Jonathan Dunn
United Kingdom
Ashby-de-la-Zouch
Leicestershire
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmb

Of the 6 characters the players can choose from in the game, 2 are female: One a nun and the other a 'starlet' (although due to her backstory and lack of sensible clothing, basically a stripper).

Then there are 9 Ally cards: 7 male, 2 animals, one woman. Yes more animals than women; at least these are only incidental characters.

Can I strongly recommend looking again at these choices if there is to be a reprint of this game.* Promote Mrs Sparrowhawk to be a main character and possibly add a "young plucky heroine", or make the Professor character into a woman scientist. Jacqueline the starlet could become an Ally.

* or it would be great to get hold of a promo with one or two new female characters
44 
 Thumb up
1.52
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Soda Popinski
msg tools
mbmb
Agreed. This is an example of really really bad female representation. Actually the worst I´ve seen in a long time. Will not buy the game because of it.
18 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Brian M
United States
Thornton
Colorado
flag msg tools
designer
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I'm extra ticked off since long ago (before it was released) the designer specifically mentioned to me how London Dread did a good job with female characters.

And the starlet's outfit is just absurd; it doesn't look anything like the clothes people would reasonably be expected to wear.
19 
 Thumb up
1.00
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls

Ottawa
Ontario
msg tools
Avatar
Victorian burlesque dancers are strippers now? Okay.

Played a demo of this with my wife. I used the nun (forget her name) and my wife used Jacqueline. I liked the camp of the characters. I wanted to be the criminal because he looked ridiculous, but someone beat me to it. My wife laughed at the character and thought it was all in good fun. Neither of us were offended. I'll have to have a talk with her tonight and see if this whole "representation" thing hurts her or if she thinks it's just nonsensical moral panic. I have a funny feeling I know the answer.

I'm certainly not against introducing new characters, but I definitely don't see a need for a change.

We didn't enjoy the game, sadly.
11 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Tina T
Germany
Koblenz
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Just because your wife is fine with it does not mean I have to be fine with it, thank you very much. And thanks for condescendingly making diversity in a fantasy setting an issue of "nonsensical moral panic".
  • [+] Dice rolls
Brian M
United States
Thornton
Colorado
flag msg tools
designer
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
broken clock wrote:
I'll have to have a talk with her tonight and see if this whole "representation" thing hurts her or if she thinks it's just nonsensical moral panic. I have a funny feeling I know the answer.

I would agree that the several decades of insisting that most or all of the characters in games, movies, TV, etc, etc be men, to the point of publishers demanding that writers/designers change their female characters to men and script-writing classes actively teaching that its not OK to have two women talking to each other could in fact be classified as a "nonsensical moral panic".

Getting fed up with that after putting up with it for decades? Not so much.
16 
 Thumb up
0.02
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls

Ottawa
Ontario
msg tools
Avatar
schlawiner wrote:
Just because your wife is fine with it does not mean I have to be fine with it, thank you very much. And thanks for condescendingly making diversity in a fantasy setting an issue of "nonsensical moral panic".


I'm glad you're okay with my wife being fine with it. I'm okay with you not being fine with it. In my opinion, diversity in board games is a nonsensical moral panic. In your opinion it's a serious issue. Nobody is "forcing" anyone to feel anything.

Let me clarify: A moral panic is essentially a group of individuals vilifying a fairly trivial thing within society by suggesting it does some great harm. So, some random people not liking a game because it doesn't have what they consider to be proper diversity is fine. That's perfectly acceptable. Exercise your rights as a consumer and don't purchase the product. Hell, further exercise those rights by complaining (like you're currently doing) online. That's fine too. I'm simply providing an alternative voice that suggests that many people don't actually care and are perfectly fine with the representation. Attempting to suggest some greater social evil is where the moral panic kicks in.

It's okay that some games feature females in positions you're not comfortable with. These games are and always have been a rarity in comparison to the vast majority of games that have diversity or don't even prominently feature human beings in their theme. No harm is done by the existence of these games. Why would you want to take these select few games away from people who enjoy them? That seems a little harsh.
26 
 Thumb up
1.00
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls

Ottawa
Ontario
msg tools
Avatar
StormKnight wrote:
broken clock wrote:
I'll have to have a talk with her tonight and see if this whole "representation" thing hurts her or if she thinks it's just nonsensical moral panic. I have a funny feeling I know the answer.

