$60.00
$20.00
Recommend
1 
 Thumb up
 Hide
15 Posts

Mechs vs. Minions» Forums » Rules

Subject: Damage interrupting your Command Card or towing rss

Your Tags: Add tags
Popular Tags: [View All]
Jorgen Peddersen
Australia
Sydney
New South Wales
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
With my game arriving today, I have some doozies for the devs...

There are a few rare cases where you can take damage in the middle of a Command Card's resolution in your program. Said damage could cover the current Slot or possibly even exchange it with a different Slot. If the Command Card has not yet completed, is the remainder of the card cancelled or does it complete execution?

For example, you execute Blaze, but the movement places you on a Lava Pool. Before you can utilise the attack steps of Blaze, you must resolve damage from the Lava Pool. If that damage covers or shifts the position of Blaze, do you still then get to attack targets in the spaces to your left and right afterwards?

As a second question, what is the order of events when you are towing something and take damage? For example, you decide to use 2 spaces of movement to tow a Mech and your Mech moves onto a Lava Pool. Do you resolve the damage before or after moving the other Mech into your previous spot? I have to think the towed Mech moves first, as the alternative leads to possibility of towing-via-damage interrupting the original towing, which leads to insanity... Is my assumption correct?
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Prashant Saraswat
United States
Los Angeles
California
flag msg tools
designer
mbmbmb
Lava has two separate interactions with mechs. 1) Immediately halt your movement for that command slot and 2) Draw a damage card. So in the example you would not execute the rest of Blaze (if any movement remained). You would process the damage and then move on to the next command slot. If the damage you drew happened to move the Blaze into a following slot (say from a glitch card), you would execute the Blaze as normal from that slot.

For your second question, the towing would happen regardless of whether you took damage or not. Your movement would stop due to entering the lava which means the towed mech would end up in whatever spot you left before you entered the lava. You wouldn't be able to tow again using that same slot (if there was any remaining movement left), but could start towing again with the next command slot if you're able to.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
David desJardins
United States
Burlingame
California
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
catzpaw wrote:
Lava has two separate interactions with mechs. 1) Immediately halt your movement for that command slot and 2) Draw a damage card.


It's not so clear from the description that halting your movement means you don't inflict damage with Blaze. It just says that you stop moving, but the damage from Blaze is not moving.

If your last movement point of Blaze put you in the Lava Pool, so that you don't lose any movement, would the damage still be canceled?
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Prashant Saraswat
United States
Los Angeles
California
flag msg tools
designer
mbmbmb
If your last point of movement from a Blaze stack puts you in the lava, Blaze would still deal its damage as normal. The trigger to deal damage is that last step.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jorgen Peddersen
Australia
Sydney
New South Wales
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
OK, a few more queries....

catzpaw wrote:
Lava has two separate interactions with mechs. 1) Immediately halt your movement for that command slot and 2) Draw a damage card. So in the example you would not execute the rest of Blaze (if any movement remained).

catzpaw wrote:
If your last point of movement from a Blaze stack puts you in the lava, Blaze would still deal its damage as normal. The trigger to deal damage is that last step.


I can't figure out how these are consistent. In the first response, you are attributing the attack part of Blaze to be part of the movement as you say it is cancelled. In the second response, the movement happens before the attack, so you will enter the Lava Pool and take damage but why is the rest of the movement (the attack part) not cancelled then?

Or are you saying that you attack the spaces before you take the damage from the Lava Pool?

Taking both the above cases to be true, it seems that you might be saying the attack part goes off only when you fully perform the movement. I had assumed if your movement was stopped by other means, such as hitting the edge of the board, that you would still attack after losing the excess movement. Was this assumption incorrect?

catzpaw wrote:
For your second question, the towing would happen regardless of whether you took damage or not. Your movement would stop due to entering the lava which means the towed mech would end up in whatever spot you left before you entered the lava. You wouldn't be able to tow again using that same slot (if there was any remaining movement left), but could start towing again with the next command slot if you're able to.

So the towed Mech gets moved before you draw and resolve the Damage Card, right?
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Prashant Saraswat
United States
Los Angeles
California
flag msg tools
designer
mbmbmb
Had a whole post written up, only for it to be swallowed up by the merciless void of the interwebs. Here's my second stab at it:

The attack portion of Blaze triggers when you take the final step of movement as indicated on the card. If that final point of movement carries you into a lava pool, the attack portion still triggers because you took that last step - there was no more movement left in that slot for the lava pool to halt. Now if the lava halted you midway through the movement stack (say on the second step of a level 3 Blaze), you don't get the attack effect because you never actually reached that portion of the card effect. In the case of a wall or other solid object impeding your progress (like another mech or a closed gate), you're still actually moving (bumping up against the object multiple times), you're just not actually going anywhere. This is why cards like Auto Wrench will still trigger in such situations. A level 3 Blaze into a wall would play out like BUMP BUMP BUMP and then flames to either side.

