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Subject: Leaders in tbe prologue (prologue spoilers) rss

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Edward Guida
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So we just finished our play though of the prologue and we got to the destroy all the leaders part, and I just stared at it thinking this can't be right, so I come here to ask.

From reading other threads I see we are meant to destroy the leaders, obviously, but what about the appellations they had on them? I just can't square it in my head that you give your guy an ability, that may be useless in the prologue, to then have the leader and that ability get permanently removed before even using it? The only thing I can think of is that we somehow jumped the gun on giving the leader an ability, because the alternative seems to essentially be pick 4 abilities to remove from the game before you even start.
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David desJardins
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burke4865 wrote:
The only thing I can think of is that we somehow jumped the gun on giving the leader an ability


I guess so. How did your leaders get appellations in the prologue?
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Larry Snyder
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DaviddesJ wrote:
burke4865 wrote:
The only thing I can think of is that we somehow jumped the gun on giving the leader an ability


I guess so. How did your leaders get appellations in the prologue?


I'm guessing you received the appellations by reading the entry on the back of the player board where it says - don't do this until you are told to. Maybe too you read the "before first game" card, but the prologue game wasn't meant to count as your first game.

If it's not too late, I would say don't destroy your leader cards and just carry them forward. Or remove the stickers & glue them to your new leader. You will quickly see in the first game where you went wrong when you are instructed to read the entries on the back of the player boards.


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Edward Guida
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LarDukeSnyder wrote:
DaviddesJ wrote:
burke4865 wrote:
The only thing I can think of is that we somehow jumped the gun on giving the leader an ability


I guess so. How did your leaders get appellations in the prologue?


I'm guessing you received the appellations by reading the entry on the back of the player board where it says - don't do this until you are told to. Maybe too you read the "before first game" card, but the prologue game wasn't meant to count as your first game.

If it's not too late, I would say don't destroy your leader cards and just carry them forward. Or remove the stickers & glue them to your new leader. You will quickly see in the first game where you went wrong when you are instructed to read the entries on the back of the player boards.



Thanks, I had a feeling that might have been the case.
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JR Honeycutt
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Yes, it looks like you read the backs of the province boards too early.

I recommend tearing up another leader, one for each player.
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Edward Guida
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jayahre wrote:
Yes, it looks like you read the backs of the province boards too early.

I recommend tearing up another leader, one for each player.

I am so going to add a "the III" to the end of my leader's name now.
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jayahre wrote:
I recommend tearing up another leader, one for each player.


As far as I know (eleven games, one unlock remaining) the unused province leaders...
Spoiler (click to reveal)
never become relevant
...so I don't think there's much point to this.

Anyway, I think the whole idea of tearing up the cards from the prologue is symptomatic of one of the game's biggest missed opportunities: failing to develop the province leaders as characters.
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Steven Sousa
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How are there any leader cards left over? The end of the prologue says to destroy all leader cards. We destroyed all ten of them. I imagined that there would be new leaders in a box that will be opened before game 1. If there aren't we're going to have to make up some new leader cards.
 
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Gamblin Mat Cauthon wrote:
The end of the prologue says to destroy all leader cards. We destroyed all ten of them.


Oh my gosh

We all just chose to ignore that instruction completely (half of us are roleplayers who had spent days planning out names for everything before the game arrived in the mail)

The cards aren't really essential though. The appellations and the few upgrades you can get (I think only one of us ever got one) can just be stuck on a blank 3x5 card, and the leaders aren't really used for anything else.
 
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David desJardins
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Hexprone wrote:
The appellations and the few upgrades you can get (I think only one of us ever got one) can just be stuck on a blank 3x5 card, and the leaders aren't really used for anything else.


How can you possibly know this? Have you finished the game?
 
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Dave Martin
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Gamblin Mat Cauthon wrote:
How are there any leader cards left over? The end of the prologue says to destroy all leader cards. We destroyed all ten of them. I imagined that there would be new leaders in a box that will be opened before game 1. If there aren't we're going to have to make up some new leader cards.