I would agree that the several decades of insisting that most or all of the characters in games, movies, TV, etc, etc be men, to the point of publishers demanding that writers/designers change their female characters to men and script-writing classes actively teaching that its not OK to have two women talking to each other could in fact be classified as a "nonsensical moral panic".

Getting fed up with that after putting up with it for decades? Not so much.


I think you just emphasized the nonsensical part.
5 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Brian M
United States
Thornton
Colorado
flag msg tools
designer
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
broken clock wrote:
I think you just emphasized the nonsensical part.

Off the top of your head, name 10 adventure/action games with more female than male characters. For bonus credit they should have female characters that aren't sexualized.
13 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Steve S
United States
Morgantown
West Virginia
flag msg tools
"Just because your wife is fine with it does not mean I have to be fine with it, thank you very much.

But similarly, just because you are not fine with it, doesn't mean that the game has to be changed to please you personally. Thank you very much.

"And thanks for condescendingly making diversity in a fantasy setting an issue of "nonsensical moral panic".""

But,... diversity in a fantasy setting IS nonsensical moral panic. It deserves to be condescended.


14 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Scot Ryder
United States
Silver Spring
Maryland
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
This was the deal breaker for me. It's ridiculous that the publisher couldn't do better than this.
11 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls

Ottawa
Ontario
msg tools
Avatar
StormKnight wrote:
broken clock wrote:
I think you just emphasized the nonsensical part.

Off the top of your head, name 10 adventure/action games with more female than male characters. For bonus credit they should have female characters that aren't sexualized.


Ah, so we're focusing on action adventure board games. I dig.

What purpose does naming games with more female characters serve? If you're discussing action/adventure, wouldn't it be more realistic to acknowledge the fact that more men in the real world are in positions we would typically associate with "action/adventure"? Soldier? Assassin? Criminal? This is especially true if we're dealing with any sort loosely based historical setting.If there were more women in these positions within games, aside from being unrealistic*, wouldn't it be a gross misrepresentation of male participants within these fields and therefore wouldn't some people find that insulting?

I find it funny that a few people on BGG seem to wring their hands over how we don't have enough women within the themes of board games, despite the fact that most games seem to focus on trading and fighting . . . two male dominated positions throughout human history. Now, if we were dealing with some game about contemporary hospitals and all the doctors and nurses were men, then maybe there would be a reason to cock an eyebrow.

And how do you think asking that question really counters anything I've stated? You insinuate a 50/50 gender split in every fantasy game is necessary. Why?

Men and women are sexualized in fantasy games. It happens in many many games. But this is an entirely different moral panic.

*Keep in mind I'm very well aware that we're discussing fantasy, so the use of the word "realism" is loose. Obviously games, no matter how fantastical, are attempting to adhere to some sense of reality.
14 
 Thumb up
1.00
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Brian M
United States
Thornton
Colorado
flag msg tools
designer
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
For the flip side, adventure games with more men than women:

Talisman
Warhammer Quest
HeroQuest
Space Crusade
Advanced Space Crusade
Tyranid Attack
Mutant Chronicles: Siege of the Citadel
Dungeons & Dragons Basic Game
Dungeons & Dragons: Castle Ravenloft Board Game
Descent: Journeys in the Dark
Doom: The Boardgame
Last Night on Earth: The Zombie Game
Zombicide
Shadows of Brimstone: City of the Ancients
Shadows of Brimstone: Swamps of Death
Dungeons & Dragons: The Fantasy Adventure Board Game
DungeonQuest
Secrets of the Lost Tomb
London Dread
Mechs vs. Minions
Myth
Relic
Runebound (First Edition)
Mage Knight Board Game
Arcadia Quest
Galaxy Defenders
Deathwatch: Overkill
Space Hulk (third edition)
Death Angel
Journey: Wrath of Demons
Fireteam Zero
Burgle Bros.
Fortune and Glory: The Cliffhanger Game
Star Trek: Expeditions
Warhammer Quest: Silver Tower

That's literally off the top of my head, without looking anything up, just counting games that I've actually played.
7 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls

Ottawa
Ontario
msg tools
Avatar
StormKnight wrote:


I have a funny feeling you made this list before I responded.