For your second question - yes, the towed mech would move before you draw and resolve damage. If you're towing somebody from one lava pool to another, you'd still be able to move them at least one space every slot (assuming you meet the other requirements for towing).
4 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jorgen Peddersen
Australia
Sydney
New South Wales
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
OK, I think I get the full idea now, thanks!

Given that description, it has to be the case that you attack the spaces to your left and right before you draw and resolve the damage card. I'm still not exactly sure why that happens in that order, but it does make all the rulings consistent.

When you mentioned Auto Wrench working, are you saying it can be used when you would push a Mech but neither of you can actually move? I would have assumed that it didn't work in that situation, especially due to the fact you can't tow something when your path in front of you is blocked.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Antonio Tang
United States
Madison
Wisconsin
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
catzpaw wrote:
In the case of a wall or other solid object impeding your progress (like another mech or a closed gate), you're still actually moving (bumping up against the object multiple times), you're just not actually going anywhere. This is why cards like Auto Wrench will still trigger in such situations. A level 3 Blaze into a wall would play out like BUMP BUMP BUMP and then flames to either side.

I'm confused. Is movement still considered movement if the mech is not actually moving? If the attack portion only triggers if the mech is actually on the very last space as depicted on the diagram, then I don't see the attack portion triggering. I guess my question is whether effects happen only when everything is in its "correct" position as illustrated on the card.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Prashant Saraswat
United States
Los Angeles
California
flag msg tools
designer
mbmbmb
I just wanted to confer with the rest of the team before I dispensed any rulings on this one

1. Movement is still considered movement, even if the mech doesn't actually move anywhere. Example: You have a level 3 Blaze but are moving into a wall. You are still technically moving, however because you're bumping into the wall with every step you end up in the same spot. Similarly, you can use Omnistomp's lateral movement to stay in place if you are near a wall. This means that damage effects like Blaze will still trigger because you are still technically moving, as long as you satisfy the other conditions of the card.

2. I made a mistake on Auto Wrench - cards that trigger off of Pushing/Towing will only function when you actually push or tow something. Bumping into a mech that cannot move does not equal pushing it.

Hope that helps!
8 
 Thumb up
1.00
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jorgen Peddersen
Australia
Sydney
New South Wales
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
OK, I have one more additional question regarding this now that a question on Spiked Walls came up elsewhere (I was waiting to pounce, heh).

Chris has made it clear that you take only one damage per slot from Spiked Walls when you move into one, regardless of how many movement points you had left.

So... Blaze vs. Spiked Wall... If your Blaze movement is halted early by a Spiked Wall (e.g., Level 3 Blaze when you are facing the Spiked Wall), do you still get to attack, or not? I would normally assume it does, but that makes this situation totally inconsistent with how Lava Pool work so I am not 100% sure.

If the attack does get to go off with Spiked Walls, do you wait until after that to resolve the Damage card too?
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Tim
Australia
Canberra
ACT
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Was there ever a resolution to the spiked wall query..?
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jorgen Peddersen
Australia
Sydney
New South Wales
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Mossquito wrote:
Was there ever a resolution to the spiked wall query..?

I don't think so.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Des T.
Germany
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmb
I dimly remember someone stating it fires at the end of the movement, so given the explanations to how movement works and how Blaze fires, it should go off.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jorgen Peddersen
Australia
Sydney
New South Wales
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
I can certainly recall rulings for edges and massive boulders, but not for Spiked Walls. If it does work like you say, Des, then Spiked Walls indeed do have a different effect on Blaze than Lava Pools, and that doesn't make a whole lot of sense.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Des T.
Germany
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmb
We always interpreted lava interrupting the move as an end of movement, and had the blaze fire then. So it was consistent for us.

I know this isn't how Catzpaw says it's supposed to work, but lava is just handled so complicated and counter-intuitive. It's the only mechanic that interrupts the execution of a command card.

It also seems weird that the mech can freely turn and attack, without getting damage, while standing in the lava.

I'd prefer the lava ruling to be "After executing a command, draw one damage for each lava field your mech inhabited during execution of the command."

That'd be much clearer.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Front Page | Welcome | Contact | Privacy Policy | Terms of Service | Advertise | Support BGG | Feeds RSS
Geekdo, BoardGameGeek, the Geekdo logo, and the BoardGameGeek logo are trademarks of BoardGameGeek, LLC.