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Mechs vs. Minions» Forums » Rules

Subject: Advanced questions regarding cards found in the secret box... (spoilers) rss

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Jorgen Peddersen
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OK, so now my game has arrived, I've done some much awaited scouting of some of the new cards I had not yet seen to see if I can find any weird interactions, and there are a few:

1: Mech Magnet does damage to Mechs unless they move a certain number of spaces in the chosen direction. Can they choose to Move and not take damage when they are up against an obstacle that won't let them move the whole distance?

2: Electrostomp has you choose a random player and the boss moves adjacent to their Mech. Do you move the Boss along a path to get to the Mech or does it jump and simply land at the destination space? If jumping, what happens when another Mech is in one of the spots it wants to land in?

3: All Metal Boss Command Cards can deal 2 damage to certain Mechs. How do the damage blocking cards work with this? Specifically:
3a) Does Fuel Tank still block all damage if you blow it up, or only one. It does say 'a Damage Card' and the source of the other damage is still there, so there may be a difference to there being two attacking Minions.
3b) Skewer still blocks only 1 damage or does it now work for both?
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Seth Pinter
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1) We decided that if you can't move 2 spaces, then you take damage. It fits with the wording of the card, and makes the game a tiny bit harder which honestly doesn't hurt.

2) We jumped, and we haven't run into a situation where you would be forced to land on another mech, so we didn't contemplate it.

3a/b) I don't see why fuel tank and skewer wouldn't continue to work consistently. From what I've seen elsewhere in the forums it was intended that fuel tank is to block all damage at 1 instance of a damage calculation and skewer is to block 1 damage for the 1 minion on the card.
 
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Jonathan Maisonneuve
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1) You do not take damage if you move to a direction but in fact do not move because you are blocked.

2) It jumps. You move it to the closest available space.

3) a) Fuel Tank is supposed to block all damage from 1 source type.
b) Skewer block 1 damage.
 
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Jonas Vanschooren
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2) thought I read somewhere here that the boss just moves, stomping minions on the way.
 
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Jonathan Maisonneuve
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Spukky wrote:
2) thought I read somewhere here that the boss just moves, stomping minions on the way.


Would make it too easy to get a shit tons of minions just by going far away of the boss. But maybe.
 
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Jonas Vanschooren
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Wildhorn wrote:
Spukky wrote:
2) thought I read somewhere here that the boss just moves, stomping minions on the way.


Would make it too easy to get a shit tons of minions just by going far away of the boss. But maybe.

Maybe I'm mixing stuff up, could be that mechs just move when they must go to the boss.
 
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Jorgen Peddersen
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I think these ones are going to require official input to solve.

If Fuel Tank and Skewer work the same way with Boss damage as they do with Minion damage, then both cards require errata in my opinion.

Fuel Tank says it mitigates 'a damage card'. The only reason it currently makes sense to block all damage in a Minion attack is it destroys the other minions before they would deal the other damage. That is not the case with Double-damage from the Boss, unless the Boss is within range of the Fuel Tank, the Fire shield is down and he is on 1 Health.
 
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David desJardins
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Clipper wrote:
Fuel Tank says it mitigates 'a damage card'. The only reason it currently makes sense to block all damage in a Minion attack is it destroys the other minions before they would deal the other damage.


All of the damage from minions is simultaneous, that's a fundamental rule. The reason it blocks all damage from minions, rather than just 1 damage card, is because the design team said so.
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Jorgen Peddersen
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DaviddesJ wrote:
Clipper wrote:
Fuel Tank says it mitigates 'a damage card'. The only reason it currently makes sense to block all damage in a Minion attack is it destroys the other minions before they would deal the other damage.


All of the damage from minions is simultaneous, that's a fundamental rule. The reason it blocks all damage from minions, rather than just 1 damage card, is because the design team said so.

In which case, I want to know if the design team says the same thing about simultaneous Boss damage.

If they say it blocks both Boss damage, then the Fuel Tank card text is incorrect and requires errata.
 
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David desJardins
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Clipper wrote:
If they say it blocks both Boss damage, then the Fuel Tank card text is incorrect and requires errata.


The actual rules for the card are in the rulebook. The card is just a summary. The rules in the rulebook are:

If—and only if—you are about to take damage (from a Minion during Minion Phase, or the Boss during Danger Phase, or even from hazards like Lava Pools or Spike Walls), you may choose to immediately detonate your Fuel Tank.