Most of those games involve warriors. What a surprise that more men than women are in warrior-like positions. I wonder why . . .
11 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Brian M
United States
Thornton
Colorado
flag msg tools
designer
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
broken clock wrote:
What purpose does naming games with more female characters serve?

To illustrate how absurdly rare they are.

Quote:
And how do you think asking that question really counters anything I've stated? You insinuate a 50/50 gender split in every fantasy game is necessary. Why?

Why has an overwhelming male split been necessary for the last several decades?

Quote:
Keep in mind I'm very well aware that we're discussing fantasy, so the use of the word "realism" is loose.

In other words, we're not actually discussing games based on historical reality, so why care what the historical gender balance for largely imaginary professions would be?
9 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls

Ottawa
Ontario
msg tools
Avatar
StormKnight wrote:

To illustrate how absurdly rare they are.


Rare in games. Rare in life. One is a representation of the other.

StormKnight wrote:

Why has an overwhelming male split been necessary for the last several decades?


I've covered this question.

StormKnight wrote:
In other words, we're not actually discussing games based on historical reality, so why care what the historical gender balance for largely imaginary professions would be?


Well, naturally any piece of fantasy has some groundings in reality. Those grounding actually assist in escapism (if that's your primary goal when engaging with fantasy). I'd argue they even assist with enjoyment. Let's use Conan as an example. Conan is fantasy. While there are many fantasy elements within Conan it still attempts to mimic reality to some extent. Large swords are carried in both hands. Warriors typically die from severed limbs. Muscular men are strong. Skinny men are weak. Fat men are slow. Skinny men are fast. Yes, exceptions do exist and things like magic and giant snakes exist, but they are sparse. It's the same with female warriors. They are in the genre, no doubt about that and there are plenty who can best a lot of men, but they are not there in abundance. Demanding there be a 50/50 split of women as warriors in fantasy is like demanding a 50/50 split of fat and muscular warriors in Conan or any fantasy setting. What about the elderly? Notice how all games only sprinkle the odd old person in there? Don't you think a game that featured 50 percent elderly warriors would raise an eyebrow? (Although I'd be perfectly fine with a game about aged warriors! I'd also be fine with a game entirely consisting of female warriors!)

I'd like to restate something you skipped over: What does it matter? Why do games require a 50/50 split even if that split is a lie? I guess I don't feel you're really stating your case. Why should my wife and I give a shit?

Also, is nobody else going to touch the fact that the OP called a bourlesque dancer a stripper!?
11 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jonathan Dunn
United Kingdom
Ashby-de-la-Zouch
Leicestershire
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmb
> Why do games require a 50/50 split even if that split is a lie?

Because 50% of the players are likely to be women, and why shouldn't they be able to choose female characters if the setting (Victorian London in this case) sensibly allows.

I'll be playing this with the family later and either my wife or daughter will have to play the 'burlesque dancer', or choose from the wider choice of male characters of course. It's not a show-stopper for me, it just seems unnecessary, and a bit of a missed opportunity. This is not Conan or Kingdom Death Monster, there's no reason for this game to be so male-oriented.
20 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Mark Chaplin
United Kingdom
Nottingham
Ice-choked tower, Mondavia, Nanglangka.
flag msg tools
designer
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
broken clock wrote:
StormKnight wrote:

To illustrate how absurdly rare they are.


Rare in games. Rare in life. One is a representation of the other.

StormKnight wrote:

Why has an overwhelming male split been necessary for the last several decades?


I've covered this question.

StormKnight wrote:
In other words, we're not actually discussing games based on historical reality, so why care what the historical gender balance for largely imaginary professions would be?


Well, naturally any piece of fantasy has some groundings in reality. Those grounding actually assist in escapism (if that's your primary goal when engaging with fantasy). I'd argue they even assist with enjoyment. Let's use Conan as an example. Conan is fantasy. While there are many fantasy elements within Conan it still attempts to mimic reality to some extent. Large swords are carried in both hands. Warriors typically die from severed limbs. Muscular men are strong. Skinny men are weak. Fat men are slow. Skinny men are fast. Yes, exceptions do exist and things like magic and giant snakes exist, but they are sparse. It's the same with female warriors. They are in the genre, no doubt about that and there are plenty who can best a lot of men, but they are not there in abundance. Demanding there be a 50/50 split of women as warriors in fantasy is like demanding a 50/50 split of fat and muscular warriors in Conan or any fantasy setting. What about the elderly? Notice how all games only sprinkle the odd old person in there? Don't you think a game that featured 50 percent elderly warriors would raise an eyebrow? (Although I'd be perfectly fine with a game about aged warriors! I'd also be fine with a game entirely consisting of female warriors!)

