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Subject: Mission 2 Minion Movement Order rss

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Amos Dillman
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Nowhere in the rulebook that I can find nor in the FAQ did I see anything about the priority order of minion movement in mission 2. MANY times we had minions sliding across the board and into each other, and no official way to know which minions were supposed to go first (since they got in each others' way).

We just ad hoc house ruled the same FAQ method from mission 1: minions closest to the school move first and when they are equally close, we decide the order. Maybe this was the intent (although not stated anywhere), but it was also rather inelegant. It was annoying to try and switch between map boards of minions to move them based on range. We ended up just moving them map board section by map board section most of the time and trying to catch movement priority issues when it mattered.

Is there an official ruling that I'm missing? Something simple like green --> blue --> yellow --> school board order? Or did we do it 'right'?
 
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Jason
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I think in the rules somewhere (can't remember if it's in the book or the mission) that you move the minions closest to the school first. After that, the order doesn't matter. Minions are going to block minions. It really doesn't matter if green blocked blue or blue blocked green. The effect is the same. One minion doesn't move.
 
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Dustin Shunta
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I don't think this is a huge issue, but it does matter.

When two minions collide at the middle tile with the school walking from orthogonal directions, you have to decide which one stays on the outer tile and that can have game impact because you may be able to kill one, but not the other.
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Stephen Kuch
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This happened twice in our game. We house ruled that we assign two colors to one minion, two to the other, and then rolled the rune dice to determine who moves first. Enough other things are decided by the rune dice that we figured this was an acceptable solution.
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Amos Dillman
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VaultBoy wrote:
I think in the rules somewhere


It isn't.

VaultBoy wrote:
It really doesn't matter if green blocked blue or blue blocked green. The effect is the same. One minion doesn't move.


It matters significantly. Because oil slicks are a thing and minions will be slip-sliding all over the place--clear from one map board to another across the whole board. Whichever minion goes first has a lasting impact on the overall flow of minions toward the school. Not all movement blocks are created equal.

Not having a clear rule is just silly. Obvious conflicts happened at least 5 different times in our game. Possibly more. And maybe more than we actually caught.
 
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Nathan Tiras
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Hey Amos, good question!

For clarity, in missions where minions have an objective where their movement is determined by them trying to achieve something rather than by rolling the rune die (think mission 1 compared to the tutorial) always move the minions closest to the objective first.

In the event of a tie, select one via the hand of fate (aka player choice) and then proceed with the rest of the movement for minions.

Minor spoilers!!!







This mission specifically has a bit more friction in terms of minion movement clarity due to minions coming from 3 directions simultaneously. Sorry we weren't able to more elegantly capture that intent in our rulebook and dossier, but hopefully this makes sense!
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Amos Dillman
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RiotFpMcgee wrote:
Hey Amos, good question!

For clarity, in missions where minions have an objective where their movement is determined by them trying to achieve something rather than by rolling the rune die (think mission 1 compared to the tutorial) always move the minions closest to the objective first.

In the event of a tie, choose one at random (you can roll the rune die, you can flip a coin, you can just select one via the hand of fate, whatever your team decides) and then proceed with the rest of the movement for minions.

Minor spoilers!!!

Spoiler (click to reveal)
This mission specifically has a bit more friction in terms of minion movement clarity due to minions coming from 3 directions simultaneously. Sorry we weren't able to more elegantly capture that intent in our rulebook and dossier, but hopefully this makes sense!


It makes sense, but I think it would be a lot *easier* of a rule to follow if movement was done map board by map board in mission 2. This is because it's not always easy to catch minion movement conflicts until after you're much too far gone (most players are probably moving them group by group), and it's very difficult / fiddly to rewind. But it does affect things.

I'm happy to know that we played correctly. But it definitely felt very loose and somehow not correct because of the many conflicts that came up.

Also, your rule here does conflict with the rule given in Mission 1. According to the FAQ for mission 1, minions that are equally close to the objective are decided by the first player which one goes first. Rolling a die to determine would be a new method that contradicts the FAQ for mission 1. I personally think there should be one clear ruling on what the "correct" method is in this case.

Edit: clarity.
 
