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Subject: Making true reasons for shooting rss

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Pavel Kazlou
Belarus
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Shooting in Colt express seems dull for me.
If you forget about Gunslinger prize, shooting becomes basically "doing nothing".
Yes, you add those bullet cards to opponents decks, but:
- the closer you are to the end, the less effect it has, in last round it totally makes no sense
- with so many opponents around, I don't really care about spoiling one opponent's deck by 1/11 or even less, I just don't have time and better be doing something else

So the designers decided to balance shooting by introducing huge price for performing this useless action.
To me it seems like a hack and doesn't bring any fun, because it brings almost no interaction to the game. It is more like "ok, I can do nothing for one turn here, so I would play shooting, because I need to waste my bullets to compete for Gunslinger".

What I'm trying to come up with is making shooting one of the means to grab the loot and prevent it to be grabbed by others. Or at least shooting with some goal in mind, not just wasting bullets at some opponents around.

Do you have suggestions to house rule shooting? Or maybe I'm wrong with my perception of this action?

Thanks.
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Nick Case
England
Epsom
Surrey
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I love shooting other players. It screws with their deck and makes me laugh every time I plug someone. And then I get $1000 for emptying the gun, so how could I possibly not like or forget about that?

Perhaps Colt Express isn't the game for you?
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David "Davy" Ashleydale
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I like trying to figure out how to shoot the other players. It's not always easy. On the ground floor, there has to be someone exactly one car away. On the roof, it's easier, but there aren't always other people on the roof. And you have to balance all of this with the other things you need to do, and using whatever happens to be in your hand. It can be hard to use all of your bullets!

And you can't ignore that $1,000 prize -- it's common to lose if you don't get it.
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Benjamin Wack
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Did you try the expert variant ? If played properly, the bullets received in a round are guaranteed to hurt in the next, that's already a stronger case for shooting people.

But yeah, like Nick said, if you don't find shooting opponents fun, it's probably that Colt Express (nor any Western-themed game) isn't made for you.
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Artem Bakanov
Ukraine
Kharkiv
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As said above, just try to play an expert variant. In our games having 4 bullets and 2 action cards at the beginning of the round is pretty common.
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Pavel Kazlou
Belarus
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Thanks all for your replies.
Definitely will try expert variant.

Don't get me wrong I really enjoy Colt Express theme. Punching is my favorite action because I can really influence my opponents and make them lose loot.

It is just shooting doesn't seems powerful enough to me (in terms of mechanic, in terms of winning yeah, Gunslinger is really strong).
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David Forby
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I can think of many ways to make it important.

1. Instead of the Gunslinger bonus: Each bullet you take is a -$100 to your total for healing up.

2. You could make it, so many bullets makes for a dead Bandit, at the end of the game.

3. You could add to this, the ability to remove a bullet from your hand as a skipped card, as a way to get healin'.

4. In the advanced game, it really hurts the most BUT even as mentioned, the last hand a bullet doesn't matter. So you add on the last round, if you get hit by a bullet you need to drop your next card and go randomly from your draw deck. Never know what will happen to your carefully laid plan once panic setts in.

5. As you mentioned. Have shooting out the loot be an option. You shoot the loot rather than a person. But what may make more thematic sense is you can take a bullet for a last $ grab. You get the money but you pay for it. This adds to the -$100 per bullet easily.

6. You use the bullet but hitting is not assured. Roll a die, highest wins, you still shoot but the other bandit dodged. Not usable in tunnels. Gunslinger would still mean something. You could also make it 3 bandit bullets and you die and 5 Marshall wounds you die.

7. Everybody wants to shoot the Marshal when they first play. So, the Marshal can get hit and killed with 6 bullets. He can also be moved by bullets, you don't hit him but scare him back a space. This would also work if you have the Marshal moved to you and you can shoot him back. Recommend you change the gunslinger to the person that shot the most bandits and not simply emptying your gun as the Marshal absorbs some damage.

