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Legendary: A Marvel Deck Building Game» Forums » General

Subject: Question about the Co-Op nature of Legendary rss

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Aaron Amendola
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Illinois
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Hey there gamers!

My name is Aaron and I'm working on a show with my girlfriend called The Co-Operatives Podcast, where we play co-op games and discuss if they're good for co-op.

I'm a HUGE Marvel fan, and Legendary looks like it'd be right up my alley. I've been asking around to my usual board game friends and they don't seem to be able to offer up many answers on how well the co-op elements work in this game. Most of them point me towards Sentinels Of the Multiverse, but can't offer much insight for Legendary.

I'd like to cover Legendary for an upcoming episode of the show, but from looking at the current base/expansions for the game I am a little conflicted on exactly to buy.

What suggestions would you have to enjoy the game in co-op? Are there specific expansions that lend themselves to a co-operative nature? Are there more expansions that lean into competitive play more? Any help would be appreciated!
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Brian M
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From what I hear, avoid Villains.

Legendary is designed to be a competitive game; scoring points is very important to the game. If you aren't worrying about score, there are many schemes where there is little point to even fighting the villains.

However, it is quite possible to just ignore that aspect and play for fun anyway. That's how I'm usually playing these days.

A few characters have cards designed to attack other heroes, which are drastically less useful when actually playing co-op. Cards that rescue bystanders are also much less useful in co-op, but they were generally overpowered initially anyway, so not a big deal.

I don't think there's any specific sets that you should avoid or specifically get. You'll probably want tougher Masterminds than are in the base set for co-op play, but any of the expansions have those. Dark City is a great buy, as is Secret Wars I (Secret Wars 2 much less so!).

We've lately been playing with a house rule that any hero card effect that would "attack" another player permits your teammate to draw a card instead.
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Michael Edwards
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In my opinion, it really depends on how you choose to play it. If you want to focus more on the co-op aspects, then play it like a co-op game. Discuss your choices and plan ahead, be careful that the cards you recruit and battle don't step on your partners toes, and toss out the optional rule where you compare victory points at the end of the game.

As for the expansions, none really stand out as being more or less co-op-oriented. I highly recommend Dark City, but that's just because I'm a big fan of that expansion.
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Chris Gordy
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OK, first as it relates to the Co-Op experience of Marvel Legendary. It is a semi co-op, which means you are both fighting to defeat the mastermind, but then at the end of the game you add up your score to see who won. To be honest with you, when I play, we almost always just play to defeat the mastermind and ignore the individual scores.

As to what expansions, if any, you would want to include in your review, podcast discussions, I would likely start with base game and Dark City. Other expansion packs give you new mechanics, interesting characters, and new modes to play, but to get to the heart of the game I think you only need Dark City.
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Przemyslaw Kozlowski
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Certain setups of the game are more cooperative than others. The more difficult the scheme and Mastermind, the more players have to coordinate. Sometimes a player has to "take one for the team" so they game does not end in defeat.
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Ducko Kaiju
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The game is really simple; each player has their own deck, there's a main objective, and victory points. If you want to play purely co-op - you can just play without the victory points. The game encourages co-op play because everyone wins together or loses together. That being said, it's up to the individual player if they want to focus more on winning with the group - or winning for themselves.

You have different ways to play, or mentality when playing:

- Play to get the most victory points
- Play to defeat most villains
- Play to get the best heroes
- Play to defeat the Mastermind the most
- Play to help others
- Play to impede others
- Play to win as a team
- Play to sabotage

...and the list can go on and on.

Because this game is won as a group; it's Co-op nature usually wins out. Players will agree with each other what the best choice is; but in the end, it's always your choice.

TL;DR: The game is Co-op to the extent each player wants it to be. It depends what kind of "hero" you want to be.
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Aaron Amendola
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ducko wrote:
TL;DR: The game is Co-op to the extent each player wants it to be. It depends what kind of "hero" you want to be.


Given that we tend to ensure everyone has a good time, I think this tells me an awful lot. When we play we typically want to win as a team and when it comes down to winning individually it doesn't matter much to us.

This is *all* good data!

Thank you everyone for the input!
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Brian Baier
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I often think of the the "winner" aspect differently.

If you lose, then you all lose (except for a scenario or two that allow for one player to become the villain, essentially).

However, in terms of who has the most points, we usually consider them like an MVP. Or, in LotR terms, like the friendly competition between Legolas and Gimli.
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Steve Bird
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elucidarian wrote:
I often think of the the "winner" aspect differently.

