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Subject: Corsair op in HRE rss

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Paiaso de Asalto
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Is the Corsair Op at HRE useless? You may only move to another sea frontier in the same location, and there is only one sea frontier located in the HRE.
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Phil Eklund
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Paiaso wrote:
Is the Corsair Op at HRE useless? You may only move to another sea frontier in the same location, and there is only one sea frontier located in the HRE.


The Prussian League Navy in the expansion is a "Holy Roman Empire" pirate with a Corsair Op (catholic). Also the Isfendiyarid dynasty card in the Byzantine Empire (expansion x12) has only one sea border. I am adding to the living rules the following change expanding the range of the Corsair Op:

F7. Corsair (Military Op).
Use this Op to move a Pirate Rook in a Sea Border of the card’s Location to another Sea Border in the card’s Location or an adjacent location along a Sea Border.
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Paiaso de Asalto
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phileklund wrote:
Paiaso wrote:
Is the Corsair Op at HRE useless? You may only move to another sea frontier in the same location, and there is only one sea frontier located in the HRE.


The Prussian League Navy in the expansion is a "Holy Roman Empire" pirate with a Corsair Op (catholic). I am adding to the living rules the following change expanding the range of the Corsair Op:

F7. Corsair (Military Op).
Use this Op to move a Pirate Rook in a Sea Border of the card’s Location to another Sea Border in the card’s Location or an adjacent location along a Sea Border.


That was the card indeed.
Thanks for the answer.
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Mark Gilbertson
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phileklund wrote:
Paiaso wrote:
Is the Corsair Op at HRE useless? You may only move to another sea frontier in the same location, and there is only one sea frontier located in the HRE.


The Prussian League Navy in the expansion is a "Holy Roman Empire" pirate with a Corsair Op (catholic). I am adding to the living rules the following change expanding the range of the Corsair Op:

F7. Corsair (Military Op).
Use this Op to move a Pirate Rook in a Sea Border of the card’s Location to another Sea Border in the card’s Location or an adjacent location along a Sea Border.


Thanks Phil!
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Bernhard Vierthaler
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So do I understand that right: With a corsair op located in Aragon I could now move a pirate from the border between Portugal and Aragon to the border between Portugal and England or even the Papal States and Ottoman?
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Roel van der Hoorn
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No, you can only move pirates from the Sea Border with the Holy Roman Empire. The "to" has changed, not the "from".
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Bernhard Vierthaler
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No, I mean if the pirate is located between Portugal and Aragon and I play a Corsair OP located in Aragon.
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Rich James
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Bernhard Vierthaler wrote:
So do I understand that right: With a corsair op located in Aragon I could now move a pirate from the border between Portugal and Aragon to the border between Portugal and England or even the Papal States and Ottoman?

That's how I read the revised rule.
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Roel van der Hoorn
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Bernhard Vierthaler wrote:
No, I mean if the pirate is located between Portugal and Aragon and I play a Corsair OP located in Aragon.

Ah, yes. Indeed.

(Reading is difficult)
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Phil Eklund
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arjisme wrote:
Bernhard Vierthaler wrote:
So do I understand that right: With a corsair op located in Aragon I could now move a pirate from the border between Portugal and Aragon to the border between Portugal and England or even the Papal States and Ottoman?

That's how I read the revised rule.
That is the intention.
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Bernhard Vierthaler
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Wow, that makes the pirates a lot more interesting as attack forces
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Rafał Kruczek
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phileklund wrote:
arjisme wrote:
Bernhard Vierthaler wrote:
So do I understand that right: With a corsair op located in Aragon I could now move a pirate from the border between Portugal and Aragon to the border between Portugal and England or even the Papal States and Ottoman?

That's how I read the revised rule.
That is the intention.


phileklund wrote:

F7. Corsair (Military Op).
Use this Op to move a Pirate Rook in a Sea Border of the card’s Location to another Sea Border in the card’s Location or an adjacent location along a Sea Border.