I'd like to restate something you skipped over: What does it matter? Why do games require a 50/50 split even if that split is a lie? I guess I don't feel you're really stating your case. Why should my wife and I give a shit?

Also, is nobody else going to touch the fact that the OP called a bourlesque dancer a stripper!?


Your whole thing about Conan the Barbarian: you've deployed the Thermian Argument - a diagetic justification for creepy garbage.



2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls

Ottawa
Ontario
msg tools
Avatar
joninashby wrote:
> Why do games require a 50/50 split even if that split is a lie?

Because 50% of the players are likely to be women, and why shouldn't they be able to choose female characters if the setting (Victorian London in this case) sensibly allows.



That's not necessarily true. I go to a lot of conventions and the split isn't 50/50. I'd also wager that the split between fantasy game players is even more skewed, but you're sticking to Dread, and I dig that.

Why wouldn't they be able to choose female characters? They can. They are in the game. I argue that it might not be as sensible to have an equal split, since women are typically not in adventuring positions (across almost all cultures and human history). I've covered this.

joninashby wrote:
>
I'll be playing this with the family later and either my wife or daughter will have to play the 'burlesque dancer', or choose from the wider choice of male characters of course. It's not a show-stopper for me, it just seems unnecessary, and a bit of a missed opportunity. This is not Conan or Kingdom Death Monster, there's no reason for this game to be so male-oriented.


Why are you quoting burlesque dancer? That's exactly what she is. If you're not happy with that accurate depiction of her occupation, we can use the term the game uses: starlet.

I HAVE played this with my family. You ask why your wife should have to pick a male character. I ask 'what does it matter'? You say there is no reason for a male-orientated split, I say there is and I tell you why there is in a previous post. I don't doubt that some people find enjoyment with playing their own gender in a game. I don't really give a shit, but I don't doubt some people do. Why should the game reflect a gendered split that doesn't exist within the gaming community? If they did make the split, what about all those guys who are now forced to play as women in their games? Do their voices not count? And if that split actually does exist within the community, which it doesn't, what does it really matter?
6 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Brian M
United States
Thornton
Colorado
flag msg tools
designer
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Quote:
Rare in games. Rare in life. One is a representation of the other.

There are no supernatural monsters to investigate in real life. There are no space marines in real life. There are no wizards in real life. There are no dragons in real life. No women have ever thwarted Cthulhu. No men have ever thwarted Cthulhu.

(Incidentally, if a real historical person was going to thwart Cthulhu, an excellent candidate would be Rose Mackenberg, a noted investigator who specialized in going undercover to disprove fraudulent psychic mediums).

I'm not complaining about how all the astronauts in Apollo XIII are men, because that's based on actual historical events. The people depicted are real.

And incidentally, you can't have it both ways. If you are arguing that realism is such a critical aspect of the game, then you can totally see why the starlet's outfit would bother people; it is absurd and unrealistic. Victorian women did not walk down the street wearing stuff like that.

If you'll notice, no one is complaining about the women in swimsuits in Tavarua; swimsuits are appropriate and expected attire to go surfboarding in.

Quote:
I've covered this question.

No, you haven't. Not at all. Do you think I'm kidding about the script writing stuff or publishers refusing content because it had a female lead? That's real stuff. That's bullshit. And this bullshit has been going on for a very long time.

We are, in fact, talking about fictional characters in a fictional setting that exist to encourage a fun game of make-believe. And for a very long time, women have been being told that they can only participate in these make-believe games by pretending to be a man. Or that the only role open to them as a women is this make-believe is "sex object". Meanwhile, men are never forced to play a "sex object", and are virtually never asked to pretend to be a woman. The overwhelming claim for years has been that this is because only men are interested in these sorts of subject matter and men wouldn't be comfortable playing a female character/watching a female main character.