If you lose, then you all lose (except for a scenario or two that allow for one player to become the villain, essentially).

However, in terms of who has the most points, we usually consider them like an MVP. Or, in LotR terms, like the friendly competition between Legolas and Gimli.

Exactly.
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Only a handful of times have I played a game where everyone counted the points in their victory piles. For the most part, the winner in that regard was clear---even more often, nobody cared.

Of course, I tend to put together particularly demanding scheme-and-mastermind setups.
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Ducko Kaiju
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As you progress in the game and play harder Masterminds and schemes; it really is more about how to win than who has the most victory point.

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Adam Steele
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Everyone here pretty much nailed it, but since you like to focus on the cooperative nature, here's a list of the characters I feel cooperate best with other players, along with their sets. Unfortunately, most of these characters only do it by their uncommons, or sometimes even just a notable rare.

Deck Manipulation: Black Cat (PtTR) & Gambit (base) both let you spy the top card of everyone's decks and discard them if you wish. This works well to bring them down or support them, however you wish to play.

Drawing: Hawkeye and Emma Frost (base) both allow other players to draw extra cards easily. Hawkeye needs to work a little harder, though.

Wounds: Luke Cage (Civil War) is especially useful in protecting players from wounds. While others may thrive on harming themselves or the table for power (and Luke can technically do that through Jessica Jones), Luke thrives more on reacting to opponents' wounds. Colossus (SWv2) and Captain America Steve (Base) & Cap. Falcon (CA75) also can prevent players from getting wounded.

Villain deck manipulation: Black Swan (SWv2) thrives on the Villain Deck much moreso than any other ally, but some do have limited uses off of it. Professor X (DC), Punisher (DC), Dr. Punisher (SWv2), and Speedball (CW) all can spy the top card of the Villain deck, so you'll at least have that next-turn knowledge. However, Punisher also can hinder other players, so keep that in mind.

Counterspell: Apocalyptic Kitty Pride's (SWv1) rare is insanely useful, cancelling out any Fight effect that anyone triggers, and drawing you 3 for it! Speedball also helps with his rare to cancel a Master Strike!

Honorable mention: Deadpool, base. Deadpool's rare is already powerful enough that you should probably be doing ok once it's pulled. If you ignore that it lets you gain a wound (conceivably so you can pass it competitively), players can take the opportunity to pass off allies the next player might be able to use more, kind of Pandemic-style.

Honorable mention: Sentinel Territories, Secret Wars v1. This villain group has a theme of helping yourself and the next player when you defeat them. Aside from Paibok the Power Skrull, this is pretty much the only time everyone will be strictly assisted.

Additionally, though many schemes will force you into co-op just by their challenge alone, some of them have a particular emphasis in co-operation. Forge the Infinity Gauntlet (GotG) really challenges you with temptation, since it is possible for just 1 player to win at the expense of everyone else. The Legacy Virus (base) is a classic risk-assessment scheme. Do you spread the tech around to protect everyone, or do you designate one player to be the target of all wounds? You can, of course, just cheese the scheme by specifically picking a lot of tech allies for your Hero Deck, but it's a bit more challenging when you somewhat randomize it. Massive Earthquake Generator (base) works on a similar concept that also encourages you defeating villains (since them escaping would cause KO's from the HQ). Save Humanity (DC) can fall into this trap if everyone goes for bystanders, or you can designate one player to be the "savior," minimizing the risk when twists hit. Of course, doing this risks you losing everyone in the HQ if it gets too filled by the time that player's turn hits. I'll give honorable mention to the Unbreakable Enigma Code (CA75), since cracking the code really does feel like a group effort more than most schemes, where you're more motivated to defeat villains just because you happen to have combat power and they have effects.

I wanted to make an "ultimate" co-op game with all this in mind, but really, a lot of it would end up balancing the difficulty overall. I'll leave that up to you.
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Adam Hostetler
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When we play, we play to win as a team. However, we still count the VP at the end to award to see who gets the MVP award. However, winning as a team still comes first.
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Paul H
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Legendary Encounters: An Alien Deck Building Game is the best cooperative version of Legendary. I hear good things about Firefly if you can see past the art (I haven't played it).
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Aaron Amendola
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Coming back here to say thanks. Everyone's input is great! We're recording an upcoming episode and I think we have a ton of stuff to consider now during our discussion.

 
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