needs to submit dice, but you know, maybe it's all bad luck? You eye him suspiciously...

Basically, it's semi-cooperative in that you all want to reach a common goal, but you got traitors among you who will do everything in their power to stop you from reaching that goal. I'm very fond of these type of traitor games, so maybe I'm biased, but Dark Moon is one of my favorite purchases ever.

Dead of Winter is something if you want to create some kind of story. It all centers around the Crossroads-cards, that, based on the choices you either make as a team or individually, can change the outcome of the game. There's a betrayer element in there, but the game is not centered around it the way Dark Moon is.

Basically, if you want an immersive, coop game with a nice bit of story, go for Dead of Winter. If you're really after a traitor game, go with Dark Moon.
 
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Dan Caram
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Dark Moon is a great game if you have a group that really knows how to play it. If someone is unclear on the rules, it throws it all off and there IS a bit of a learning curve. That said, once you know all the rules, it is very tense and enjoyable. There have been some real nailbiter games. I don't like the zombie theme so I have never played DOW.

One tip for Dark Moon: Play the soundtrack from "Gravity" or "Interstellar" in the background. You can listen to it for free through Amazon Music if you Prime. It ratchets up the tension.
 
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Karl
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I'd totally go for DoW. Dark Moon (or respectively the original Galactica themed P&P) fell totally flat for me. Too dry, too random, not enough strategy. DoW also has its downsides, but for me its a much better experience then Dark Moon.
 
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Nathan Howe
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Dark Moon is on my list to buy, it is without a doubt a game rich in the traitor aspect and theme reminiscent of most sci-fi "crap, I'm trapped in a ship with an infected alien" vibe.

On the other hand, DoW is dripping with flavor text and really deepens game play when players delve into character and assimilate the theme wholly. This could be said for both games, and while they share similar attributes, DoW is a bit more weighty and has more variance to explore, imo. And has been said, it does depend on your taste.

All that said, Dead of Winter: The Long Night might be a potential candidate as well.
 
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Dave Lartigue
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DoW is "dripping with theme" in that it has cards where you read off some text. In most turns you won't read them at all, because they're often highly specific. When you do read them, they're just a big block of text that then presents you with two choices which range from the obvious to flip-a-coin because you have no information to go on. That's the big immersive theme people gush about. Beyond that you have zombies that may as well be extremely pointy scissors you risk stepping on, as they don't do anything except occupy spaces, and characters that you might not want to care about too much anyway because a literal roll of the die can straight up kill them.

I don't get paid for every copy of Dark Moon sold, and DoW didn't kill my family, but it drives me crazy to see some cards with flavor text constantly held up as the absolute apogee of themed boardgaming.
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Freelance Police
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Mentat1231 wrote:
What are the pros and cons of each? Which should I get??


Well, BSG Express, which DM is based on, is a free PnP. Download the files, read the rules, and see if it's what you like.

https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgameversion/132215/print-and-...
 
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Georg Wolgast
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Legomancer wrote:
DoW is "dripping with theme" in that it has cards where you read off some text. In most turns you won't read them at all, because they're often highly specific. When you do read them, they're just a big block of text that then presents you with two choices which range from the obvious to flip-a-coin because you have no information to go on. That's the big immersive theme people gush about. Beyond that you have zombies that may as well be extremely pointy scissors you risk stepping on, as they don't do anything except occupy spaces, and characters that you might not want to care about too much anyway because a literal roll of the die can straight up kill them.

I don't get paid for every copy of Dark Moon sold, and DoW didn't kill my family, but it drives me crazy to see some cards with flavor text constantly held up as the absolute apogee of themed boardgaming.


I'd argue that DoW is a very thematic game, but that the crossroad cards are the least thematic thing in the game. What really sells the zombie theme for me is that you're in constant risk whenever you venture out of your comfort zone due to the exposure die and that you can never be sure about your friend's true motivations.

What draws me to the zombie theme is not the zombies themselves, it's what the post-apocalypse does to the psyche of your fellow humans. It's your friends that are truly dangerous, not the zombies. I can agree that having everyone be forced into acting suspicious is a crutch for a traitor game, but I both think it's thematically brilliant and not an important part of the game. It can be played completely cooperatively, the traitor mechanic is just an added, optional difficulty as far as I'm concerned.

I prefer zombies to be not immediately threatening but eventually unavoidable, they continues to chip away at your defences day after day until you give up- those are the zombies depicted in DoW. They are only dangerous in large groups and you should be able to easily handle them, but if you ignore them for too long they can mess you up.

To circle around to the point of the thread, as mentioned above DoW is the more thematic game IMO, but not really a traitor game. If you're looking for a traitor game, I'm sure DM is a good choice, though I haven't played it. Also, if you do end up getting DoW, the expansion Dead of Winter: The Long Night is standalone so I'd recommend starting with that as that gives you more options.
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Chris Dragon
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Some I already have Dead of Winter (love it), and will inevitably get the expansion. Is Dark Moon too similar to bother trying? O realize I Newberry want to bother with Battlestar Galactica because DoW is arguably just as good and shorter. Does the same idea apply to Dark Moon?
 
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Rick Fuss
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Mentat1231 wrote:
What are the pros and cons of each? Which should I get??


In my opinion, the biggest factor is how many players?

Five or more players, go with Dark Moon. Dark Moon is just OK with 4 and I would flat out avoid playing with 3. Because you can choose to contribute to missions on other player's turns, the downtime between your turns doesn't seem nearly as long even at higher player counts.

Two to 5 players, go with Dead of Winter (and use the Prisoner's Dilemma variant for 2 players). Dead of Winter can get long with 5 players depending on your scenario. Also, downtime between turns increases at higher player counts.

Yes, I know that I recommended both games with at 5 players, so I'd choose whichever theme appeals to you the most. But I will say that the tension and paranoia surrounding who is or isn't the traitor is a slower burn in Dead of Winter, whereas the tension and paranoia surrounding the traitor in Dark Moon is ratcheted up from the very beginning.
 
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Jeff Connell
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I found the downtime with 5 players in DoW was way too much. It really, really slows down.
 
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Anna F.
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I have to say that Dark Moon sounds really cool. I ended up with a copy because I ordered a bunch of games from Target and they accidentally sent me a bunch of games I didn't order, and said I could keep them. Dark Moon was one. It's still in shrink because I don't really have anyone in my life right now that wants to play games more complex than TtR or maybe Pandemic. Should I flip it or keep it?
 
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