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Nathan Tiras
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Ick, my bad. Default to player choice in the event of a tie. Sorry haven't had enough coffee yet.

Will edit my initial post!
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Peter Dringautzki
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amodman wrote:
It matters significantly. Because oil slicks are a thing and minions will be slip-sliding all over the place--clear from one map board to another across the whole board. Whichever minion goes first has a lasting impact on the overall flow of minions toward the school. Not all movement blocks are created equal.

Not having a clear rule is just silly. Obvious conflicts happened at least 5 different times in our game. Possibly more. And maybe more than we actually caught.


Oil Slicks let minions only move until the 1st space after the slick. If there is still a minion present he stops on the slick.
 
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Amos Dillman
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MeeplePeat wrote:
amodman wrote:
It matters significantly. Because oil slicks are a thing and minions will be slip-sliding all over the place--clear from one map board to another across the whole board. Whichever minion goes first has a lasting impact on the overall flow of minions toward the school. Not all movement blocks are created equal.

Not having a clear rule is just silly. Obvious conflicts happened at least 5 different times in our game. Possibly more. And maybe more than we actually caught.


Oil Slicks let minions only move until the 1st space after the slick. If there is still a minion present he stops on the slick.


I honestly don't know what you're trying to say here. Minions do, indeed, keep sliding across the board until they collide with another minion or an obstacle.

From the rules:

Quote:
When a mech, minion, or bomb moves onto an oil slick it keeps moving in the same direction until it collides with and obstacle (including other mechs or bombs) or the edge of the board. A mech or bomb will stomp minions along the way, but minions are blocked by other minions.
 
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Jorgen Peddersen
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The rules are in error. The Mission document has the complete Oil Slick rules:

Mission 1 Rules wrote:
When a Mech, Minion, or Bomb moves onto an Oil Slick, it keeps moving in the same direction
until it collides with a wall or obstacle (including other Mechs or Bombs), steps off the Oil Slick,
or reaches the edge of the Game Board.


This discrepancy came up early on and we have had official confirmation several times that things stop moving once they leave the Oil Slick.
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Bård Holst
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Artrean wrote:
This happened twice in our game. We house ruled that we assign two colors to one minion, two to the other, and then rolled the rune dice to determine who moves first. Enough other things are decided by the rune dice that we figured this was an acceptable solution.


Only twice! Happens to me almost every round after the first couple of rounds have passed. Especially after the first shard has been lifted (and usually dropped again soon thereafter), then every tile is literally packed with minions. I had all minions on the board in this mission as 2 whole rows were spawning each round and some moving twice as well.
I'm still baffled by the rumours that this mission has been won anybody. They must be only rumours and fables because if they aren't I'm amazed. I haven't even gotten close, and that's playing on easy.
 
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Jorgen Peddersen
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Nusferatu wrote:
I'm still baffled by the rumours that this mission has been won anybody. They must be only rumours and fables because if they aren't I'm amazed. I haven't even gotten close, and that's playing on easy.

You do spend the first few turns gearing up before trying to get the crystals right? Getting the first crystal isn't too bad, but the second and third are brutal accelerations, so you want to wait until you're set up to get them both with different Mechs on the same turn and then return to the school in the following turn if possible.

Ensuring those Mechs also have a Fuel Tank or another way to ensure they won't drop the crystal is a great idea too.
 
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Bård Holst
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Clipper wrote:
Nusferatu wrote:
I'm still baffled by the rumours that this mission has been won anybody. They must be only rumours and fables because if they aren't I'm amazed. I haven't even gotten close, and that's playing on easy.

You do spend the first few turns gearing up before trying to get the crystals right? Getting the first crystal isn't too bad, but the second and third are brutal accelerations, so you want to wait until you're set up to get them both with different Mechs on the same turn and then return to the school in the following turn if possible.

Ensuring those Mechs also have a Fuel Tank or another way to ensure they won't drop the crystal is a great idea too.


Yes, I spend a couple of rounds gearing up and might retrieve 1 shard before things go downhill. My downfall is always the minions coming onto the school from the sides towards it's broadest point. I'm never able to get all of them.
Not giving up just yet though....
 
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