Quote:
Why do games require a 50/50 split even if that split is a lie?

They don't. Heck, I'd personally like to see a lot more games with more female characters than male. It would help to counter out the decades of imbalanced representation that have made this such a frustrating issue to begin with.

Quote:
Why should my wife and I give a shit?

Either you do give a shit, or you've made an awful lot of posts on this thread for something you don't actually care at all about. If you are indifferent, why should you care what other people want to see?
24 
 Thumb up
1.00
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Brian M
United States
Thornton
Colorado
flag msg tools
designer
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Quote:
If they did make the split, what about all those guys who are now forced to play as women in their games?

Make up your mind - does being able to play as your gender or not make a difference?

Incidentally, as I've remarked before, I know quite a few women who don't care at all whether or they personally play a female character in any given instance, as long as they have equal opportunity to do so. I know others who have effectively said "I've spent years being told I have to pretend to be a boy to have pretend adventures. I'm fucking sick of it and I'm damn well going to be a woman having pretend adventures".
15 
 Thumb up
1.00
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Martin
United States
San Diego area
California
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
broken clock wrote:
Victorian burlesque dancers are strippers now?


No, they were strippers then. Now they're dead.
18 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls

Ottawa
Ontario
msg tools
Avatar
Yugblad wrote:


Your whole thing about Conan the Barbarian: you've deployed the Thermian Argument - a diagetic justification for creepy garbage.



Your statement doesn't counter my argument, nor does it answer my questions.

I don't find pulp fantasy creepy. Are you suggesting that those who enjoy that fantasy setting are creeps? Please, elaborate, because at this point your use of this "Thermian Argument" (which isn't really a thing), based on the video I watched, sounds like a shaming tactic rooted in virtue signaling.

I like Conan. Am I a deviant? My wife enjoys Conan. Is she a creepy miscreant?
5 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls

Ottawa
Ontario
msg tools
Avatar
StormKnight wrote:
Quote:
If they did make the split, what about all those guys who are now forced to play as women in their games?

Make up your mind - does being able to play as your gender or not make a difference?

Incidentally, as I've remarked before, I know quite a few women who don't care at all whether or they personally play a female character in any given instance, as long as they have equal opportunity to do so. I know others who have effectively said "I've spent years being told I have to pretend to be a boy to have pretend adventures. I'm fucking sick of it and I'm damn well going to be a woman having pretend adventures".


I'm using your reasoning when I make that statement. I really wish I didn't have to spell that out.

Your last few sentences sound like virtue signaling to me. Standing up for those poor women who have to be a certain character in a board game? I'm not sure I find that commendable. I play with about a 60/40 male to female split among the various people I can get to play board games. Not a single woman I play with has said anything about feeling alienated by the fictional characters in the game and the topic has come up. I've had a few laugh at the depiction of women in some games, but most actually seem to like the silly sexyness of pulp fantasy settings and many of them seem to find the muscles attractive, so I'm certainly glad we both seem to find things to be titillated by within the same game. So what do we do with our two very different personal experiences?

You sound very angry, so what's the argument? Are those women being hurt or something? How does the game impact their life?

StormKnight wrote:
Quote:
Rare in games. Rare in life. One is a representation of the other.

There are no supernatural monsters to investigate in real life. There are no space marines in real life. There are no wizards in real life. There are no dragons in real life. No women have ever thwarted Cthulhu. No men have ever thwarted Cthulhu.

(Incidentally, if a real historical person was going to thwart Cthulhu, an excellent candidate would be Rose Mackenberg, a noted investigator who specialized in going undercover to disprove fraudulent psychic mediums).

I'm not complaining about how all the astronauts in Apollo XIII are men, because that's based on actual historical events. The people depicted are real.

And incidentally, you can't have it both ways. If you are arguing that realism is such a critical aspect of the game, then you can totally see why the starlet's outfit would bother people; it is absurd and unrealistic. Victorian women did not walk down the street wearing stuff like that.

If you'll notice, no one is complaining about the women in swimsuits in Tavarua; swimsuits are appropriate and expected attire to go surfboarding in.

Quote:
I've covered this question.

No, you haven't. Not at all. Do you think I'm kidding about the script writing stuff or publishers refusing content because it had a female lead? That's real stuff. That's bullshit. And this bullshit has been going on for a very long time.