...You're just supposed to destroy the ones you were using.


Speaking of that it felt really odd when our one nation with a BLACK leader ended up with a an asian girl in charge because there's only the one black character in the whole set.

This game needed a few more options in terms of leader designs.
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DaviddesJ wrote:
How can you possibly know this? Have you finished the game?


Of course, you're right: the chance exists that after being nearly ignored for the whole campaign, our leaders get will a mention in the finale. It'll fall a bit flat by that point if so, as almost nothing's been done to establish them as personalities over the course of the game.

Which is odd, because in Pandemic Legacy -- in which any of the various roles could be included or left out of any game, and no one role was particularly tied to any player -- you'd have expected far less character development than in Seafall, in which one character belongs to each player throughout (barring the prologue) and represents them.

But Pandemic did a far better job in giving its characters game-relevant stories that developed as they went (Rosalind and Sgt. Celie were cousins, which helped them in working together but made Celie's eventual betrayal sting all the more).

It would have been quite easy to fit something like this into Seafall's existing mechanics - milestones could have given new appellations or relationships to the leaders, perhaps both positive and negative. But the designers just don't seem to have been interested, which I think was a big missed opportunity.

The one big thing that does happen (the end of the prologue) has so little real impact on the game that only the odd players who've provided story context of their own accord are really going to care at all.
 
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Steven Sousa
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Undrave wrote:
Gamblin Mat Cauthon wrote:
How are there any leader cards left over? The end of the prologue says to destroy all leader cards. We destroyed all ten of them. I imagined that there would be new leaders in a box that will be opened before game 1. If there aren't we're going to have to make up some new leader cards.


...You're just supposed to destroy the ones you were using.

But that's not what it says. It says "destroy all leader cards" not "destroy all leader cards except the ones you put in the storage box." It this is how ambiguous the rules are going to be, I'm very nervous about the rest of the campaign.
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Gamblin Mat Cauthon wrote:
It this is how ambiguous the rules are going to be, I'm very nervous about the rest of the campaign.


Unfortunately ... yeah. This is a problem.

I think what's going on here is that a "leader" is the leader of a province. The portrait cards you didn't pick aren't "leaders" -- they just could be had they been chosen.
 
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Dave Martin
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Gamblin Mat Cauthon wrote:
Undrave wrote:
Gamblin Mat Cauthon wrote:
How are there any leader cards left over? The end of the prologue says to destroy all leader cards. We destroyed all ten of them. I imagined that there would be new leaders in a box that will be opened before game 1. If there aren't we're going to have to make up some new leader cards.


...You're just supposed to destroy the ones you were using.

But that's not what it says. It says "destroy all leader cards" not "destroy all leader cards except the ones you put in the storage box." It this is how ambiguous the rules are going to be, I'm very nervous about the rest of the campaign.


It also tells you to pick up a NEW leader card from the unusued one in the storage chest.

Don't start doing stuff until you've read the ENTIRETY of the instructions.

And yeah some stuff is a bit ambiguous...But not that one!
 
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j n
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Undrave wrote:

It also tells you to pick up a NEW leader card from the unusued one in the storage chest.


That instruction doesn't come in the same entry.
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Steven Sousa
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lactamaeon wrote:
Undrave wrote:

It also tells you to pick up a NEW leader card from the unusued one in the storage chest.


That instruction doesn't come in the same entry.
Correct. The Entry after the prologue says to destroy the leaders. Then the entry you read before game 1 says to pick a new leader. We didn't play game 1 immediately after playing the prologue.
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Dave Martin
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lactamaeon wrote:
Undrave wrote:

It also tells you to pick up a NEW leader card from the unusued one in the storage chest.


That instruction doesn't come in the same entry.


Oh. My bad then. I wasn't the one to actually read the book outloud when we did that.
 
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