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Subject: Thematic background for foreign workers price rss

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Carsten Buettemeier
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Hi all,

can anyone give me a hint why a foreign worker is cheaper the more the financial status of Axia is going down?

Just wondering about the thematic background here..
 
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Mr Avers
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Have a look at this recent thread about foreign workers, with answer from the designer.
 
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Benji
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unittype wrote:
Hi all,

can anyone give me a hint why a foreign worker is cheaper the more the financial status of Axia is going down?

Just wondering about the thematic background here..


Don't hold your breath, there isn't one. If anything, it should be the other way around (importing workers when there is already higher unemployment should be punished (losing VPs), foreign workers should be harder to attract if wages are low). But it is a game-balancing mechanism.
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Benji
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GhundiPI wrote:


Well... yes, but the decreasing salaries and living standard would NOT attract foreign workers. The "explanation" does really not hold. It is still a great game.
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Carsten Buettemeier
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You guys are too fast, just found it myself (didn't see the topic when I strived briefly through the forums here..)

Thank you all!
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Pantelis Bouboulis
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Hi guys!

If you read my comment on the other thread you will see why it is perfectly reasonable (in economic terms) to have smaller salaries in troubled economies. So, it is not just a balancing mechanism, but it reflects reality too. In fact, such economies do attract foreign workers (from countries where the situation is worse). However, these workers have usually less skills than the local ones. This is why all foreign employees have a +1 modifier (the minimum).

Let me give you an example. You all know that Spain, Greece and Italy have troubles over the last few years, mainly with their dept sustainability. (Of course Greece is in a far worst state) However, each yeat several thousands of people from third world countries are coming to Greece to find better opportunities.

We didn't want to penalize further the hiring of foreign employees (e.g., subtracting VPs), as we didn't feel that doing so directly hearts the economy of Axia.
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Benji
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TurambarGR wrote:
Hi guys!
Let me give you an example. You all know that Spain, Greece and Italy have troubles over the last few years, mainly with their dept sustainability. (Of course Greece is in a far worst state) However, each yeat several thousands of people from third world countries are coming to Greece to find better opportunities.


Do you seriously think there are more of those because the greek economy is bad? You think there would be fewer if it was better? I don't.
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Joao Rodrigues
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Benji68 wrote:
TurambarGR wrote:
Hi guys!
Let me give you an example. You all know that Spain, Greece and Italy have troubles over the last few years, mainly with their dept sustainability. (Of course Greece is in a far worst state) However, each yeat several thousands of people from third world countries are coming to Greece to find better opportunities.


Do you seriously think there are more of those because the greek economy is bad? You think there would be fewer if it was better? I don't.

I don't think that this was his point. The way I see what he was trying to say is that Greece is definitelly paying less salary now than it was before when their economy was better, and that didn't drove off foreign workers. They are still coming, even though salaries are bad, because in their home country things are even worse.

I live in Brazil and I do relate with this game so, so much. Thematically I think it is awesome. I still have to get my copy though, but Tabletopia is satisfying my gaming needs for now.
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Benji
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Johnnymaxx wrote:
Benji68 wrote:
TurambarGR wrote:
Hi guys!
Let me give you an example. You all know that Spain, Greece and Italy have troubles over the last few years, mainly with their dept sustainability. (Of course Greece is in a far worst state) However, each yeat several thousands of people from third world countries are coming to Greece to find better opportunities.


Do you seriously think there are more of those because the greek economy is bad? You think there would be fewer if it was better? I don't.

I don't think that this was his point. The way I see what he was trying to say is that Greece is definitelly paying less salary now than it was before when their economy was better, and that didn't drove off foreign workers. They are still coming, even though salaries are bad, because in their home country things are even worse.

I live in Brazil and I do relate with this game so, so much. Thematically I think it is awesome. I still have to get my copy though, but Tabletopia is satisfying my gaming needs for now.


That is correct. But the game is saying that recruiting foreign workers into a bad economy is easier than recruiting them into a good economy, and this makes no sense. There are many reasons (e.g. geography) for greece having as many foreign workers as they do - the status of their actual state of the economy (compared to their own long term performance) is not one of them.

As i said, i really love the game too, and many aspects of it are extremely thematic - i just don't quite get why a certain game mechanism can't be aknowledged for what it is: a game mechanism.
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Thanasis Patsios
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Benji68 wrote:
But the game is saying that recruiting foreign workers into a bad economy is easier than recruiting them into a good economy, and this makes no sense.


Sometimes it does make sense. For example, a country with a bad economy will likely put a lot less resources in proper border checks. This will often result in a workforce that won't have the documents needed to work under standard conditions. These workers will be

- easier to recruit (they need the money to be able to make it in an new country)
- paid less (since they can't turn to the proper authorities for help)

I don't know if this is the situation the game is trying to portray, if this is the case though, it won't come as a surprise. The "inspiration sources" for the game seem to be troubled economies after 2010 and these are indeed hard times.
 
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Joao Rodrigues
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Benji68 wrote:
i just don't quite get why a certain game mechanism can't be aknowledged for what it is: a game mechanism.

I see your point, but I'm sorry, I just don't get this particular thing as a game mechanism. As I said, I really do think it makes sense that people will get less money in a more troubled economy.

To me, what is a clear game mechanism that goes away from the theme is the events cards. Green events are terrible, while red events are way better. We all know that in a Crisis situation, actually, when things are bad they get worst by the minute, but I do understand that, for gaming purposes, it would not be that great if we were in a real bad shape and then an event would smack us down even further.
 
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Benji
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Johnnymaxx wrote:
As I said, I really do think it makes sense that people will get less money in a more troubled economy.


But that is not what the game shows. The model it uses is that in a troubled economy (when unemployment is already high and wages are low), it becomes easier to import additional (to the already unemployed domestic ones) "low-qualified" foreign workers.

Anyway... contrary to what may seem to be the case here, it is really no big deal to me. I was just trying to answer a question ...


Johnnymaxx wrote:
To me, what is a clear game mechanism that goes away from the theme is the events cards. Green events are terrible, while red events are way better. We all know that in a Crisis situation, actually, when things are bad they get worst by the minute, but I do understand that, for gaming purposes, it would not be that great if we were in a real bad shape and then an event would smack us down even further.


Yes, BUT - in my opinion, there are really no "terrible" events. All the events seem rather tame, that is why i don't have a problem with them and accept them as a bit of an uncontrollable (and thematically justified) "chaotic" influence playing a really small part in the players decision making. In the end, much of it is just a matter of taste ...
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