We are, in fact, talking about fictional characters in a fictional setting that exist to encourage a fun game of make-believe. And for a very long time, women have been being told that they can only participate in these make-believe games by pretending to be a man. Or that the only role open to them as a women is this make-believe is "sex object". Meanwhile, men are never forced to play a "sex object", and are virtually never asked to pretend to be a woman. The overwhelming claim for years has been that this is because only men are interested in these sorts of subject matter and men wouldn't be comfortable playing a female character/watching a female main character.

Quote:
Why do games require a 50/50 split even if that split is a lie?

They don't. Heck, I'd personally like to see a lot more games with more female characters than male. It would help to counter out the decades of imbalanced representation that have made this such a frustrating issue to begin with.

Quote:
Why should my wife and I give a shit?

Either you do give a shit, or you've made an awful lot of posts on this thread for something you don't actually care at all about. If you are indifferent, why should you care what other people want to see?


Again, you're bringing up a lot of stuff I've already discussed.

I have no issue with a publisher or script writer refusing content if they feel that content will not have the same level of financial success. That's their right. Just as it is the right of creators to dictate what is and is not in their game. Do you see what you're doing, you're discussing how it's unfair that content is being rejected based on the artist's desire to have female leads, but then criticizing an artist's use of male characters in their own work. I'm fine with creators using all female leads. I'm also fine with creators using all male leads.

Women have not been told anything of the sort. Everyone is free to create their own game. Women are not being forced or told to do anything. I also disagree with your "sex object" nonsense. Additionally,
I never claimed that only men are interested in these subject matters. I never said most men would be uncomfortable playing female characters. I don't deny that some women may get more enjoyment from a game if they are able to play their own gender but again, if more men are playing these types of games than women why is it that they should be forced to play the other gender (using your reasoning and wording)?

I'm fine with people deciding certain aspects of a game are unrealistic. It's all a matter of different tastes. We all have different lines we draw in the sand when experiencing a work of fantasy in regards to 'realism'. Certainly you can't be serious with this constant "well, it's just fantasy, so let it be 50/50" nonsense? Like I said, there is a line that people draw. Maybe that line is female warriors who weigh 120 pounds beating up muscular meat bags who weigh 200 pounds. Hell, do you remember the first Superman movie? Do you remember how many people thought Superman spinning the earth to time travel was the dumbest nonsense they had ever seen and how unrealistic it was? This is a movie that featured a man flying around in underwear shooting lasers out of his eyes and chilling drinks with his breath. Don't give me this "but it's fantasy" argument. Obviously even fantasy has limitations based on realism.

It's not necessarily the existence of a 50/50 split I care about. It's the fake moral panic that concerns me. Look at my original statement. It's fairly tame. I'm simply giving my experience as an alternative voice to the select few individuals who are outraged (or perhaps just mildly annoyed) by the female characters in the game.

Hell, if you really want a 50/50 split, go out and make it. Make all your characters androgenous flesh heaps with no sexuality at all! Public funding is an option! Go out there and see how successfull and in-demand your product is. Let the marketplace make the decision!

Note: I do appreciate that nobody has made some sexism argument just yet. I keep waiting for that shoe to drop but it doesn't seem to and that's nice. I think if people's primary concern is simply: "I would have more fun playing with a female character" I totally dig and respect that. The problem is I see a lot of arguments that attempt to suggest some larger social issue that doesn't exist . . . so perhaps it's that I care more about? It's really only his request for a change in characters for a reprint that I really don't like. Obviously this was the vision of the designer and artist. Let it be. Now, if you want to request more female characters in an expansion, let's do it! See how accomadating I am to your plight?
9 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Erik Isch
United States
chandler
Arizona
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Your wasting your time broken clock. This thread is like a smear campaign that needs to end. This game is selling out, if a small percentage of people don't like the character ratio. Oh well,I hate PC but that's my opinion. It's a great game.
13 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
1 , 2 , 3 , 4  Next »   | 
Front Page | Welcome | Contact | Privacy Policy | Terms of Service | Advertise | Support BGG | Feeds RSS
Geekdo, BoardGameGeek, the Geekdo logo, and the BoardGameGeek logo are trademarks of BoardGameGeek, LLC.