• The damage that would have been caused is ignored!


This is ambiguous because it doesn't say exactly what damage it applies to.
 
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Stephen Kuch
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I haven't been 100% correct in my rules searching/interpretations, but figured I'd put in my 2 cents.

1. Mech Magnet - I came across this twice in my playing, and based on the wording, we decided you take the damage unless you move. Even if you attempt to move. We decided this because the wording on the card is different then the normal wording used in most other rules sections - therefore, you don't move, you take damage.

Also, thematically it may make sense that the boss activates a super-strong magnet, pulling the mechs in a specific direct that sends them flying. If they are next to something, they still feel the effects of the magnet crushing them against the edge of the board or against the boss or whatever (causing damage).

2. Electrostomp - We played that it jumped next to the appropriate mech. I would lean towards agreeing with the above post that it jumps to the nearest available spot, so if another mech was in a space that the boss would jump to, then find the closest spaces that don't have mechs in them.

3a. Edit: This response refers to the question of if a Fuel Tank detonated during the minion phase also blocks the boss attacks. I would definitely think that Fuel Tank does not block boss damage. Thematically, you detonate the fuel tank when minions are near to wipe them out, preventing those minions from damaging you. The boss attack is a separate phase altogether, and occurs after the Fuel Tank has already detonated.

3b. I would think skewer blocks one damage per minion. 1 skewer and 1 minion would block one damage.
 
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David desJardins
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Artrean wrote:
3a. I would definitely think that Fuel Tank does not block boss damage.


I just quoted the rule where it says that it does.
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Stephen Kuch
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DaviddesJ wrote:
Artrean wrote:
3a. I would definitely think that Fuel Tank does not block boss damage.


I just quoted the rule where it says that it does.


I re-read the original post, and I totally mis-understood the question at hand. I thought I was responding to the question "If I detonate my Fuel Tank to block damage from minions, does that fuel tank also block damage from the boss?" when really the question was "If I wait until the boss is executing his command line and he deals me two damage, can I use the Fuel Tank to ignore that damage?"

In light of my misunderstanding, I fully agree with David that the rules state that you can use it to block boss damage.
 
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Jorgen Peddersen
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I actually had no doubt it could be used to block Boss damage.

My question was simply whether the effect of Fuel Tank still blocks all simultaneous damage in that case.

If it does block both, it keeps the card consistent with all types of multiple damage, but it means the card definitely requires errata. If it only bocks one in non-Minion cases, then it doesn't require errata, but it is a little more confusing to resolve.

I strongly suspect that the answer is it still blocks both, but the devs have not weighed in on this particular case yet, so the question is worth asking.
 
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David desJardins
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Clipper wrote:
If it does block both, it keeps the card consistent with all types of multiple damage, but it means the card definitely requires errata.


No it doesn't.

The designers have said several times, the card blocks all damage inflicted at one specific occasion of your choice.

The text on the card is ambiguous, it could be interpreted either that way or some other way.
 
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Jorgen Peddersen
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The card says you discard the slot and make the attack 'instead of drawing a damage card'. That cannot be interpreted to mean multiple cards. There is no ambiguity. The card text is incorrect if it is meant to block multiple damage cards being drawn at the same time.

Fuel Tank text can handle the all Minion damage case as it is, as you can consider the drawing of cards for Minions to be done one at a time (and you still draw it all before you resolve any). The first card drawn would be ignored by Fuel Tank and the rest of the Minions destroyed before you draw for them. That does not work with the Boss case.

Every ruling I have seen from the devs on Fuel Tank has only been in the context of multiple Minion damage, so the question is worth asking.

 
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David desJardins
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Clipper wrote:
The card says you discard the slot and make the attack 'instead of drawing a damage card'. That cannot be interpreted to mean multiple cards.


You resolve it instead of drawing a damage card, but it still blocks all of the damage, not just that card.

Bizarrely, YOU gave the correct answer in the past. And now you're arguing against your own answer:

Re: Fuel Tank?
 
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Jorgen Peddersen
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At that stage, Minions were the only way I knew to get multiple damage at the same time.

I'm no longer 100% confident with my previous answer either. That's why I ask. I also push it to ensure that the card text gets fixed to make things clearer.
 
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