I don't understand how it can do in one step. Portugal - Aragon and Papal States are not adjacent.
So "adjacent" regarding location of Op location, NOT current corsair location?
Move from original correction example was If I understood correctly, from HRE-France border to France-England border which is one step.
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Christopher
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So you can move the pirates away, but you won't be able to get them back without another card?
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Rich James
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rafal100 wrote:
So adjacent" regarding location of Op location [...]?

Correct.
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German Mike
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phileklund wrote:
F7. Corsair (Military Op).
Use this Op to move a Pirate Rook in a Sea Border of the card’s Location to another Sea Border in the card’s Location or an adjacent location along a Sea Border.

So this is still confusing to me. An adjacent location could be a diagonal card, right? So does that mean that a corsair located on the Portugal-Aragon Sea Border can be moved to the France-England or even France-HRE Sea Border with one Corsair move?

I always thought the Corsair move was meant to move a Corsair by "one Sea Border in either direction".
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Rich James
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Phil would have to weigh in but surely it means adjacent via sea. So cards diagonally adjacent via land would make no sense. The intent of the rule change was to make corsair ops for locations like HRE, Mamluk and Byzantium actually useful.
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Phil Eklund
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The rule for where a pirate can move to is "...or an adjacent location along a Sea Border." Both Borders and Sea Borders are defined in the "Border" glossary definition: "The gap between two Map Cards. For instance, England has two Borders, one to the east and one to the south. A Sea Border is a special border that is crossed by an active or inactive Trade Route."

Accordingly, diagonal moves by pirates are not allowed, as they are not along a Sea Border.

If someone has a better wording for the intent, I will add it to the living rules.
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Bernhard Vierthaler
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falafel007 wrote:
So you can move the pirates away, but you won't be able to get them back without another card?


That´s how I read it - and I really like that. At the beginning I thought that the new rule would make pirates too strong. But as you lose control over the pirate if you move him away from your "activation location" they become a very interesting tool.
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Michael Wasserman
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I am wondering whether it would be clearer if reference were made to moving along a trade route. For example, "Use this action to move a Pirate Rook in the card's Location along a Trade Route across one Location to another Sea Border."

Another way to make clear the intent might be to remind the reader that a token on a border is considered to be in both bordering locations: "Use this action to move a Pirate Rook in the card's Location to another Sea Border in either of the token's current Locations."
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Massimiliano della Rovere
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phileklund wrote:
The rule for where a pirate can move to is "...or an adjacent location along a Sea Border." Both Borders and Sea Borders are defined in the "Border" glossary definition: "The gap between two Map Cards. For instance, England has two Borders, one to the east and one to the south. A Sea Border is a special border that is crossed by an active or inactive Trade Route."

Accordingly, diagonal moves by pirates are not allowed, as they are not along a Sea Border.

If someone has a better wording for the intent, I will add it to the living rules.


I think that adding an example would solve the problem. Something like this:
Quote:

Scenario: a black (Islamic) Pirate in the Ottoman-Papal States Sea Border and - for simplicity's sake - no other black Pirate on any Map Card.
Card: #91 Ottoman Navy, featuring the Ottoman Location and a black-Corsair Op
Movements allowed by the Corsair Op: the black Pirate can be moved into one of the following Sea Borders:
* other Sea Border of the card Location
** Ottoman-Hungary
** Ottoman-Mamluk
* (Sea Border of an) adjacent Location (i.e. Map Card) along a Sea Border
** Hungary-Byzantium
** Papal States-Aragon
.


I'm not a native English speaker, but I'd write the rule as:
Quote:
Use this Op to move a Pirate Rook in a Sea Border of the card’s Location to another Sea Border in the card’s Location or to any Sea Border of an adjacent Location (i.e. Map Card) sharing a Sea Border with the Location printed on the Card featuring the Corsair Op.
 
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arz man
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phileklund wrote:

If someone has a better wording for the intent, I will add it to the living rules.


Would something like the following work?

"Sail to any sea border reachable by crossing at most one adjacent card."

Or perhaps

"Move to any sea border reachable by sailing through at most one adjacent card."

It would include sea borders on the current location and all those one card away.


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