8. Have a special where you might get more money out of an empty car. You can shoot in the empty car to get a passenger to give up more money. Roll a Die for success and type of money.

9. Add more bullets to each bullet deck for a "reload" put no $ tokens down. You must shoot in a car (bandit, marshal or 'empty' to get the tough passengers to give up the loot. You collect one and another is dropped. (limit to what the car would have had)

Well, there is 9 possiblities for more bullet-y game.
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Pavel Kazlou
Belarus
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Thanks, David.
Nice suggestions.
I like the variant with losing $100 upon being shot, seems nasty enough.

Players will be able to gang upon leaders, so one will think twice before picking suitcase devil
 
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David Cheng
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My Gun shooting variant:

- Give a bullet card to the target. The target's next action card will be wasted.

- No shooting in tunnel turns.

- A bandit may consume a whiskey token to heal a wound any time during his action phase. Remove the whiskey token & a bullet card from his deck.

- At game end, each player adds all bullet cards he received to his action deck & shuffle it. Draw five cards from the deck. Deduct $300 for each bullet card drawn. If three or more bullet cards are drawn, the character is dead.

I think this makes gun shooting more tactical.
 
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David "Davy" Ashleydale
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Ultracheng wrote:
Give a bullet card to the target. If the target has not taken an action yet, he loses that action in this turn.


I'm not sure what you mean by this. Do you mean that during the Stealin' phase, when a player gets shot, their next Action card gets skipped? But what do you mean by "If the target has not taken an action yet..."? Do you mean only if they happen to get shot before their first Action card has been turned up?
 
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David Cheng
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Yes, I meant if you get shot, your next action card will be wasted.

So you need to shoot first if you want to stop someone from doing his next action.
 
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David "Davy" Ashleydale
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I'm not sure you're playing "turns" correctly. When the stack of Action cards is turned up and resolved, each player has several Action cards in it. So I don't know what you mean by "before your Action card is turned up". Which Action card? The first one? The next one after you get shot?
 
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David Cheng
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Initially, I meant the action card of same turn when the shooting is made. For example, player A plays his action card before player B. If player A shoots player B, player B will lose his next action. But If player B plays first, then a shot from player A will not cancel player B's action b/c the action was done before the shot.

Now I see it's not easy to track the turns, so I changed it to cancel the next action card instead.
 
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Morten E
Denmark
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I really like the idea of having an immediate effect of getting shot.
The no real consequence of getting shot in last round also annoys me.

Reading this thread I thought of this way to implement some of your cool ideas:

When shot the shooter draws the top card of his draw pile. The bandit hit is effected depending on that card. Then place it in discard pile:

Any move card: He falls. Lay his bandit on the side. On his next action raise him and cancel his chosen action. While laying he cannot be shot at unless through the roof by Tuco. He can be punched.

Punch: He is moved to the next car like the Django effect. But not in addition to Django's own knock back. If Tuco is shooting through the roof he falls. See above.

Sheriff: He is moved to the roof or if on the roof he moves inside the car.

Fire: He gun is jammed. Turn his next bullet card backside up. Turn it front side up on next fire action card in stead of shooting.

Robbery: He drops one treasure. Own choice.

Bullet card: No immediate effect.

The normal rule giving a bullet card to the bandit shot at still applies. Also when using the 'Expert Variant' which makes shooting first kind of important.

For Django I think apply his knock back first - or Django can always choose the drawn card to be treated like it's a 'punch' card knocking the shot bandit to the next car. Also a bullet card!

The 'gunslinger' bonus of 1000$ shall probably be reduced to half or cancelled when using this rule. Or replaced by the very cool 'bounty hunter' optional rule suggested in another thread.

The special effects of Tuco and Django is slightly enhanced and that of Belle slightly weakened. I think that benefits the balance in both cases.

Please provide feedback since I have not yet had the chance to test this.
 
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